|
I was looking at the new version of heirloom weapon that came out last year.
You carry a non-masterwork simple or martial weapon that has been passed down from generation to generation in your family (pay the standard gp cost for the weapon). When you select this trait, choose one of the following benefits:
proficiency with that specif ic weapon,
a +1 trait bonus on attacks of opportunity with that specific weapon,
a +2 trait bonus on one kind of combat maneuver when using that specific weapon.”
make an elf (so that curved blade is martial for you)
chose the heirloom weapon trait and take an Curved blade with +2 to sunder
you now have a
finessable d10 18x2 with +2 to CMB/D Sunder.
there is no greater weapon in the history of the game.
I don't follow. What's so great? What might not be allowed?
My group still uses the pre-errata one. Troll that if you can :P
I have my own version. Just remove the Simple or Martial part of the new version.
It makes total since that an Elf would get an ELVEN weapon as a family heirloom. It looks like it would work to me in both RAW and RAI.
| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
The problem is you have people b**** about it technically being an Exotic Weapon.
There's no "technically" about it. If you have weapon familiarity, then it is treated as a martial weapon. Not treated as a martial weapon just for proficiency. Not just for feats. Or class abilities. For everything.
EDIT: It's probably safe to say you could still treat it as an exotic weapon if that were more beneficial to you.
There's no "technically" about it. If you have weapon familiarity, then it is treated as a martial weapon. Not treated as a martial weapon just for proficiency. Not just for feats. Or class abilities. For everything.
EDIT: It's probably safe to say you could still treat it as an exotic weapon if that were more beneficial to you.
I am just saying what a lot of people argue. It is one reason why I removed the Weapon Restriction on the Trait in my games.
I also like how having it open allows a Aldori Swordlord to get a Dueling Sword that he is Proficient with to apply Weapon Finesse with.
With Heirloom Weapon and Masterwork Teansformation you can be well off.
|
There's no "technically" about it. If you have weapon familiarity, then it is treated as a martial weapon. Not treated as a martial weapon just for proficiency. Not just for feats. Or class abilities. For everything.
EDIT: It's probably safe to say you could still treat it as an exotic weapon if that were more beneficial to you.
I could make a case either way.
I don't think it would unbalance an elf to let him choose curve blade with this trait.
The reason the trait was errata'd to limit it to a simple or martial weapon is this: a trait is intended to be worth half a feat. Allowing the trait to be used to choose an exotic weapon allowed a trait to simulate a full feat; EWP. Further, the trait gave you other advantages as well (+1to attack, free mwk weapon) making it WAY better than a full feat, let alone half a feat!
That said, allowing an elf to choose Elven curve blade (with the errata'd version) does not make it a full feat worth, as that PC is not gaining any proficiency he didn't already have.
If you convince your DM of this, the drawback is suffering the disapproval of those who read the trait in a strictly RAW way.
I knew what you meant Fayth.
OH! OH!
I wanna be human with elf trait AND heirloom weapon trait to mek me more awesome.
I will be the MOST POWERFULL HUMAN IN THE WORLD with me uber elf sword.
How do you plan on getting weapon familiarity?
I knew what you meant Fayth.
How do you plan on getting weapon familiarity?OH! OH!
I wanna be human with elf trait AND heirloom weapon trait to mek me more awesome.
I will be the MOST POWERFULL HUMAN IN THE WORLD with me uber elf sword.
Alternate racial trait for Humans in the ARG:
Adoptive Parentage Humans are sometimes orphaned and adopted by other races. Choose one humanoid race without the human subtype. You start play with that race's languages and gain that race's weapon familiarity racial trait (if any). If the race does not have weapon familiarity, you gain either Skill Focus or Weapon Focus as a bonus feat that is appropriate for that race instead. This racial trait replaces the bonus feat trait.
Yeah, this isn't all that impressive. Unless you want to Finesse it (and, uh, why are you bothering to Finesse a two-hander?), an Elven Curve Blade is inferior in every way to a No-Dachi, which is already Martial.
|
|
I knew what you meant Fayth.
How do you plan on getting weapon familiarity?OH! OH!
I wanna be human with elf trait AND heirloom weapon trait to mek me more awesome.
I will be the MOST POWERFULL HUMAN IN THE WORLD with me uber elf sword.
I tek Adoptive Parentage trait.
elf daddy raised me on accounta Im so cute. plus, raise a human much less responsibly, ja?
Elf daddy gimme curved blade heirloom weapon cuz I gotta smart mouth an always fightin'
Shol Khan become bestest swordy in da world.
*Looking at Shol Khan*
Good lord, your grammar is terrible.
Were you raised by orcs or even dumber creatures?
*Looking at Shol Khan*
Good lord, your grammar is terrible.
Were you raised by orcs or even dumber creatures?
Love this...
|
|
Elf daddy teach me elf spek.
common not so good. I learn dat from da orc side.
another benefit of a cute human like me in elf town is I can be diplomat 'tween elf and orc. you know... neutral party, Elf daddy say human good at diplomacy.
