Kthulhu
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Azaelas Fayth wrote:Most of the AAA Companies in Gaming are more interested in making profits. That means marketing with what has proven successful. Those that actually push the envelope don't sell mainly because they can't afford to market.Tomb Raider didn't sell?
Well, despite outselling many games led by a male protagonist, it's apparently still considered a disappointment by Square Enix.
| pres man |
It also adds to the fact that she got the Game Boycotted by A LOT of gamers. The Company went under and got bought out. & the game was excellent. It literally had a story that rivals most others. It literally has 40+ Hours of content. It is open sandbox & Stealth focused. Literally think Infamous but everything is open to you.
I think you might have literally used the word literally too many times. Literally.
| Azaelas Fayth |
I can't remember ho to spell her last name but it is something along the lines of Yoshiko Tonika or something. Thankfully she was only the PoV Protagonist, think Vaan from FFXII, in a story she mostly watched.
It was a Cult Classic Game that was set in a Fantasy World inspired by the Warring States Era. The sad part was she had long lines when they did come up and you couldn't skip them...
| Calybos1 |
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
I think the Stupidest thing that hurt the Women in Gaming Side was a Female Developer going on a cussing fit simply because a Middle Eastern Inspired Game had (2) Belly Dancers at their Booth the rest of their 10 Models were Men in Middle Eastern Dress. & the Game actually has a Female Protagonist.
Amazingly, being a crybaby and acting as self-appointed Morality Police is poorly received in almost every industry, including those that have been male-dominated for a long time.
It does a lot of damage to sincere women's chances of being taken seriously, too. Witness "Donglegate" with Adria Richards.
Some people still aren't aware that announcing "I'm offended" doesn't make you right. It does, however, make you a target online.
| Azaelas Fayth |
She openly admitted to not listening fully to their conversation. It was proven that it was the phrases taken out of Context and that she is apparently going to be required to issue an apology. She has already been banned from something this Fall do to it. Ironically, she is banned do to actions of a organization helping woman in the tech industry.
| pres man |
She openly admitted to not listening fully to their conversation. It was proven that it was the phrases taken out of Context and that she is apparently going to be required to issue an apology. She has already been banned from something this Fall do to it. Ironically, she is banned do to actions of a organization helping woman in the tech industry.
Who is going to require her to issue an apology, her boss? LOL
| Shifty |
I could be mistaken but it seems in most those games (If not all) the default is assumed to be the male version.
Having played through both Fallout 3 (and New Vegas) and Skyrim as bioth male and female characters there was nothing that stood out to me that gave me an impression that it was assumed you were male, so I wouldn't be so sure...
| Don Juan de Doodlebug |
Don Juan de Doodlebug wrote:For some reason this got me thinking about this Persian girl I knew from Turkey when I was in college. She had the most beautiful caramel colored skin.2nd EDIT: Armenian chicks are hawt!!
[Drools]
Yes, Iranian women are also wicked hawt.
Come to think of it, Iranian men that I've known, when they're not wearing Khomeini-style beards, are also quite fetching.
| Sissyl |
I can't remember ho to spell her last name but it is something along the lines of Yoshiko Tonika or something. Thankfully she was only the PoV Protagonist, think Vaan from FFXII, in a story she mostly watched.
It was a Cult Classic Game that was set in a Fantasy World inspired by the Warring States Era. The sad part was she had long lines when they did come up and you couldn't skip them...
Which game(s)/company are we talking about here?
Alice Margatroid
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| Don Juan de Doodlebug |
Oh yeah, I forgot:
I read an intro to critical analysis for teenagers called How to Analyze the Works of Suzanne Collins that had a better gender analysis of the Hunger Games than Anita "I hate love triangles--Little Women sucks!!" Sarkeesian.
| MeanDM |
Oh yeah, I forgot:
I read an intro to critical analysis for teenagers called How to Analyze the Works of Suzanne Collins that had a better gender analysis of the Hunger Games than Anita "I hate love triangles--Little Women sucks!!" Sarkeesian.
But she's more fun to look at for 25 minutes. And interesting even when I disagree with her.
| Necromancer |
Damsel in Distress: Part 2
So after a successful Kickstarter, Sarkeesian couldn't be bothered to brush up her acting/speaking skills a bit? Christ, I really must be a masochist to keep watching this series.
