Venture-Captain, Massachusetts—Central & West
|
They cannot, because they need to have the Wild Shape class feature. A Kitsune Druid could qualify for it, but would not be able to use it to cast in its fox form because it's not Wild Shape. Here's why, bolding mine.
Prerequisites: Wis 13, wild shape class feature.
Benefit: You can complete the verbal and somatic components of spells while using wild shape. You substitute various noises and gestures for the normal verbal and somatic components of a spell.
You can also use any material components or focuses you possess, even if such items are melded within your current form. This feat does not permit the use of magic items while you are in a form that could not ordinarily use them, and you do not gain the ability to speak while using wild shape.
However, Kitsune in Pathfinder (as opposed to some traditional real-world lore) are humanoid in nature, have hands, can speak languages, and can thus cast spells with verbal and somatic components without Natural Spell.
EDIT: Did I just ninja the ninja?
Kitsune are humanoid and don't need the Natural Spell feat...unless you're a kitsune druid and want to be able to cast in wild shape.
RPG Superstar 2010 Top 16, Contributor
|
ok is it just me, or does that seem a little silly. Is there an equivalent feat out there for shape changers of a different name? I sort of disbelieve that no shifter out there has ever figured this out if a druid can. Like how about a natural born lycanthrope, they have to shift to human to cast even though they were born wolf enabled? I guess i am asking if there has been an official ruling for this out there, because i doubt there has. Kitsune are newish and i am betting i am among the first to ask this question. Especially since i could find no published answer anywhere.
I like feats that are less specific to individual class as well and have a few use cases where it would be nice if someone other than a druid were able to cast while shifted (dark tapestry oracle is my biggie).
For PFS anyhow, it's druids only.
no its not fox shape, Kitsune do that already. Its a race boon i won
Right but that race can cast in their normal form. It's an anthropomorphic fox. Not just a fox.
Unless you use the Fox shape feat.
Nope, currently no way to cast in Fox shape.
In a home game most GMs would just let natural spell fly. But not for PFS.
|
Venture-Captain, Massachusetts—Central & West
|
Just looked it up, and you cannot. Fox Shape acts as the Beast Shape II spell. That spell is a Polymorph. Here is the relevant text from the Polymorph subschool:
When you cast a polymorph spell that changes you into a creature of the animal, dragon, elemental, magical beast, plant, or vermin type, all of your gear melds into your body. Items that provide constant bonuses and do not need to be activated continue to function while melded in this way (with the exception of armor and shield bonuses, which cease to function). Items that require activation cannot be used while you maintain that form. While in such a form, you cannot cast any spells that require material components (unless you have the Eschew Materials or Natural Spell feat), and can only cast spells with somatic or verbal components if the form you choose has the capability to make such movements or speak, such as a dragon. Other polymorph spells might be subject to this restriction as well, if they change you into a form that is unlike your original form (subject to GM discretion). If your new form does not cause your equipment to meld into your form, the equipment resizes to match your new size.
So since foxes cannot normally speak or perform somatic components, they would not be able to cast spells. Since gear gets melded into the shape, you wouldn't have access to any spell components if they were needed. Even if you did take Natural Spell feat, you couldn't use it in the Fox Shape form, because Natural Spell only applies specifically to spells used in Wild Shape, as highlighted in the comment I made at top of the thread.
As Thefurmonger said, some GMs would in allow it in a home game, but PFS sticks to rules as written as much as possible.
|
I'm not sure how this
Kitsune are humanoid and don't need the Natural Spell feat...unless you're a kitsune druid and want to be able to cast in wild shape.Equates to that
If you look up you'll see that Liz (from Paizo) responded that you cannot cast in fox shape, even with natural spell.
Liz never mentioned Fox Shape, but you cannot cast in Fox Shape regardless due to what David outlined above.
However, I'd like to note that a Kitsune Oracle with the deaf curse could cast in fox form with Eschew Materials, as the deaf curse removes any verbal components, and foxs can make somatic gestures, right?
|
|
I'm not sure how thisKitsune are humanoid and don't need the Natural Spell feat...unless you're a kitsune druid and want to be able to cast in wild shape.Equates to thatIf you look up you'll see that Liz (from Paizo) responded that you cannot cast in fox shape, even with natural spell.Liz never mentioned Fox Shape, but you cannot cast in Fox Shape regardless due to what David outlined above.
However, I'd like to note that a Kitsune Oracle with the deaf curse could cast in fox form with Eschew Materials, as the deaf curse removes any verbal components, and foxs can make somatic gestures, right?
First off, it makes sense if you misread what Liz wrote and combine it with others pointing out that you cannot.
Secondly, isn't this a rules question now?
Venture-Lieutenant, Finland—Turku
|
The thread is 6 years old.
Though, There's the Ring of Eloquence from advanced class guide which allows you to cast speak (and thus cast verbal spells) in fox form. You can combine that with the Grasping Tail and Mishcievous tail feats (requires 15 dex, from the Planar Adventures) to count your tail as a free hand, which allows somatic spells too.
There's also Psychic Bloodline for sorcerers which turns your spells into psychic spells, replacing somatic and verbal components with thought and emotion components - pretty perfect for a kitsune.
There are some other archetypes too that cast psychic spells, and all the psychic classes are pretty good on a kitsune too.