RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8
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Ok, spinning off of This post (Which spun off of another post) Anyone want to brainstorm how to make PFS Legal "boon-like" characters?
Thing is, based off the 'tiefling' thread, one thing that I was reminded was that many people are not as skilled at using what you have availible race wise to come up with unique character concepts. They then use a exotic race as 'filler' for backstory.
I'd mentioned wanting to play an aasimar elsewhere so I could steal Patricia Velasquez's look from The Mummy. Someone had asked why I couldn't do it with a human/half elf. Short answer, if I can't reskin a Hand of Glory to not look like a severed hand, then I am sure I'd get grief for making a human with gold skin. :P Longer answer is that while I could make a human sorcerer, divine bloodline, and use Prestidigitation for the skin colouring, it 'felt' right to make a 'lost' Osiron noble be an aasimar.
This though has been kicking around in my head. What traits can you use to make 'lite' version of the boon races?
For example, the Faith trait works for Aasimar and Tieflings, The trait bonus can even be 'explained away' as being part of your outsider heritage.
Likewise, Magical Talent can give you light for 'aasimar-lite' detect undead for Dhampir-lite.
Now some things just can't be emulated. (No way you can make a character look like a Tengu, for example) But I'm curious in general, and for all the 'we don't want the boon races put in the hands of anyone' folk. Can you rise to this challenge?
Sure.
Not for PFS, tho he is legal
I ran a ZAM and wanted him to be an assimar (GM said core only)
So I splashed a level of Sorc (Wildblooded Empyreal bloodline)
I just called it my +1 LA
The healing bolts the bloodline gives are really perfect for an angelic being.
And I took all my spells known as crap that an assimar should be able to do.
for me it was more assimar then a real one and was a hoot to play.
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A Synthesist can become 80-90% of any race. You can even look like a tengu if you want.
Of course, YMMV in PFS, since some DM's insist that translucent actually means colorless pile of goo in the context of fused eidolons.
If the "aasimar" in question is Osirioni, why does a mummified hand have to icky? It could be the reverently preserved remains of their ancestor who the divine blood came to the character through.
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RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8
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Well actually it was for Rey, my Taldoran born sorcerer. Based the concept on Harry Dresden, so for him, even a 'reverently preserved remains of his ancestor' would be icky. :-)
Reminds me, Fey Founding feat also works if someone wants to play some kind of 'first world' planetouched background.
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I've noticed that Sorcerer Bloodlines and Oracle mysteries/curses are one route to go. I just designed a human bard who is going to dip into sorcerer (fey bloodline) to suggest that there is something unworldly to her magic. The +2 DC to compulsion spells doesn't hurt.
Also, the half races (orc/elf) can work well. Basically, if you come from a small or medium town, you're probably the only mongrel in town. Make that your start point. Then decide who treated them well, badly etc because of who they are. The Rise of the Runelords uses this technique in the first module with an Assamir NPC who became a BBEG because she was treated differently. You can do the exact same thing with your half elf or orc.
Re-skin equitment and background to make it more exotic. For example, my first PFS character (back before UC and Dragon Empires) was a Minkai 'Paladin'. She worshiped her divine Ancestress whom the Gai--barbarians of the Inner Sea called Sarenrae. She used a Glaive which she reffered to as a Naginata and a bastard sword she called a Katana. I dipped a level in Ranger, to expand her skills and also to give a Shinto-like feel with things like animal empathy.
She could be an Assamir, based on her background. Her Paladin abilities went back (as far as I was concerned) to her ancestress. In this way, she was Assamir-like, even if on paper she was human.
Also hair color, skin etc within reason are mutable, provided you have a logical background for it.
I don't get how the gold skin ala the 'The Mummy' is too exotic. Patricia Velasquez looked normal to me and when I read her ethnic background (Latin American, obviously with a good portion of Indian blood) nothing made me think of that, in and of itself as 'magical'. In Pathfinder terms she was a 'Shoati' bard playing an 'Osirian' character. Are you in Europe or the east coast?