I love that Sarkeesian avoids the actual issues (dull-as-shit-stories, only-combat narratives & solutions, lack of protagonist variety, etc.) so that she can focus on the symptoms of the issues. I also love that she only mentions developers, as if publishers, religion, culture, and market trends have absolutely nothing to do with a title's creative direction... Really, the video has the same problems as her first installment:
- boring & obnoxious speech patterns (it really sounds like she's reading everything from cards)
- twitchy head movement, no gestures or other dynamic activity, unnecessary massive piercings-that-will-one-day-catch-on-a-bookshelf-and-cost-her-an-ear-or-two
- focusing on the wrong issues and then beating the equine corpse into pieces
- repetitive structure (hot-button scene depicting violence against women x 20, "This is bad and you should feel bad" talking head, hot-button scene depicting violence against women x 20, "This is even worse, subscribe to my channel!!!", etc.)
On the bright side, the next video promises some actual variety. It probably won't happen, but sometimes I like to shove optimism into the strangest places.
Hama
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Don Juan de Doodlebug wrote:But she's more fun to look at for 25 minutes. And interesting even when I disagree with her.Oh yeah, I forgot:
I read an intro to critical analysis for teenagers called How to Analyze the Works of Suzanne Collins that had a better gender analysis of the Hunger Games than Anita "I hate love triangles--Little Women sucks!!" Sarkeesian.
Umm, she's not fun to look at at all...
| Necromancer |
Gee, what a shock. In video about violence against women in video games, she focuses on violence against women in video games.
Nor has she changed her fashion style to suit you.
Nor become a polished actress and producer.
Look, I'm just pointing out that I've not seen any improvement from her previous video. If I was attempting to draw attention to an issue and planned to execute it in video form, I'd try and iron out any imperfections before publishing the video. Sarkeesian has been uploading videos for some time and I expected higher quality on something that she feels strongly about.
Not going to comment on most of your post, Necromancer, but it's not cool to judge someone's choice of attire as part of a critique of their arguments. Avoid the ad hominem attacks, hey?
Maybe I should've elaborated a bit more, but I mentioned the piercings (a distraction) as part of a larger problem. The combination of spinning metallic objects, in-your-face talking head approach to narration, and amateur voice-work prevents me from watching the video properly. Seriously, I end up just scrolling down from time to time to avoid closing the tab. I do this for ads; I shouldn't be doing this for the content I came to watch.
General disclaimer - I'm not against Sarkeesian's stance on this...not at the end of the day, anyways. I don't think she should've used a Kickstarter campaign to fund it, but people shelled out cash and that's that. What I dislike is the tone she's taken, the series' overly narrow focus, and some of the examples chosen. For instance, Dishonored doesn't feature violence against women as a major element nor does the game focus on Corvo's story more than any other character.
| thejeff |
thejeff wrote:Gee, what a shock. In video about violence against women in video games, she focuses on violence against women in video games.Is it violence against women video or tropes vs. women?
Damned if I know.
But I'm pretty sure "the actual issues (dull-as-s%!@-stories, only-combat narratives & solutions, lack of protagonist variety, etc.) " aren't on the list.
Alice Margatroid
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Alice Margatroid wrote:Not going to comment on most of your post, Necromancer, but it's not cool to judge someone's choice of attire as part of a critique of their arguments. Avoid the ad hominem attacks, hey?I take it that the "Mind Blank" failed. ;P
I shouldn't have taken the Duty Calls flaw. You'd think that the Will save penalty would never come up, but it always does!
| Don Juan de Doodlebug |
MeanDM wrote:Umm, she's not fun to look at at all...Don Juan de Doodlebug wrote:But she's more fun to look at for 25 minutes. And interesting even when I disagree with her.Oh yeah, I forgot:
I read an intro to critical analysis for teenagers called How to Analyze the Works of Suzanne Collins that had a better gender analysis of the Hunger Games than Anita "I hate love triangles--Little Women sucks!!" Sarkeesian.
I think she is quite fun to look at...when she's not talking smack about the Glorious People's Revolution in Panem!
Down with Anita!
Vive le Katniss!
| thejeff |
thejeff wrote:Gee, what a shock. In video about violence against women in video games, she focuses on violence against women in video games.
Nor has she changed her fashion style to suit you.
Nor become a polished actress and producer.Look, I'm just pointing out that I've not seen any improvement from her previous video. If I was attempting to draw attention to an issue and planned to execute it in video form, I'd try and iron out any imperfections before publishing the video. Sarkeesian has been uploading videos for some time and I expected higher quality on something that she feels strongly about.
