My Tiefling Rogue just hit level 12, and my Dex ended up being 24(it will end on at least 26, if not 28), soooo, with me being Tiefling i can't really go get myself a suit of Celestial Armor and be done with it, also Mithral Chainshirt got max dex of +6 and Padded Armor while having Max Dex of 8, is useless cause it got +1 AC bonus. So help please ? Is there any armor i can get beyond ones mentioned here that would serve me better than Mithral Chainshirt ?
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Not really. The max dex thing is designed as a balancing factor so that you don't have guys with at 28 Dex and full plate running around with a 28 AC. You can get you chain shirt enchanted up to a +5, but that's about it. There's no way to increase the max dex, nor any armor that offers better than 10 AC (armor + Dex), unless your a fighter.
Bracers of armor not available?
Uh? Bracers of armor have no max dex bonus and the armor bonus can be set wherever you'd like up, or rather can afford up to a max of eight.
I'm pretty sure its in the UC. Just checked yup its in there silken ceremonial armor.
Where is silk armor?
Ultimate combat i think.
@Throkull that is not exactly true, Celestial Armor got Max Dex of 8 and AC of 6 (not counting +3 ench bonus), that is not counting Mithral, then a lot more armors got combined AC and Dex of over 10.
@blackbloodtroll i figure armored kilt is not made of metal, so it can't be really made of mithral neither :(
@Jak while they are available, they are too expensive at the moment and will probably continue to be expensive throughout the game. To just get back to AC i got now (27) i would need to pay 16k (BoA +4) for that money, i can upgrade my Chainshirt and get even higher AC.
Well thank you guys for replying :)
You say celestial and I'm thinking you guys are high enough that you got cash to blow. False conclusion on my part. Sorry about that. Yeah until you're rolling in dough or have a crafter on hand they can be somewhat prohibitively expensive.
We are 12th, i could spare for celestial armor tho, 22k for 9 AC and max dex of 8, pretty good deal, not so with BoA, even 25k one is only +5. Now i am really starting to regret picking up Tiefling =/
if you can use sources outside of pathfinder, in a 3.5 underdark book, Nightscale armor was introduced
cost:1000 ac:2 Max Dex: 10 check: 0 Spell Fail: 5% Speed: 30
I dont have the book availible anymore, so I looked it up internet style here
Now as I recall, technically this is like prettty much all drow items, in that if it come in contact with the sun it starts weakening, but I had a dm that allowed for me to use it in the past.
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We are 12th, i could spare for celestial armor tho, 22k for 9 AC and max dex of 8, pretty good deal, not so with BoA, even 25k one is only +5. Now i am really starting to regret picking up Tiefling =/
Wait a minute here, what in the world makes you think Tieflings can't wear Celestial Armor?
I mean, if you're evil that's a little different, but a Good or Neutral Tiefling is every bit as capable of wearing Celestial Armor as anyone else of those alignments. The armor is not racist.
We are 12th, i could spare for celestial armor tho, 22k for 9 AC and max dex of 8, pretty good deal, not so with BoA, even 25k one is only +5. Now i am really starting to regret picking up Tiefling =/
What's stopping you from getting Celestial Armor?
My Evilnessness :)
Character if anyones interested - http://www.dndsheets.net/view.php?id=34518
Edit: And fact that Tiefling in Celestial Armor looks silly.
Armored kilt can absolutely be mithral. Found silken armor, it stacks with nothing.
Absolutely is a bit of a stretch... The description does not suggest whether or not metal is its main component. You can reasonably choose to envision it as a metal plated kilt and use that in your games. However someone who rules that it is made from leather and/or padded armor is just as right as you. Hence, no absolutes on this matter.
PS. I would disallow the armored kilt, since it is the cheesiest armor item there existed until they made those eastern armors.
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Maybe talk with the GM about reflavoring Celestial Armor?
If not, your Mithral Chain Shirt is your best choice up until you hit Dex bonus of +10.
Either way you can potentially make things slightly better with a Sash of the War Champion (found in the APG, 4k GP, gives you Armor Training 1) assuming your GM doesn't make you take a level of Fighter to use it...though actually even if he does you have UMD.
