Two Handed Katana without Exotic Weapon Proficiency feat


Rules Questions


Hi everyone,

one of my player had created a new character who uses the katana with the two hands.
He is a fighter level 1 and one of the feats he had chosen is "Power Attack". Also, his STR is 16 (+3).

So, in this way, the damage of the katana is 1d8+4 and, when he uses the Power Attack, the damage becomes 1d8+7 (+4 Two handed STR, +3 Power Attack).

I think that he is the king of munchkin and this "trick" is legal.

However, I'm not sure if the threat of the katana is 18-20 or only 20. In the Feats chapter is written about Exotic Weapon Proficiency: "... and can utilize any special tricks or qualities that exotic weapon might allow."

I know the "deadly" special ability isn't applicable but, what happens with the threat? It is 18-20 or only 20?

Any ideas?

I'm afraid he will take the "Improve Critical" feat when he reaches 8th level and it will unbalance the warrior's damage.

Thanks in advance for your time and forgive my english.

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2015 Top 32, RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

I imagine he's planning to eventually get the EWP feat, otherwise he'd just be using the Nodachi: 1d10 damage, two-handed, martial, with 18-20 threat range, S or P damage, and brace (so actually better than the katana, when the katana's being used two-handed).


I think you need to read the Katana equipment entry. It probably has the same text as the Dwarven Waraxe and Bastard Sword. If it does, and it should since it's basically a Japanese Bastard Sword, then it can be used as a two handed martial weapon or a one handed exotic weapon with full functionality.


What he's doing is just creating a good two-handed fighter. This isn't excessive or cheesy; it's completely in line with the sort of damage a two-handed fighter should be able to do for his level.

When wielded in two hands, the katana is a martial weapon with all the qualities listed, and he's proficient with it. So, yes, he gets the 18-20 threat range and the deadly special weapon quality. This isn't excessive considering that a 1d8 is pretty low base damage for a two-handed weapon.


I don't really see how this could be considered "munchkining". It is entirely legal for him to do and it doesn't require any rule bending or anything.

A katana is a high-crit weapon, meaning it's kinda designed to be a weapon you score critical hits often with. These kinds of weapons don't deal a whole lot of critical hit damage, as there's a whole slew of feats designed to give enemies status ailments whenever you score a critical hit.

Anyway, I would think the crit range stays the same, as it's not a special trick or quality of the weapon, as Special "tricks" and "qualities" have their own column on weapon lists.


The katana is a martial weapon when used 2 handed. So the fighter is proficient with it and uses all of the statistics for the weapon when it is used 2 handed.

I don't see this as a munchkin tactic as Jiggy pointed out, there are better two handed weapons available than the katana (nodachi or even the falchion). If he tries to use it 1 handed he will get -4 to hit as he will not be proficient.


Quote:
Katana: (...) Characters can use a katana two-handed as a martial weapon, but must take the Exotic Weapon Proficiency (katana) feat to use it one-handed.

It works like bastard sword/dwarven waraxe - it is one handed exotic weapon but when wielded with two hands it can be treated as martial weapon, thus gaining all the benefits this way.


Thanks for replying.

I'm sure that my friend hasn't see the nodachi. Sure. ^_^

He's a munchkin (but in the good meaning), believe me... I think I don't use "munchkin" as a bad word. It's a joke for my players because we aren't english-speaking.

However, I'm still not sure that the special quality can be used without the feat. Otherwise, why it is written in the rules that only with the EWP feat the character "...can utilize any special tricks or qualities that exotic weapon might allow".

I understand if you don't have the feat, you can't use "any special tricks or qualities" of the weapon.


The special trick is being able to use it one-handed. That's it.


damargon wrote:

Thanks for replying.

I'm sure that my friend hasn't see the nodachi. Sure. ^_^

He's a munchkin (but in the good meaning), believe me... I think I don't use "munchkin" as a bad word. It's a joke for my players because we aren't english-speaking.

However, I'm still not sure that the special quality can be used without the feat. Otherwise, why it is written in the rules that only with the EWP feat the character "...can utilize any special tricks or qualities that exotic weapon might allow".

I understand if you don't have the feat, you can't use "any special tricks or qualities" of the weapon.

Look at it this way:

The katana, when used 2-handed, is a martial weapon that requires martial weapon proficiency for proper use.

The katana, when used 1-handed, is an exotic weapon that requires EWP for proper use.

Don't look at it as just an exotic weapon. It can be either exotic or martial, depending on the way it's wielded.


16 str and a sub optimal weapon for a 2 handed fighter build? I don't think this guy has hit "normal" yet, much less (in ascending order) optimizer, min maxer, munchkin, plaid, or ravingdork :)


Actually I think the player qualifies for normal tier.
I would also like to note that at the moment we don't know if he aims for two-handed build or perhaps wishes to branch into two-weapon fighting in the future.


Removed a post. Please try to be courteous to other posters.


Thanks to everybody.

While my players don't have the EWP feat, he can't use the "deadly" quality of the weapon. It is what I understand of the EWP description.

The rest of qualities can be used with no restriction.

I'm sure he is going to finish bringing two katanas with 15-20 :D


damargon wrote:
While my players don't have the EWP feat, he can't use the "deadly" quality of the weapon. It is what I understand of the EWP description.

Well, RAW is that he can use every quality of the weapon, "deadly" included, as long as he has martial weapon proficiency and uses two hands. But if you want to limit his coup de gras ability with the weapon until he invests in EWP, I doubt it will matter too much.

Quote:
I'm sure he is going to finish bringing two katanas with 15-20 :D

Probably. But by then, he'll have EWP. ;-)

Liberty's Edge

damargon wrote:

Thanks to everybody.

While my players don't have the EWP feat, he can't use the "deadly" quality of the weapon. It is what I understand of the EWP description.

As has been pointed out, you are mistaken. As has been pointed out, he has: Martial Weapon Proficiency: Katana.

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