Alice Margatroid wrote:Not going to comment on most of your post, Necromancer, but it's not cool to judge someone's choice of attire as part of a critique of their arguments. Avoid the ad hominem attacks, hey?Maybe I should've elaborated a bit more, but I mentioned the piercings (a distraction) as part of a larger problem. The combination of spinning metallic objects, in-your-face talking head approach to narration, and amateur voice-work prevents me from watching the video properly. Seriously, I end up just scrolling down from time to time to avoid closing the tab. I do this for ads; I shouldn't be doing this for the content I came to watch.
It's kind of a problem with the Kickstarter format, especially when it spins out of control like this did.
She originally wanted fairly minor funding, right? Then the attacks on her went viral and a ton of cash flooded in, not so much because people thought her product was going to be so great, but in sympathy for and backlash against the attacks.Now she's got all that money and ridiculously high expectations for the videos.
DM_aka_Dudemeister
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Her appearance is irrelevant.
Her points are valid.
Violence against women is a grim reality, and far too easily used to further the plot of a male protagonist.
Video games too often default to the one verb "kill", and it's tragic that developers and publishers don't do enough to push these boundaries.
Sarkeesian makes a lot of valid points. How she raised funds to make her educational videos. How she looks, dresses or speaks are completely irrelevant to the discussion.
| Bruunwald |
| 6 people marked this as a favorite. |
I'm just going to go right out there and say this. I am a Humanist. I believe in treating all human beings equally. That means that I am an anti-feminist. Because feminism is by its very definition, divisive.
Feminism was a good idea once, and I grew up a feminist (though I am male) because I was raised primarily by a mother and aunts (my father was out of the picture). It arose for good reasons... it was the work of women who actually had cause to protest and to demand equal rights.
But over time, I have come to understand that modern, post-feminism is not our grandmothers' feminism. It is a divisive, anger-driven movement designed to further a notion of female exceptionalism and superiority under the GUISE of equality. Women do not want to be treated as equals. If they were, men would be farting in their faces as they do other men, and women would have to face the same poor, bullying - and innuendo and vulgarity-laced - treatment that men inflict upon one-another every single day. Instead, they want to be treated special AND get the perks, and they cry foul when they are treated equally. Anything less than sainthood results in cries of discrimination and harassment, quickly followed up with a brainless meme on Facebook and an article on Jezebel encouraging the castration of all male babies at birth. My own post-modern feminist friends are so concerned with women's-rights ONLY and with the catchphrase of the week ("Rape Culture" comes to mind; a phrase wholly analogous to "Abortion Industry" in its ability to strip real human victims and real human beings in bad situations of all of their individuality and humanity), that they themselves seem to care very little about individual women who have actually suffered harm, and god forbid a child - especially a boy - be raped, because that child is not a woman, and so is of no concern. It's disgusting.
For this reason, I never take people like Anita seriously anymore. If I could, I would dismantle feminism tomorrow with extreme prejudice, as I would any angry, divisive, one-sided movement, and I would fold any reasonable Feminist into Humanism where they belong. Everybody else would be left to fend off the very people they claim to be against, with whom they share all the same awful traits, whether they know it or not.
Better that ALL people get fair and decent treatment. Better we stop talking about how people are hurt because they are male or female, or black or white, or a child, or an elderly person, and start worrying about how to make sure we teach our HUMAN children how to treat OTHER HUMANS HUMANELY.
| Necromancer |
I'm just going to go right out there and say this. I am a Humanist. I believe in treating all human beings equally. That means that I am an anti-feminist. Because feminism is by its very definition, divisive.
Feminism was a good idea once, and I grew up a feminist (though I am male) because I was raised primarily by a mother and aunts (my father was out of the picture). It arose for good reasons... it was the work of women who actually had cause to protest and to demand equal rights.
But over time, I have come to understand that modern, post-feminism is not our grandmothers' feminism. It is a divisive, anger-driven movement designed to further a notion of female exceptionalism and superiority under the GUISE of equality. Women do not want to be treated as equals. If they were, men would be farting in their faces as they do other men, and women would have to face the same poor, bullying - and innuendo and vulgarity-laced - treatment that men inflict upon one-another every single day. Instead, they want to be treated special AND get the perks, and they cry foul when they are treated equally. Anything less than sainthood results in cries of discrimination and harassment, quickly followed up with a brainless meme on Facebook and an article on Jezebel encouraging the castration of all male babies at birth. My own post-modern feminist friends are so concerned with women's-rights ONLY and with the catchphrase of the week ("Rape Culture" comes to mind; a phrase wholly analogous to "Abortion Industry" in its ability to strip real human victims and real human beings in bad situations of all of their individuality and humanity), that they themselves seem to care very little about individual women who have actually suffered harm, and god forbid a child - especially a boy - be raped, because that child is not a woman, and so is of no concern. It's disgusting.