Love this...*Looking at Shol Khan*
Good lord, your grammar is terrible.
Were you raised by orcs or even dumber creatures?
She's a character who's fun to RP as long as I don't go overboard with her haughty and arrogant attitude :3
She's a character who's fun to RP as long as I don't go overboard with her haughty and arrogant attitude :3Love this...*Looking at Shol Khan*
Good lord, your grammar is terrible.
Were you raised by orcs or even dumber creatures?
I bet...
Yeah, that's pretty awesome until all your friends are getting magic swords and your heirloom thingy can't be enchanted because it's not masterwork.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Masterwork Transformation.
Always felt weird to me that a weapon treated as an heirloom isn't ever already masterworked.
"Take this, our family blade! Passed down from generation to generation for near a millennia. What's that you say? Shoddy craftsmanship? Well yes, but don't let that distract from the sentimental value! Also, that glass bauble looks remarkably like a diamond, don't you think?"
I think the Heirloom Weapon errata was less about "fix something that was broken" and more of "break something that was just fine".
And by break I meant shatter into such tiny and pathetic pieces that it's unusable not because it's too strong, but because it's too weak.
You know, like a certain class that specializes in fast movement and unarmed strikes yet has next to no ability synergy and other problems?
|
|
if heirloom weapon is masterwork its like a trait that gives you 300 gold plus the other abilities.
another reason it was overpowered as MS mentioned.
but it is silly that the weapon that your basically stuck with is not even masterwork.
I think that as a trait they could have gotten away with just making the heirloom weapon trait give you a masterwork weapon of your choice then they could get rid of the rich parents trait and all would be well.
Lucky for me Im a sword masta. that mek me sword always do masta-work.
and yet Rich Parents trait nets 900 GP.
I actually Like Rich Parents.
Especially since I play Martial Characters.
I say let Heirloom Weapon give you Proficiency in that specific weapon and let you buy a Masterwork Version of that weapon at the Crafting cost.
Masterwork Transformation.
Wouldn't that nullify the trait?
Nope. It just states when you get it that it isn't Masterwork.
damn Azaelas... you post that just as I was editing.
get rid of rich parents its too much anyway.
Sure, a non-permanent bonus like extra start money is overpowered as hell. /sarcasm
If you honestly think that, I'm not surprised that you think the old Heirloom Weapon is overpowered and such.
damn Azaelas... you post that just as I was editing.
get rid of rich parents its too much anyway.
Sure, a non-permanent bonus like extra start money is overpowered as hell. /sarcasm
If you honestly think that, I'm not surprised that you think the old Heirloom Weapon is overpowered and such.
I wasn't saying it was OP'd I was just saying that compared to Rich Parents Heirloom Weapon is pretty mild.
I think neither pre-errata Heirloom Weapon nor Rich Parents is too powerful, and I've allowed both as DM.
Actually, Rich Parents is terrible in the long run and I don't even need to explain why. At least I hope I don't.
|
|
Old Heirloom weapon was overpowered because it was a TRAIT (by definition representing 1/2 a feat) that gave you 300 gold in weapon upgrade
AND weapon proficiency which in practice was always a weapon you couldn't already use so essentially a free feat. And on top of that an aditional +1 to hit.
in other words you started at level 1 with 300 free gold, a feat and +2 to hit.
the only limitation of the trait was that you were limited to one specific weapon but thats not a huge drawback as you can just pay to upgrade your weapon.
I am not saying it broke the game... but you have to admit it was way more powerful than traits were intended and was pretty much never used except to gain free first level access to a weapon you otherwise not purchase or weild effectively.
to be honest mechanically speaking current version is not horrible, you still get a free feat if you want and turning mundane to masterwork is super easy.
How would YOU balance the trait ICY? remembering that taits are supposed to be half a feat.
I agree it is terrible. It is just compared to starting with Standard Gold it is pretty good if you have a slow gold gain. Like some APs.
Heirloom Weapon still requires you to buy the item.
But Heirloom Weapon gives you the chance to get access to a weapon you normally wouldn't. Like a Bastard Sword wielding Magus.
Weapon proficiency costing a feat is stupid, so I don't need to adjust the old Heirloom Weapon.
It is completely balanced (some traits are worse), while the Weapon Proficiency feats are underpowered.
I normally use Weapon Group Proficiency Feats instead.
It really adds options.
|
|
I agree it is terrible. It is just compared to starting with Standard Gold it is pretty good if you have a slow gold gain. Like some APs.
Heirloom Weapon still requires you to buy the item.
But Heirloom Weapon gives you the chance to get access to a weapon you normally wouldn't. Like a Bastard Sword wielding Magus.
As an exotic weapon, bastard sword is not a valid choice for the post-errata trait.
Or were you talking about the elf with the kindly DM?
What would people say if I told them in my home game there's a half-elf ranger with Str 10, Weapon Finesse and Power Attack using an Elven Curved Sword two-handed?