Hopes this helps.
Kerney
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I don't get how the gold skin ala the 'The Mummy' is too exotic. Patricia Velasquez looked normal to me and when I read her ethnic background (Latin American, obviously with a good portion of Indian blood) nothing made me think of that, in and of itself as 'magical'. In Pathfinder terms she was a 'Shoati' bard playing an 'Osirian' character.
That's pretty much how I'd say it too. I would have no problem with you describing your skin as 'golden'.
I'm definitely willing to help pick out the stuff for 'boon-lite' characters, but I think it might be easier to do if it was on a character by character basis, instead of just by race. Unless you are playing something that needs to be able to Detect Undead, that ability is likely something that is overlookable for making a Dhampir-lite. Just my 2cp though.
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Matt, I don't know exactly what you are looking for here, but you need to be very careful with it.
For example if you take a bunch of stuff the emulates a race... as example say a Half-elf that has a bunch of stuff that emulates being an Aasimar I would have no problem you taking those abilities and say you have Aasimar blood in your heritage, but you would still be an Half-Elf.
I would not let you Re-Skin the Half-Elf with these powers and go around and seriously say your an Aasimar.
I would let you pretend or try to trick other in believing as such, but in truth you would still be an Half-Elf.
Like I said, what exactly are you looking for here?
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RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8
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That's what I'm looking for exactly.
Let's say Allie wants to play an aasimar, for the 'touched by celestials' aspect. She can't play an aasimar, but she wants to make a human/half elf/whatever, that is modeled around the 'touched by celestials' aspect. Again, going back to the post I linked. Short of naming her character Roma Downey, how can she do it?
If Allie was asking me, I'd suggest taking the birthmark trait and the magic trait that allows her to cast light 1/day. She won't have the stat bumps shifts, but can emulate that with a 20 point buy pretty easily. She won't have the resistances/immunities/etc. but that's not why she wants to play an aasimar. With those two traits, her character can honestly claim to be of celestial blood, and prove it. And she's not pigeonholed into taking a level of sorcerer for the celestial bloodline, or a level of summoner.
The end result I'm looking for isn't a 'reskinned half elf' It's a way of capturing the flavour of a planetouched as a starting point, for a 'normal' character.
While not as easy for a dhampir, and impossible for a tengu, Blood of Fiends points out that the tiefling/aasimar race is a fluke. You could have a couple that has 4 kids, and only one is an aasimar, even though they all have the same heritage. What I'm looking for* is ways to allow people to use the "exotic race as 'filler' for backstory."
Hope that helps.
*
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The end result I'm looking for isn't a 'reskinned half elf' It's a way of capturing the flavour of a planetouched as a starting point, for a 'normal' character.
I am still Confused, you say it is not Reskined, but your description sounds like exactly that.
Are you describing a human/half elf/whatever that has powers that emulate aasimar and insists that it is an aasimar and describes the PC as such, Describes her background as having aasimar parents and being raised as an aasimar?
Or are you describing a human/half elf/whatever that has powers that emulate aasimar but is still a human/half elf/whatever and fully admits to that, but describes her character as maybe having aasimar blood in her ancestry and that is why she has the mixture of powers? Or is just trying to deceive everyone in to thinking she is an aasimar?
The first is a Reskin, and you can't do in PFS, the second is workable and I may have some ideas for you.
Edit: In other words, say something was used that affected Humanoid (elf), what would her reaction be to that? Would she insist she was Outsider (native)?
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If your character is an aasimar and has a Hat of Disguise on, she can NOT make herself look like a elf. She's type Outsider, and not Humaniod. She can make herself look like a "LG Avenging Angel" or a Demon, but not like an Orc or Elf.
By the same token a half elf can NOT make himself look like a "LG Avenging Angel" because that is a different TYPE, which you can't change with the spell Disguise self.
So my Tiefling can disguise self as an Aasimar, or a "LG Avenging Angel", but not like a human.
or at least this is the way I understand it.
