Chances are you won't outshine the witch, the cleric, or the oracle if their players are good. Those are all very potent Tier 1 classes.
If you were playing a Master Summoner, it might be different, but I wouldn't worry too much about "outshining" the rest of the group... except for those pesky melees. Make sure you take lots of buff spells. The melees will love you for that at least.
SNA is, in my opinion, significantly less cool than SM. But if you don't plan on summoning much I guess it doesn't make much difference. Just remember the versatility of SM is what really makes the Summoner shine, so you're giving up a big piece of the pie there.
Maxing UMD is pretty easy with a Summoner. The other things you may want to consider doing would include either being super sneaky and just hiding during combat or going the Eldritch Heritage route and adding some additional utility.
I do like the Serpentine base form. You can always make it big and make it your mount somewhere later on if you wanted to.
I want to play a summoner in a group with a witch, cleric, oracle, rogue, and ranger. I want to build an eidolon that has one large attack, taking vital strike when it can. I will start at 6th level with 16k in gold. Perhaps a Serpent focusing on constrict and maybe poison. I realize this may be less optimal, but seems more fun, and I don't want to build a DPS machine that overshadows the party.
Second, I don't want to summon a bunch of creatures, as I don't want to drag down combat.
1. I am thinking of playing a Wild Caller from the ARG for the extra 1/4 evolution point per level. But, I swap Summon Monster for Summon Natures Ally. I hope not to use SM often in combat, so is this a bad swap if my only use of my summon ability is utility?
I play a Half-Elven Master Summoner myself who usually keeps his eidolon out as a scout, arming her with a wand to contribute in combat... I'm not familiar with the 'Wild Caller' you're referring to - does the 1/4 evolution point stack with the Half-Elf's favored class bonus of 1/4 evolution point per level?
SM is overall better than SNA so if you're going for versatility then I suggest avoiding Wild caller. I'm going to tell you now so that you know that the vital strike feat tree is a trap. You can't use it on a charge, there are ways to get pounce with your eidolon, and the damage increase is misleading considering many eidolons get multiple attacks. Also since you'll be splitting your gold between you and your eidolon, your defenses will probably be pathetic meaning you probably should avoid mounted combat. Also poison are underwhelming considering everyone and your mom can save for them and some people are immune to poison. Also you shouldn't be wasting your time trying to deal damage yourself considering your party composition and how bad summoners are as blasters. Another thing, get a wand that heals for outside of combat. Infernal healing I'm pretty sure you can get for 750. Also, don't spend too much money on wands that you will use 10 times at most in your campaign. You have several other full casters that can deal with things like that. The summoner excels at summoning and buffing, learn to pick good times to use both effectively to your advantage. Also UMD is what you should be maxing not your eidolon. If you plan on going your current route everyone else will overshadow you at their jobs. If you want to play a jack of all trades then play a bard.
Yes, the Wild Caller stacks. I gain 1/4 evolution point per level (so total of 1/2 with favored class bonus), swap out SM for SNA, and lose the ability to take some of the more "magical" evolution (eg., magical attacks, immunity, and a few others I cant recall but none that struck me as very critical). I love the master summoner archetype, but it just wont fit for this campaign.
What Eldritch Heritage lines would you take? One of my feats is Create Wonderous Item, so I have to feats to spare. Not sure whether to take some archery feats, Eldritch Heritage, some lance feats, Dazzling Display or something else.
Can you give me the details on Wild Caller? You have to choose from Summon Nature's Ally instead of Summon Monster, yes? That's fine by me considering that my character almost exclusively summons elementals.
I have two Summoners, both Half-Elves. The first is the aforementioned Master Summoner who has a scout style eddy - being able to have extremely high stealth, extremely high perception, darksight and to communicate telepathically with me has become so valuable the entire party depends on it now. For him I took the Primal Air Eldritch Heritage line - that +1d6 electrical damage/attack really adds up, and I like eventually having Fly as an 'always on' ability.