For this reason, I never take people like Anita seriously anymore. If I could, I would dismantle feminism tomorrow with extreme prejudice, as I would any...
*narrows eyes at website* What do mean I can only favorite this once?!
Alice Margatroid
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| 6 people marked this as a favorite. |
Aaaaand Bruunwald's post signals my time to nope my way out of this thread, hope the video gets seen by some of the people who appreciated part 1.
Guy Humual
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| 3 people marked this as a favorite. |
I'm just going to go right out there and say this. I am a Humanist. I believe in treating all human beings equally. That means that I am an anti-feminist. Because feminism is by its very definition, divisive.
Well it's nice to know that 100 year old struggle for equality has finally hit the tipping point. Woman of the world can now not only vote but now actually represent half of all elected officials, always make as much as a man doing the same job, and always have control over their bodies. I'm so glad that things are finally equal now and we can put all that ugly unfairness in the past just like we did racism after the 2008 election.
/sarcasm
Guy Humual
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She should use that extra cash to make a video apologizing to Suzanne Collins...
I do agree with her that books two & three weren't as good as book one, book three was a big disappointment in my mind but I did like book two. And I liked her points on the book vs the movie, but I really hated the argument about the love triangle, everyone always tries to suggest that there was a love triangle, but Katniss isn't even sure that boys have any feelings for her at all prior to the hunger games, and events after that conspire to force her hand. She doesn't really get to choose based on love or attraction, there's not much wooing, and there really isn't much competition for her hand so to speak. Well I suppose technically it is a love triangle, two boys are in love with her, it's nothing like that vampire one and I thought that even the brief comparison was kind of cheap.
Guy Humual
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| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
If they were, men would be farting in their faces as they do other men ...
Which is juvenile and comes with it the understanding that retaliation to juvenile behavior could very well turn violent, I mean if you did that to me I'd likely put you on your rear, but then if you're physically larger and you don't have to fear any sort of retaliation then it's just basic bullying and humiliation. Men you see Bruuunwald have an understanding of violence, some of them tease each other out of respect with the understanding that should we go too far the other is capable of retaliating with physical violence, but women are usually smaller and less capable of defending themselves against men. Civilized folk generally treat all people with respect regardless. But the other thing is that social constraints also suggest that if a woman were to respond in turn then she'd be called un-lady like (at best) and would be ostracized for acting out of her acceptable social norm.
So physically and socially she's restrained. Course having her complain labels her as a b~#&@ or a stick in the mud by you. Can't imagine why feminists get upset. Personally I don't see why wanting a little human decency is offensive to some folks but then again I'm not a "Humanist" and I think we have a long way to go before women of this world achieve equality.
| DSXMachina |
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Bruunwald wrote:If they were, men would be farting in their faces as they do other men ...I think we have a long way to go before women of this world achieve equality.
Bruunwald's point is that would be equality, thus we have a "long way to go before people of this world reach an egalitarian society".
| Rynjin |
| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
Well it's nice to know that 100 year old struggle for equality has finally hit the tipping point. Woman of the world can now not only vote but now actually represent half of all elected officials, always make as much as a man doing the same job, and always have control over their bodies. I'm so glad that things are finally equal now and we can put all that ugly unfairness in the past just like we did racism after the 2008 election.
/sarcasm
I think you've somehow managed to completely and utterly miss the point of his post somehow.
His point was that instead of focusing on "female equality" or "black equality" or "gay equality" or "Purple people eater equality", we should just focus on human equality. That it, it encompasses all of them without pretending they're separate issues, and with the added, wonderful side effect of hopefully utterly annihilating the RadFem movement until there's nothing but dust and crocodile tears where it used to stand.