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If your character is an aasimar and has a Hat of Disguise on, she can NOT make herself look like a elf. She's type Outsider, and not Humaniod. She can make herself look like a "LG Avenging Angel" or a Demon, but not like an Orc or Elf.
By the same token a half elf can NOT make himself look like a "LG Avenging Angel" because that is a different TYPE, which you can't change with the spell Disguise self.
So my Tiefling can disguise self as an Aasimar, or a "LG Avenging Angel", but not like a human.
or at least this is the way I understand it.
Disguise self lets you appear as a different subtype. Angel is a subtype. Couple with a decent disguise check, and yes, you could look like an angel.
Shoot, an Aasimar is just a human with a glowing face. If I pick up a level of a spellcasting class, add dancing lights. Bam, I'm an aasimar.
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yeah... but not RAW.
you can change subtype, but not type.
just like you can't Hold Person an Aasimar, 'cause it only works on persons, and they are TYPE outsider, subtype native.
the bestiary entry reads like this...
AASIMAR CR 1/2
XP 200
Aasimar cleric 1
NG Medium outsider (native)
whereas an elf would be
Medium humanoid (elf )
Disguise Self reads:
You make yourself—including clothing, armor, weapons, and
equipment—look different. You can seem 1 foot shorter or taller,
thin, fat, or in between. You cannot change your creature type
(although you can appear as another subtype).
so... it doesn't make sense, but you cannot use the spell Disguise Self to make disguise an Aasimar as an Elf (or vise-versa). Like a Demon yes, or even a Fire Elemental, but not like a human or elf.
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You don't need to *be* one, you merely need to *look* like one. And if it takes magic to determine it, then that hat is all worth it.
"Hey, I'm not sure that giant, glowing, celestial paladin is really an angel. I'll wait till he gets close, then make a willsave, see if I can disbelieve an illusion."
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this would also mean that an Aasimar CAN use Alter Self to assume the form of an elf - but not the reverse.
Alter Self text:
When you cast this spell, you can assume the form of any
Small or Medium creature of the humanoid type.
so an Aasimar can use it to assume the form of an elf (type humaniod)(and it would gain low-light vision) but an elf cannot assume the form of an Aasimar (type outsider).
does this help?
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You don't need to *be* one, you merely need to *look* like one. And if it takes magic to determine it, then that hat is all worth it.
"Hey, I'm not sure that giant, glowing, celestial paladin is really an angel. I'll wait till he gets close, then make a willsave, see if I can disbelieve an illusion."
but Alexander, the Elf doesn't look like one. The magic SAYS it can't make him look like one. He'll look like a giant, glowing, Elven paladin... Celestial is a different Type. Just like Horse. Or Demon, or... lots of other TYPE creatures.
Maybe he can pull it off with a disguise kit. but not the spell Disguise Self. It says it doesn't do that.
You cannot change your creature type (although you can appear as another subtype).
Outsider is a type. Angel is a subtype (of the type).
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You don't need to *be* one, you merely need to *look* like one. And if it takes magic to determine it, then that hat is all worth it.
"Hey, I'm not sure that giant, glowing, celestial paladin is really an angel. I'll wait till he gets close, then make a willsave, see if I can disbelieve an illusion."
"disbelieve an illusion" does not apply. Interact would be what you need here, and most judges (and GMs) count this as more than just looking. Otherwise, distance would not matter - being closer doesn't make a difference.
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I am still Confused, you say it is not Reskined, but your description sounds like exactly that.
I dont think he is meaning that they would claim that the character is actually an aasimar, but that they have one in teir family tree somewhere, and that some of those traits (being emulated by the traits the character has taken) have been passed down to her through her family. Not a full fldged aasimar, just a *regular race* with a little something extra mixed in.
It'd be like if you wanted to play a human who has really big hairy feet cause there is a halfling somewhere in his family history. Still a human. Just with a little flavor added from some other race.
