Error on someone else's build?


Pathfinder Society


I was browsing /r/pathfinder on reddit and I came across this page:

http://www.reddit.com/r/Pathfinder/comments/18fxq0/two_unrelated_questions_ one_about_gearing_an/

The poster on that page says that he just hit level 2 and already has a MW Mithral Chain Shirt (1250 gp), a MW Greatsword (320 gp), a 3+ Str rating MW Longbow (paid with PP), and 2250 gold. This totals to around 3600 gp (discounting the cost of the bow). How is it possible to have that much gold after only 3 level 1 sessions?

Sovereign Court 4/5

By playing up, I reckon. Just looking at my first three (non-First-Steps) games, playing up would have netted me over 4k. Indeed, I did play up in one of them and was saddened that the gold for playing down as so low... Ah well, such is the life of a Pathfinder.

Silver Crusade 1/5 *

Yep. I played up in 1 of my 4 sessions so far and netted 1600g compared to the 500g I got from each of the other 3.


How exactly does one play up? I know what it means I'm just wondering what leads to it occurring? Also, can you reasonably succeed with a level 1 or do you need higher level companions?

Liberty's Edge 5/5

He played up in every scenario at 4-5.

Sovereign Court 4/5

Scenarios are sorted by tier, and further broken into sub-tiers, so a 1-5 could be 1-2 and 4-5. If a level 1 character is at a table full of lvl 4 and 5 characters, they play up since they're a stronger party.

Rule of thumb is to protect the lvl 1 as if they were a squishy, because even a fighter wouldn't have enough hit points to stand up against most of the BBEGs at the end. Ranged characters tend to do better since they're out of the way. But then, your experiences may be different.

Liberty's Edge 5/5

In seasons Zero through Three, you need to have an average party level of at least 1.5 to play up to 4-5.

If you have six players, three at 2nd level, and three at 1st level, you’d have an APL of 1.5, then add +1 for 6 players, for a 2.5. Round up to 3, and you could legally play a 4-5. Highly not recommended. But you could.

In Season 4, you need to have an APL of 2.5 normally. Which means you’d need to have three 3rd level and three 2nd level to make APL 2.5, round up to 3, then you could play 4-5. Very highly not recommended. But you could if you wanted.

So as long as the mix of levels of each character added together and divided by the total number of characters made for an Average Party Level (APL) of at least 3, then they could play up to subtier 4-5.

Dark Archive 4/5

Even if he played up he doesn't have enough fame to buy the more expensive items yet.

Sczarni 5/5 5/55/5 ***

Playing up has its risks and rewards. During just my last game we played up, and a character died. He didn't have enough gold or prestige to come back, either. AND he had driven an hour and a half just to get there. We all felt kinda bad.

I comforted myself by purchasing a cloak of resistance +2.

Liberty's Edge 5/5

ZomB wrote:
Even if he played up he doesn't have enough fame to buy the more expensive items yet.

He doesn't need Fame for the items listed above. All the items listed above are always available items.

Grand Lodge 4/5

ZomB wrote:
Even if he played up he doesn't have enough fame to buy the more expensive items yet.

None of the items listed require Fame for access as none of them are magical.

Edit: Ninja'd by AC!

Sczarni 5/5 5/55/5 ***

I totally thought, by reading the title, that the OP was wondering what to do if/when you notice someone's character is illegal.


Is it discouraged to try to play up? I was planning on playing a zen archer which wouldn't be taking a lot of hits.

Grand Lodge 4/5

jmclaus wrote:
Is it discouraged to try to play up? I was planning on playing a zen archer which wouldn't be taking a lot of hits.

With greater risks come greater rewards. The converse is also true.

5/5 *

Just to add this bit: playing up or down is usually a table-wide decision. Even if you want to play up your tablemates may not. The converse may also be true, finding yourself not wanting to play up and everyone else wanting to. It's not frowned upon either way. Like John said, grater risk is greater reward. Just make sure you know that dying once costs more (5,000+ plus restorations) than the gold you get playing up.

The Exchange 4/5

it's not that hard, a lot of early seasons have tier 1-7's, which have a 3-4 subtier, a first level character can generally survive by playing safe in a party of level 3 or 4 PCs. subtier 3-4 generally awards 1200ish gold per session.

Lantern Lodge 1/5

Jonathan Cary wrote:
With greater risks come greater rewards. The converse is also true.

I wouldn't trust this guy. He brings 7-Int barbarians to embassy parties.

Paizo Employee 3/5 5/5

It's also his first PFS character. And he would presumably have already had all the gear after the 2nd scenario as I doubt he bought anything after the 3rd since he wants to retool.

Dark Archive 2/5

He also overpaid for the Mithral Chain shirt. It should be 1100gp, not 1250 since mithral is already considered masterwork.

Shadow Lodge 4/5 **** Venture-Captain, Michigan—Mt. Pleasant

Nebten wrote:
He also overpaid for the Mithral Chain shirt. It should be 1100gp, not 1250 since mithral is already considered masterwork.

:D I was going to post the same thing.

RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

Playing up is more common with large parties, not just because the maths works out that way but also because the scenarios become less challenging and playing up means the BBEG is still around when it gets to the 7th character's turn (after the first six and their animal companions, eidolons and familiars have all acted). That may not be true in season 4, but in season 0-3 it was.

The more a character plays up the richer they get for their level and the more they need to play up to be challenged, so it's kind of a self-fulfilling requirement. The one thing that brings them down to earth is when the written tactics at tier 6-7 are to hit the party with an empowered 9th level fireball in the surprise round. That will correct the wealth discrepancy for any 3rd and 4th level characters playing up! :-)


Nebten wrote:
He also overpaid for the Mithral Chain shirt. It should be 1100gp, not 1250 since mithral is already considered masterwork.

Maybe he paid more to make it fancy!

-j


Having a level one at the table at a Tier 4-5 is not a good thing, at all. They are a liability.

Silver Crusade 4/5

Off in the Shower wrote:

Having a level one at the table at a Tier 4-5 is not a good thing, at all. They are a liability.

If they're an archer or can use a wand of cure light wounds, then they can be helpful in battle. And depending on their skills, they could be helpful out of combat.

But I definitely wouldn't want to play up with a front line fighter of any type.

The Exchange 4/5

They aren't always a liability, they will just be bored. If it's a season 0-3 scenario and they are the 5th person they are simply a benefit so long as they are aware of the dangers and stay in back.

I played with a first level wizard in a 4-5 once, I handed him my wand of Magic missile and my wand of infernal healing. Then I told him to get missiling. He stayed way back and made much monies.


It's certainly possible to have a frontliner playing way up and still be effective.

But you'd likely need to be hyper optimised to do it regularly, and have as a player a good grasp of rules and tactics. There would be pretty much zero leeway for mistakes or strings of bad luck.

-j

Silver Crusade 1/5 *

Off in the Shower wrote:

Having a level one at the table at a Tier 4-5 is not a good thing, at all. They are a liability.

I was a level 1 ninja and played in the 4-5 tier of Murder on the Throaty mermaid.

I got close to dying once, but I just stayed at range and used my bow until the very last fight when I charged in and attacked the NPC who ended up being one of our 2 BBEGs.

And that was at a table with only 5 characters and one of the others was a level 1 sorcerer.

Sovereign Court 4/5 5/5 ** RPG Superstar 2014 Top 32

I've played up to 4-5 a couple of times with my (now level 2) gunslinger, and he was fairly effective.


Some 'alternate' fighting tactics rely a lot less on BAB and other numbers as well.

I recall my monk taking out a much higher level caster out with a grapple, for instance. Wizards tend not to have great defenses against that.

-k

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