If an armored kilt can be mithril, then can you have mithril studded leather? LOL The studs are metal, after all.
Master Arminas
majority of the item needs to be made of metal for mithril to do anything
Emulate an Alignment: Some magic items have positive or negative effects based on the user's alignment. Use Magic Device lets you use these items as if you were of an alignment of your choice. You can emulate only one alignment at a time.
Use your celestial armor and be evil. Just trick the armor into thinking your good.
Actually, unless I'm missing something Celestial armor doesn't do anything bad to baddies?...
Aura faint transmutation [good]; CL 5th
Slot armor; Price 22,400 gp; Weight 20 lbs.
DESCRIPTIONThis bright silver or gold +3 chainmail is so fine and light that it can be worn under normal clothing without betraying its presence. It has a maximum Dexterity bonus of +8, an armor check penalty of –2, and an arcane spell failure chance of 15%. It is considered light armor and allows the wearer to use fly on command (as the spell) once per day.
CONSTRUCTION REQUIREMENTSCraft Magic Arms and Armor, fly, creator must be good; Cost 11,350 gp.
Also, Celestial Armor does not say that it is made of Mithril. In fact, it specifically mentions silver and gold. That logically means that you could have Mithril Celestial Armor.
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Also, Celestial Armor does not say that it is made of Mithril. In fact, it specifically mentions silver and gold. That logically means that you could have Mithril Celestial Armor.
That is as logically solid as Dragonhide Gianthide armor..
BTW, when we move in the no-rules-disallow-it territory: Does anything prevent us from making items from more than one special material? Can't my adamantium armor be made from mithral?
Where does celestial armor says you have to be good to wear it? it just says you have to be good to create it..
Celestial Armor is a specific armor made its specific way. Making it out of some other material than the special one (gold and silver) listed and trying to get more bonuses out of an already bonus-high item is pure 100% DM territory.
-S
Count me in with the 'ask your GM to reflavor the Celestial Armor' camp.
That is as logically solid as Dragonhide Gianthide armor.
How so? Did I miss something that makes Celestial Armor not be able to be made of Mithril in the same way that any other thing that is made of metal can be? To me it sounds more like you are trying to specifically disallow it and haven't given a good reason.
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That is as logically solid as Dragonhide Gianthide armor.How so? Did I miss something that makes Celestial Armor not be able to be made of Mithril in the same way that any other thing that is made of metal can be? To me it sounds more like you are trying to specifically disallow it and haven't given a good reason.
Selgard pretty much states the reasons:
- Being a specific magic armor, the celestial armor has its materials specified. Being of gold and silver it cannot be made of mithral. Hence, my example of dragonhide gianthide, as that specific armor too has the materials described.
- @BBT: I don't see it as a matter of "I just don't like it". But being a specific armor, the rules does not provide for generel means to change it. While we could (and often should) make provisions based on similar rules, an item such as celestial armor has traits that moves beyond the normal magic armor system. There might be a reason that Celestial isn't made as a special ability for armor instead of being a specific armor.
Celestial Armor is a specific armor made its specific way. Making it out of some other material than the special one (gold and silver) listed and trying to get more bonuses out of an already bonus-high item is pure 100% DM territory.
Rules citation please?
Here, let me give some actual rules to support my claim.
When worked like steel, it becomes a wonderful material from which to create armor, and is occasionally used for other items as well. Most mithral armors are one category lighter than normal for purposes of movement and other limitations. Heavy armors are treated as medium, and medium armors are treated as light, but light armors are still treated as light. This decrease does not apply to proficiency in wearing the armor. A character wearing mithral full plate must be proficient in wearing heavy armor to avoid adding the armor's check penalty to all his attack rolls and skill checks that involve moving. Spell failure chances for armors and shields made from mithral are decreased by 10%, maximum Dexterity bonuses are increased by 2, and armor check penalties are decreased by 3 (to a minimum of 0).
Items not primarily of metal are not meaningfully affected by being partially made of mithral. (A longsword can be a mithral weapon, while a quarterstaff cannot.) Mithral weapons count as silver for the purpose of overcoming damage reduction.