My second is a straight up Summoner with a purely combat-oriented eidolon. He focuses on claw attacks, keeping his SR, DR and AC as high as possible. In our game the total number of attacks an Eddy can have is his max # of natural attacks + whatever his standard BAB would allow for weapons IF you have the proper proficiencies and limbs to wiled weapons... I just stick to numerous claw attacks and a bite. We also ruled that as long as you pay for the extra limbs and claws you don't actually have to have them - don't need an 6-armed wolf when you could simply have two arms that you use really quickly to get in 6 attacks in a round. Really more of a cosmetic thing. I didn't take the Eldritch Heritage line with him, but did take every Extra Evolution feat I could take as soon as I could take it and used my free Skill Focus feat on UMD.
My combat eddy looks like a blue-skinned demon wolf covered in golden glowing runes with an over-sized head and claws. I don't worry about the mount thing personally, but I do tend to use wands in combat - the first round or two I cast buffs, and then its wands of magic missile or scorching ray to support my eidolon. The less I'm in the direct line of fire the better for everyone, so given the choice between blasting away and staying invisible, I'll often just do the latter... Haste for the party + bad-@ss eidolon is usually more than enough of a combat contribution. Also, when considering forms, remember that only the Biped form can get Pounce which is huge. Finally, don't neglect Aspect and Greater Aspect. Aspect can get you Flight at 10th level if you decide to go that route, and Greater Aspect can get you Spell Resistance AND +4 to your Natural Armor which is nice to have.
Just a random thought: all those evolution points might actually make a Broodmaster playable, IF you stuck to only two eddies - a small sized pure scout and then a large sized combat machine. The only problem is that skill ranks are limited by hit dice and presumably you'd be using all your hit dice on your combat guy... oh, the problems with Broodmaster makes me ache for what could have been a very, very cool archetype.
I don't how to paste any of the details, but the changes are: 1) all your SM spells on your spell list become SNA; 2) all of your SM SLA become SNA; 3) you cannot use Gate at level 17, but can cast Summon Elder Worm or Summon Froghemoth; 4) you gain 1/4 evolution point per level, but cannot take evolutions of magic attacks, energy attacks, immunity, weapon training, damage reduction, frightful presence, breath weapon, spell resistance, basic magic, unnatural aura, channel resistance head, minor magic, undead appearance, major magic, dimension door, incorporeal form, lifesense, no breath, or ultimate magic.
My main thing is I don't want to slow down combat with a bunch of creatures on the board, or having to figure out 5 or 6 different attacks, plus my own character. That is why I was leaning towards the idea of going for one big attack. I like the idea of a giant, flying constrictor snake, but I guess it is suboptimal to a pouncing quadraped.
I was going to play a Bard because I like the idea of throwing support spells, but since we lost our fighter and dont have a lot of good frontline damage, I thought this would give me the best of both worlds. Good utility and support spells, plus wands of the spells I really like: Ill Omen combined with the witch could get nasty, Saving Finale and Liberating Command to save my allies in a pinch, true strike on my eidolon when I really need that attack to hit, etc.
I agree that it would be the best of both worlds to play a straight up Summoner and I encourage you to choose the form you like the most over pure optimization... its not as if you already won't be the most powerful character in your group, no need to kill flavor to widen that gap even further.
With regards to Wild Caller - is that applicable to Master Summoners as well, because if it is then that is absolutely the perfect class for me. My eidolon could take the form of a forest sprite of some sort and I'll take Summon Elder Worm over Gate every day of the week.
I dont see anywhere where Wild Caller modified or removes something that is needed for the Master Summoner archetype.
So if I dont plan to use my SLA during combat, is the swap of SNA for SM worth the extra 1/4 point evolution point? How much greater is the out of combat utility of SM than SNA?
What feats should I take? I am starting at level 6. I am definitely taking Craft Wonderous because I have 16k and my DM will let me start with items I crafted on my own for 65% of cost. Should I just take extra evolutions? Perhaps Eldritch Heritage Arcana for an Arcane Bond (allowing me to craft something else cheaply and get an extra spell per day)?
How should I do stats? I start with a 15, 14, 14, 13, 12, 10. I get a +1 at 4th level and should be able to craft at least two +2 items. I was thinking max charisma, but I guess it wont be as important if I'm not using my SLA a lot and most of spells wont have saves. Maybe CON for the HP?
