|
Is this a home game? Or PFS?
Bc if its a home game ask your GM to let you combine White-Haired Witch with Scarred Witch Doctor. Its exactly what you are looking to do. (Don't think you can combine the two otherwise and I'm too lazy to check at this moment =b)
Edit: Scar Shield prevents you from doing this in PFS, but in a home game I don't see why a GM wouldn't allow you to combine those two archtypes. Its actually a REALLY cool combo if your GM is cool with it.
I apologize in advance if this opens up a can of worms...
I seem to see the Scarred Witch Doctor archetype come up a lot in discussions. Are all of your playing Orcs? Half-Orcs? Or this like a racial Heritage thing that allows you to take the archetype as a Human or Half-Orc, etc?
Half Orc should qualify. They have the Orc subtype and their racial entry says they count as Orcs for any effect related to race.
Or am i confused?
RPG Superstar 2014 Top 16
|
Half Orc should qualify. They have the Orc subtype and their racial entry says they count as Orcs for any effect related to race.
Or am i confused?
Half-orcs qualify per RAW, but note that for PFS play they specifically don't qualify, as one of the PFS higher-ups said that you can ONLY take racial archetypes and feats if you are that race (or if you spend a feat on Racial Heritage as a human).
Since half-orcs count as humans for the purposes of taking feats, a half-orc can take Racial Heritage (Orc) using their human side in order to access Scarred Witch Doctor. Which is why my group finds the FAQ ruling silly: if a half-orc wants to access something for orcs, it shouldn't be their human half that lets them in.
Funnily enough, if a half-orc or half-elf wants to take a human-exclusive archetype, they can take Racial Heritage with any race they want and it will let them in, because of the way Racial Heritage is written. So no, half-elf, you aren't human enough to be a Buccaneer... until you discover you have Dwarf blood in you, at which point you can sign right up.
Considering that they're worded exactly the same way, it's stupid for the Racial Heritage feat to act differently than the half-elf and half-orc effects. Especially considering the ridiculous corner cases that arise from following the official ruling.
|
The fun of it is dipping a couple levels in to Barbarian because you can use all of your Hexes while raging, which means they get a +3 DC (assuming Raging Vitality) to their saves.
However if you take 2 levels of Barbarian you sacrifice +1 DC to Hexes because of the loss of
Witch levels but you gain a net of +2 from the rage (with Raging Vitality).
I've been taking a good look at the Witch class, and I just glossed right over this archetype because, you know, orc racial archetype durr durr durr...
...I doubt I could use this in one of my games which has a no-nonsense GM, but I might be able to get away it in the other, which is pretty much 'anything goes'.
If you made a Half-Orc Scarred witch doctor (totally legal outside of PFS, which has all sorts of weird rules), you would probably want to build it as an AoO-based build. Since you have reach, and attacking always at highest BAB helps offset the poor BAB. Shame a lot of the best AoO/reach feats have high BAB requirements. The best ones (Dazing Assault, Pin Down) are literally impossible to get w/o multiclassing heavily.
Also, you would get 1.5x con to damage, as a witch gets 1.5x int to damage, assuming it's your only natural weapon, right?
You should probably also slap on the Flyby Attack feat to use with flight hex and/or spells, just for skirmishing capability.
Well, you can't cackle the same round you use Flyby Attack. :)
It's actually one of the major decisions I consider every witch has to make: focus on the cackle hexes, or go the flyby route.
|
Without DM fiat, a Half-Orc cannot take levels in Scarred Witch Doctor.
Feats and Classes are not effects.
You will notice there are "Half-Orc or Orc" as prerequisites for some feats.
Outside of Orc, you can be a Human, or Scion of Humanity Aasimar with the Racial Heritage(Orc) feat, and take levels in Scarred Witch Doctor.
Without DM fiat, a Half-Orc cannot take levels in Scarred Witch Doctor.
Feats and Classes are not effects.
You will notice there are "Half-Orc or Orc" as prerequisites for some feats.
Outside of Orc, you can be a Human, or Scion of Humanity Aasimar with the Racial Heritage(Orc) feat, and take levels in Scarred Witch Doctor.
Why does Racial Heritage work, but not actually being orc-blooded?
Racial Heritage:
"Benefit: Choose another humanoid race. You count as both human and that race for any effects related to race. For example, if you choose dwarf, you are considered both a human and a dwarf for the purpose of taking traits, feats, how spells and magic items affect you, and so on."
Half-Orc's "Orc Blood":
"Half-orcs count as both humans and orcs for any effect related to race."
The developers have explicitly said Racial Heritage lets a human take racial archetypes (as you have acknowledged by mentioning it as a valid option). All the feat does is let you gain effects. Just like orc blood.
So... an effect is an effect except when it's an effect?
No, I'm sorry. You're wrong. That's stupid and wrong and illogical and wrong and how do people come to these conclusions?, oh, and...you are wrong.
I need to make a petition for the support of removing racial restrictions on the archetypes from the Advanced Race Guide. I recall a text in the ARG saying you are free to disregard the racial restrictions anyway. The only exceptions are the Tiefling and Aasimar as well as the Fighter archetype for the Drow and the Monk archetype for the Vanara, since they're all tied to racial abilities instead of new class features. Really, why do other DMs see it as a problem to allow a Dwarf to take the Ironskin Monk, or a Half-Elf to take the Buccaneer and so on?
EDIT: The four elemental planetouched might have their racial restrictions on archetypes for a good reason.
However, I think the Wishcrafter archetype should be available to Ifrits as well as Oreads, Sylphs and the Undine.