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"disbelieve an illusion" does not apply. Interact would be what you need here, and most judges (and GMs) count this as more than just looking. Otherwise, distance would not matter - being closer doesn't make a difference.You don't need to *be* one, you merely need to *look* like one. And if it takes magic to determine it, then that hat is all worth it.
"Hey, I'm not sure that giant, glowing, celestial paladin is really an angel. I'll wait till he gets close, then make a willsave, see if I can disbelieve an illusion."
All the better if they wait till he clocks em. And, well, its a fairly cheap item for a level 8 character.
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wow... ok, let's try this a different way.
Type is a catagory of creature.
sub-type is a smaller subset of a "type".
so... a Dragon Turtle is sub-type aquatic.
you are saying Disguse self would let an Elf PC disguse himself as a Dragon Turtle by changing his sub-type to aquatic?
(wow... this is a much better 1st level spell than I knew.)
My Tiefling cannot use Disguise Self to change the Type (to Elf) just the subtype (to Aasimar or some other creature with Type Outsider).
Understand now?
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All the better if they wait till he clocks em. And, well, its a fairly cheap item for a level 8 character."disbelieve an illusion" does not apply. Interact would be what you need here, and most judges (and GMs) count this as more than just looking. Otherwise, distance would not matter - being closer doesn't make a difference.You don't need to *be* one, you merely need to *look* like one. And if it takes magic to determine it, then that hat is all worth it.
"Hey, I'm not sure that giant, glowing, celestial paladin is really an angel. I'll wait till he gets close, then make a willsave, see if I can disbelieve an illusion."
sigh.... are you just "baiting the tiefling" here?
or do you really think a Hat of Disguise can make your PC look like a "giant, glowing, celestial paladin"?|
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All the better if they wait till he clocks em. And, well, its a fairly cheap item for a level 8 character."disbelieve an illusion" does not apply. Interact would be what you need here, and most judges (and GMs) count this as more than just looking. Otherwise, distance would not matter - being closer doesn't make a difference.You don't need to *be* one, you merely need to *look* like one. And if it takes magic to determine it, then that hat is all worth it.
"Hey, I'm not sure that giant, glowing, celestial paladin is really an angel. I'll wait till he gets close, then make a willsave, see if I can disbelieve an illusion."
sigh.... are you just "baiting the tiefling" here?
or do you really think a Hat of Disguise can make your PC look like a "giant, glowing, celestial paladin"?
Not all by itself. But, coupled with a light spell, enlarge person, being a Paladin, crazy strength, and being able to speak only celestial in combat? Its not just the hat. But all those spells, plus a decent disguise check? BTW, a disguise check only adds a -2 to look like a different race.
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It adds a +10, for adding a subtype. I don't see it listing as only certain subtypes. I may get (gasp!) table variation, and it is only done for fun.
OH! so this is akin to the kid who says "I have a glave with reduce person built into it to reduce the weapons size, that way I can hit things that are next to me and far away." Not ment to do more than Kewl. Got it.... I think.
by the way, what subtype are you adding? the "Native"?
A Solar has three subtypes...
Solar
NG Large outsider (angel, extraplanar, good)
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I have this sneaking suspicion that neither of you knows what the other is trying to say. I know I sure don't.I don't even know what I am saying!
That said, it does seem like Alex does not understand what how the spell disguise self works, but I could be reading him wrong.
Entirely possible. Could someone help illuminate the situation?
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RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8
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Amy's 'aasimar' is a half elf, she's subject to charm person, but not sleep, or example.
But Amy wants her 'by the rules half-elf' to have the background of celestial blood in her veins. So she picks traits to give her half-elf effectively 'aasimar light' by picking the traits/feats at first level to be able to 'show' her celestial heritage. Like I said, it all goes back to that post I linked to in the first post.
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]Entirely possible. Could someone help illuminate the situation?
You can not change the Creature type, but you can change the creatures sub-type, but that sub-type must actually exist for that type.
In other words a humanoid (elf) can look like a humanoid (human) but not say a humanoid (angel) because there is no such thing.