For me the ones who have the real utility are the elementals - there's literally one for every occasion, whether its bringing down flying foes, walking through castle or dungeon walls, slowing pursuit or setting ships on fire in a harbor... I summon elementals almost exclusively for role-play reasons and have never felt limited in any way, though we've made a few common sense rules variations along the way.
Craft Wonderous Items is a bit of a group-by-group call as different GM's handle it different ways. If you think you'll have the spells to create the things you want and your GM is behind it then knock yourself out. I generally avoid crafting feats, but when I take them I take Craft Wand. A Wand of Haste or Bull's Strength, for example, will save you a lot of spell slots that you could use for other things - remember the Summoner isn't exactly bursting with spells per day to begin with.
As far as other feats, extra evolution seems like a no-brainer as often as you can get it. If you decide to go the Eldritch Heritage route, you might want to consider the Orc bloodline, but only for the 1st option - Touch of Rage. With a standard action you can give someone a +x bonus to hit and damage for one round where x = your level -2 x 1/2 (so +4/+4 at 10th level, +9/+9 at 20th). That can be potent on a pouncing eidolon with tons of attacks or a Whirlwind Attacking Fighter. Going the Arcane Bond route isn't a terrible choice either.
Improved Initiative and Toughness are both good. Quicken Spell at higher levels so that you can Hasten + something in the opening round of combat, maybe even take the trait that lets you lower the level of one spell for metamagic purposes...
For those stats, straight summoner avoiding save spells (though there are some really great ones) and your race is a half-elf? I'd probably go something like:
STR 10
DEX 15 (+1 at 4th, 16th and 20th)
CON 14
INT 13
WIS 12
CHA 14 (+1 at 8th, 12th)
Both AC and Initiative is important for this character, hence the higher Dexterity.
Anyway, those are my recommendations - if you have any other questions then feel free.
With regards to Wild Caller - is that applicable to Master Summoners as well, because if it is then that is absolutely the perfect class for me. My eidolon could take the form of a forest sprite of some sort and I'll take Summon Elder Worm over Gate every day of the week.
It's not obvious at a glance, but the Wild Caller's replacement of SM for SNA says, "This ability otherwise functions like the standard summoner’s summon monster I ability and replaces that ability." The Master Summoner has a similar text as well, so I think it's pretty clear the archetypes don't stack. It'd be nice, of course, but I'm not surprised the developers would want to avoid that.
Wild Caller is a very, very powerful archetype due to the stupidly powerful +1/2 your level in evolution points. Staggered of course, but effectively that. Further, it opens the doors to the Xlight Summons feats which tears asunder the concept of summons being destroyed by DR. Not having access to magic attack evolution hurts it a bit, but that's easy enough to overcome.
With regards to Wild Caller - is that applicable to Master Summoners as well, because if it is then that is absolutely the perfect class for me. My eidolon could take the form of a forest sprite of some sort and I'll take Summon Elder Worm over Gate every day of the week.It's not obvious at a glance, but the Wild Caller's replacement of SM for SNA says, "This ability otherwise functions like the standard summoner’s summon monster I ability and replaces that ability." The Master Summoner has a similar text as well, so I think it's pretty clear the archetypes don't stack. It'd be nice, of course, but I'm not surprised the developers would want to avoid that.
I'd really like a ruling on that since there doesn't seem to be a reason why they wouldn't stack... in fact it can be a bit of a stiff penalty to pay because you have all the same limitations on your eidolon as the standard Summoner does - and there are many. No Skilled: Stealth option? There goes the scout. No Skilled: UMD? There goes the wand-weilder. Basically you're just exchanging a lot of the eidolon options for a few more points to spend. It fits thematically, it fits balance-wise and it functions with the exact same mechanics.
What are the good spells that allow a save that you find yourself using. I am just leery of focusing on those spells because even with a Wizard 20 with Spell Focus and Greater Spell Focus I was finding my spells only 50-60% effective on more than mooks, so I am doubtful I can be very effective with the lower spells of a summoner.
I find Charm Monster, Mass Charm Monster, Hold Monster, Dominate Monster to all be very useful, as well as Dismissal and the Pit spells can be wickedly effective as battlefield control. Personally I take the Charm, Hold and Dominate options and the Spell focus: Enchantment feats.