What he's saying is that Feminism has shifted from "Let's fight for female equality!" to "Let's fight for female supremacy!, which is wholly counter-productive, as that would be trading one inequality for another. Whether he's correct or not I cannot say, but I do know that I have never met a "Feminist" who did not share that attitude in one way or another, whether it be the "I want Castration Day to be an international holiday!" level of crazy, or the milder but still stupid "I want to be treated equally, but I also want to be doted on by the man in my life because I'm special!".
| Irontruth |
Guy Humual wrote:Bruunwald's point is that would be equality, thus we have a "long way to go before people of this world reach an egalitarian society".Bruunwald wrote:If they were, men would be farting in their faces as they do other men ...I think we have a long way to go before women of this world achieve equality.
I've never heard bullying described as equality before.
| DSXMachina |
DSXMachina wrote:I've never heard bullying described as equality before.Guy Humual wrote:Bruunwald's point is that would be equality, thus we have a "long way to go before people of this world reach an egalitarian society".Bruunwald wrote:If they were, men would be farting in their faces as they do other men ...I think we have a long way to go before women of this world achieve equality.
Exactly we shouldn't be striving for equality, instead we should be striving to better mankind's relationship with each other and the environment that surrounds.
Anyway this is getting slightly off-topic:
Sarkeesian makes a lot of valid points. How she raised funds to make her educational videos. How she looks, dresses or speaks are completely irrelevant to the discussion.
Unfortunately, an educator has to be able to capture the imagination of those they are teaching, usually the best way to do this is with good oration. (Certainly, the clothing/style of the speaker is at least tangentionally relevant - although shouldn't be a focus)
| thejeff |
Guy Humual wrote:Well it's nice to know that 100 year old struggle for equality has finally hit the tipping point. Woman of the world can now not only vote but now actually represent half of all elected officials, always make as much as a man doing the same job, and always have control over their bodies. I'm so glad that things are finally equal now and we can put all that ugly unfairness in the past just like we did racism after the 2008 election.
/sarcasmI think you've somehow managed to completely and utterly miss the point of his post somehow.
His point was that instead of focusing on "female equality" or "black equality" or "gay equality" or "Purple people eater equality", we should just focus on human equality. That it, it encompasses all of them without pretending they're separate issues, and with the added, wonderful side effect of hopefully utterly annihilating the RadFem movement until there's nothing but dust and crocodile tears where it used to stand.
What he's saying is that Feminism has shifted from "Let's fight for female equality!" to "Let's fight for female supremacy!, which is wholly counter-productive, as that would be trading one inequality for another. Whether he's correct or not I cannot say, but I do know that I have never met a "Feminist" who did not share that attitude in one way or another, whether it be the "I want Castration Day to be an international holiday!" level of crazy, or the milder but still stupid "I want to be treated equally, but I also want to be doted on by the man in my life because I'm special!".
OTOH, fighting for generic equality sounds all very good and idealistic and everything, but it's tricky to do without losing focus. Anytime you focus on any specific inequality, suddenly you can be attacked for promoting one group. And if you don't focus on specific issues you don't accomplish anything. You just stand around saying "Wouldn't it be great if no one was oppressed."
Some feminists may go too far, but I'm not going to worry about it until we're a lot closer to equality than we are now.
| ujjjjjjjjjj |
Good summary of why I don't like her here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p6gLmcS3-NI
Also shes just missed her major submission dates (And Im not sure where those extra 140,000 went.).
Shes a feminist that doesn't think things through, and just likes to rage at a general....target....thing, and demand censorship.
Guy Humual
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Guy Humual wrote:Bruunwald's point is that would be equality, thus we have a "long way to go before people of this world reach an egalitarian society".Bruunwald wrote:If they were, men would be farting in their faces as they do other men ...I think we have a long way to go before women of this world achieve equality.
If having people fart in my face is equality then is there some other box I could check instead? Perhaps civilized? I don't tolerate that sort of behavior but thankfully I'm not a woman and don't have to suffer though it to be considered equal.
| thejeff |
| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
DSXMachina wrote:If having people fart in my face is equality then is there some other box I could check instead? Perhaps civilized? I don't tolerate that sort of behavior but thankfully I'm not a woman and don't have to suffer though it to be considered equal.Guy Humual wrote:Bruunwald's point is that would be equality, thus we have a "long way to go before people of this world reach an egalitarian society".Bruunwald wrote:If they were, men would be farting in their faces as they do other men ...I think we have a long way to go before women of this world achieve equality.
And more generally, why does "treated equal" have to mean "treated like men treat each other"? Why does the way men interact have to be the norm to which women aspire?