Saving Throw vs Spear of Purity.

[Mortiana27]

So, my group of players has gotten into a hollering match with each other every time this spell is used. One (the one using the spell) says there is no save, unless you are an evil outsider. The other says that all creatures get the save to half the damage.

Can anyone else tell me what they think?

Quote:

Saving Throw Will partial (see text); Spell Resistance yes

An evil creature struck by the spear takes 1d8 points of damage per two caster levels (maximum 5d8). An evil outsider instead takes 1d6 points of damage per caster level (maximum 10d6) and is blinded for 1 round. A successful Will save reduces the damage to half and negates the blinded effect. This spell deals only half damage to creatures that are neither evil nor good, and they are not blinded. The spear has no effect on good creatures.

[Richard Leonhart]

you always get a save I believe, the wording isn't perfect mainly because of the order, but it seems to be a safe bet that that is meant.

[Tiny Coffee Golem]

I read it as Evil creatures, outsider and otherwise, get a save for half damage and to negate the blinding effect. Neutral creatures simply take half damage.

Just my 2C

[Serum]

I'd say they don't get an additional save, because it is implied that they automatically save (and take half damage, and aren't blinded).

[Pirate]

Yar.

And here comes the other side.

I say that all creatures get a save unless it does nothing to them at all.

If you're an Evil Outsider, you take 1d6 damage per level and are blinded, save for half damage and to negate the blindness.

If you are just Evil, but not an Outsider, you take 1d8 damage per two caster levels, save for half damage. Blindness is not even a factor here.

If you are neither Evil nor Good, you automatically take half damage (of 1d8 per 2 caster levels damage), and may save for half of that (aka: quarter damage). Blindness is not even a factor here.

If you are Good, this spell does nothing (or gives you a happy warm feeling with no mechanical effects). There is no save to be made here, as there is no effect.

This is my interpretation as a player who uses this spell as well as a GM.

EDIT: cleaned up my text a bit.

~P

[buckledup]

i'd say you get a save to half damage regardless.

1) the wording is funny, but they are both referred to in the same paragraph as saving would half the damage and negate the blindness in the case of outsiders.

2) i don't understand why a spear of purity would require a save ONLY for evil outsiders but not regularly evil people or (even more confusing) neutral people.

i'd make em roll a save to half the damage for anyone it could hit and hurt.

[Jason Nelson]

Authorially speaking, both sentences are true.

1. A successful save = half damage and no blinding.

2. Neutral creatures take half damage and no blinding.

Which means, taken in combination:

3. A neutral creature WITH a successful save = half of half damage (i.e., quarter damage) and no blinding.

4. A neutral creature with an unsuccessful save = half of full damage (i.e., half damage) and no blinding (because neutral, even though a failed save would normally mean blinding).

This is, if I recall correctly, the same wording used in holy smite, and this spell is essentially a ray of holy smite.

[Mortiana27]

I have allowed each party to have the spell done their way once each, despite having a really good suspicion that I was reading it correctly (as you've all confirmed).

At the next game, I'll address the confusion and be done with further arguments regarding Spear of Purity ;)

Thanks for all your thoughts on this spell.