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Amy's 'aasimar' is a half elf, she's subject to charm person, but not sleep, or example.
But Amy wants her 'by the rules half-elf' to have the background of celestial blood in her veins. So she picks traits to give her half-elf effectively 'aasimar light' by picking the traits/feats at first level to be able to 'show' her celestial heritage. Like I said, it all goes back to that post I linked to in the first post.
That sounds fine.
I would make this suggestion, wait for the Advanced Race Guide to come out, there might be some options there.
I will also do some research myself. I don't know your resources, but I have them all.
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]Entirely possible. Could someone help illuminate the situation?You can not change the Creature type, but you can change the creatures sub-type, but that sub-type must actually exist for that type.
In other words a humanoid (elf) can look like a humanoid (human) but not say a humanoid (angel) because there is no such thing.
Gotcha. Well, that is a bummer. Time to find a different way to make the idea work.
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I am still Confused, you say it is not Reskined, but your description sounds like exactly that.Are you describing a human/half elf/whatever that has powers that emulate aasimar and insists that it is an aasimar and describes the PC as such, Describes her background as having aasimar parents and being raised as an aasimar?
First all, Assimars are born of a human and most of their children are human. Same with tieflings. Being one of these races is like having a rececive gene that is expressed in multiple ways. But that's besides the point. Anyway, recipe for legal pseudo-Assimar.
Okay, you start with a 1/2 elf. On hair, you state it's white. Eyes are golden. You take a couple traits like Matt suggested. You then go celestial sorcerer or paladin for class. Maybe you get the feat that should be a trait, pass for human.
When character is asked race, in game, she says, "well, mum was human, I never did find out what my father was." You then use your class abilities in a 'celestial' fashion.
Pretty soon, your fellow players start reffering to your character as an Assimar. You do not correct them and do not answer if they ask.
Mechanically, you are still a half elf. You are effected like a half elf. If the GM asks your race, you hand them your character sheet or a piece of paper and say 'please don't read it out loud'. Since he is a nice gent who supports good roleplaying, he nods and goes along.
As for whether it's legal. Well, my venture captain has a character whose class level combo has never been revealed. This doesn't seem very different.
Hope that helps, All the Best,
Kerney
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RPG Superstar 2010 Top 16
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Kerney, that sounds reasonable, as long as nobody pokes too hard.
Rangers with favored enemy outsiders (good) or humanoid (elf) would notice immediately that the character is not-an-outsider / an elf, right? I mean, you let PC rangers identify their favored enemies, yah? I would give anybody with ranks in Knowledge (planes) or Knowledge (local) a chance, too. That's what those skills are for.
If it were that easy to fool everybody about what race your character is, I would wonder why Pass for Human is worth a feat.
Your VC's PC's class levels are an entirely different thing. You can look at Harsk having a drink in a bar and tell he's a dwarf. You can't necessarily tell he's a ranger.
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when I role play something, I like to have the players at the table in on my fantasy. If I'm playing a character who wants people to treat him as an aasimar, I'll tell the other players and they normally enjoy playing along. I have a PC who is a Dwarf, but he pretends to be a gnome. every player at the table KNOWS he's a dwarf disguised as a gnome. But one of the PCs I play with a lot has a very low Wis... almost no perception (-2 I think) and his player has a great time Role Playing that he thinks my PC is a "Big Gnome". He went so far as to ask another gnome player (see, "another gnome") why he didn't have darkvision like my cleric. The other player said that my PC was a sverneblin (deep gnome) - but that was ok, I was just as good as any other gnome.
I tend not to keep secrets from the other players. I like to share the fun.
I realize this is not everyones play style, but try it sometime. Let the rest of us in on the joke... we can help too!
That's a fine way to play, and I've done it myself. I like to in most situations. Sometimes, I like to mix it up though. And in PFS, you can't always assume a player or GM will 'play along'. That's why I'm slightly more likely to go with my strategy if I don't know all the players.