To OP: If you think about making a scarred witch doctor with prehensile hair as a melee guy, think about dipping one level into a class that gives you martial weapons (as prereq.) and then go Eldritch knight.
I think that could work well.
You could even make the dip into magus and gain arcane pool and spell combat out of the deal.
That way you can kind of TWF with your hair if I don't miss something that prevents the use of prehensile hair with spell combat.
If you can get someone in the party to play an archer give him some pheromone arrows and grab scent yourself for added melee fun.
You will notice there are "Half-Orc or Orc" as prerequisites for some feats.
Yes, because they were written before Orcs were a PC race and would look weird otherwise. I don't remember any feats having "Half-Elf or Elf" as prerequisites.
Blackbloodtroll has been stuck on this for a long time. For some reason he thinks that because one gives examples of what "effects" means it is somehow different then the "effects" from the other. But that is in no way what the word example means. Not by any definition of the word.
So ether both have to work or nether works. Or of course they need to errata the wording of one or the other so they are not worded the same.
Though I honestly hope that the devs don't intend one to work and not the other. I would like to think they are not so stupid to think a human with a feat should be more of an orc then a half-orc.
On top of that by RAW it never says one HAS to be of a race to take a racial archetype. I don't have the book in front of me but the wording is vague and does not flat out say must.
That's how it works RAW. You don't like it, houserule it.
That is not how it works, RAW. No matter how many times you try to claim it so.
Basically, you will end up with two races that count as three races for everything,
Yes, BBT. For Orc Blood to have any mechanical effect at all, it basically requires that the half-orc simultaneously count as 3 different races.
I doubt if there were offensive spells that worked on (or worked better on) humans, orcs, and half-orcs, respectively, that you'd jump on here and say that Half-Orcs can't be subjected to all 3 of them. Or there is surely some "effect" where you do agree they could count as 3 different races for, unless (again) you wish to claim Orc blood has no mechanical effect.
So why is it not weird for them to count as 3 races sometimes, but other times it is?
without any kind of investment.
The investment is being a Half-Orc. The investment is in not being able to "opt out" of being vulnerable to an orc bane weapon.
Orc blood is a racial feature. It's supposed to provide a net benefit, not "come out even". Do you decry darkvision for letting a race see both in the dark AND in the light? I mean, how is that fair? Right?
/sarcasm
|
RPG Superstar 2014 Top 16
|
Furthermore, from the ARG
Humanoid races have few or no supernatural or spell-like abilities, but most can speak and have well-developed societies. Humanoids are usually Small or Medium, unless they have the giant subtype, in which case they are Large. Every humanoid creature also has a subtype to match its race, such as human, giant, goblinoid, reptilian, or tengu. If you are making a new humanoid race, you should either find an existing subtype to match or make a new one by using the name of the race as the subtype. If you are making a half-breed race, it should have the racial type of both parent races. For example, a half-elf has both the human and the elf subtypes. Subtypes are often important to qualify for other racial abilities and feats. If a humanoid has a racial subtype, it is considered a member of that race in the case of race prerequisites. A humanoid race has the following features.Half-Orc is a Humanoid(human, orc). Having the appropriate racial sub-type qualifies you for racial abilities and feats in the case of race prereqs. It's right there in black and white.
Trust me, we've tried to use this reasoning with BBT before, and he or she is having none of it. You're definitely correct, but it's not going to convince BBT, sadly.
The issue with Eldritch Knight is that you don't improve your time with the hair hex when you take levels in it. With one minute per witch level, spent in minute long increments, that might become pretty tight.To OP: If you think about making a scarred witch doctor with prehensile hair as a melee guy, think about dipping one level into a class that gives you martial weapons (as prereq.) and then go Eldritch knight.
I think that could work well.You could even make the dip into magus and gain arcane pool and spell combat out of the deal.
That way you can kind of TWF with your hair if I don't miss something that prevents the use of prehensile hair with spell combat...
Good Point.
Furthermore, from the ARG
Humanoid races have few or no supernatural or spell-like abilities, but most can speak and have well-developed societies. Humanoids are usually Small or Medium, unless they have the giant subtype, in which case they are Large. Every humanoid creature also has a subtype to match its race, such as human, giant, goblinoid, reptilian, or tengu. If you are making a new humanoid race, you should either find an existing subtype to match or make a new one by using the name of the race as the subtype. If you are making a half-breed race, it should have the racial type of both parent races. For example, a half-elf has both the human and the elf subtypes. Subtypes are often important to qualify for other racial abilities and feats. If a humanoid has a racial subtype, it is considered a member of that race in the case of race prerequisites. A humanoid race has the following features.Half-Orc is a Humanoid(human, orc). Having the appropriate racial sub-type qualifies you for racial abilities and feats in the case of race prereqs. It's right there in black and white.
So what you are saying is if I am Half-Orc then I qualify to be a Bramble Brewer because I meet half of the requirements to be one?
But a Half-Orc is both Human and Orc. Therefore he qualifies for Racial Heritage and can add Half-Elf or even Elf to his subtypes making him Half Orc, Human and Elf.
But a Half-Orc is both Human and Orc. Therefore he qualifies for Racial Heritage and can add Half-Elf or even Elf to his subtypes making him Half Orc, Human and Elf.Yes. As we both said. That's what Racial Heritage does. Takes anyone with the human subtype and adds another.
If you are a Half-Orc with Racial Heritage (Half-Elf) you can be a Bramble Brewer, because you are treated as a Half-elf. Arguably, if you go Racial Heritage(Elf), you also qualify, since you are both Human and Elf. If you are just a Half-Orc, you can't. You have the Human Subtype, but that isn't enough.
Why is this hard?
Why is not being a jerk so hard?