Being that it is primarily made of metal it seems entirely within the rules to make it out of Mithril instead.
Being that it is primarily made of metal it seems entirely within the rules to make it out of Mithril instead.
You don't make a magic item into mithral, you do it the other way around.
If you have your mithral chainmail, it is exceedingly difficult to turn that into the celestial armor, which, per your quote above, is a "bright silver or gold +3 chainmail".
Being of gold and silver it cannot be made of mithral.
Where is this rule?
But being a specific armor, the rules does not provide for generel means to change it.
Where is this rule?
If you have your mithral chainmail, it is exceedingly difficult to turn that into the celestial armor...
Where is this rule?! Honestly, bud. It really seems like your just making stuff up.
By your reasoning you could not make Dragonhide Banded Mail because Banded Mail specifically says, "Banded mail is made up of overlapping strips of metal..." But I think we both know that isn't the case.
Being of gold and silver it cannot be made of mithral.Where is this rule?
At the top of the special material rules: "If you make a suit of armor or weapon out of more than one special material, you get the benefit of only the most prevalent material."
If you make it out of mithral, how are you going to make it into a gold or silver chainmail?
It is based on a rather logical assumption that the rules shouldn't specify. Just like we make a lot of assumptions in the game based on common sense, as to gravity, movement speed of PC classes not being fly speed, characters having bodily functions...
But being a specific armor, the rules does not provide for generel means to change it.Where is this rule?
Where is the rule allowing it? The magic item creation rules, allow for adding a lot of different abilities to an armor, which are described in the rules. Additionally the rules provides some specific items that have abilities that goes beyond the normal rules. Being specific they expand upon the general system.
If you have your mithral chainmail, it is exceedingly difficult to turn that into the celestial armor...Where is this rule?! Honestly, bud. It really seems like your just making stuff up.
By your reasoning you could not make Dragonhide Banded Mail because Banded Mail specifically says, "Banded mail is made up of overlapping strips of metal..." But I think we both know that isn't the case.
I'd like you to provide some rules, that actually points to the matter with specific items.
By your reasoning, you could make a dragonhide gianthide armor, since we ignore the description of the specific armor. Heck, we might also take the Mithral Full Plate of Speed and make it into adamantium.
That is as logically solid as Dragonhide Gianthide armor.How so? Did I miss something that makes Celestial Armor not be able to be made of Mithril in the same way that any other thing that is made of metal can be? To me it sounds more like you are trying to specifically disallow it and haven't given a good reason.
I agree with HeraldKlak. Celestial armor is already the best armor by far in the game: it's already breaking all the rules by existing, you certainly don't need it to make it mithril.
I suggest either reshaping the armor (paint it black and red, put a couple of skull-shaped things on it) or donning the way it is. For the second option, talk to your master into making you fight a paladin or something wearing it, kill him, put on his/her armor with a locket of his hair, then go to town with a big smile: be different from all the other brooding emo tiefling out there, be evil with class.
A Dagger of Venom, can be adamantine Dagger of Venom. This totally doable. Would you tell a player his cloak of the magi can't be pink, because it is not described as so?
Of course I would, but that wouldn't make it RAW (or need to be for that matter).
Dagger of Venom is SIAC, so it is pretty easy to adjust to another item.
Celestial Armor is not so simple, as it isn't just an ability granted to an item, but a set of bonusses, which the rules doesn't not allow us to calculate a price for. Just tacking that on to any other item is not as straight forward.
Modifying premade magic items exist in a somewhat undefined area of the rules. While this shouldn't stop us from doing it anyway, it does stop us from being able to claim taht this or that is RAW, just because developers haven't spent space to disallow it.
Why are you assuming the description of being silver and gold is not a visually description?
It's a tough call imho, most metal armor is described as being made of steel, and they can be made of mithral as well, however celestial armor is a specific item and it's capabilities could be argued to exist solely as a product of it's manufacture, including specific base ingredients(silver and gold), unless of course again it's just colored silver and gold(a distinct possibility).
That said no one would make armor from "primarily" gold and silver, it would not serve the function of armor so I assume it to be primarily steel with silver and gold etching, embossing, etc on it.
Do I think it was the intention of the developers to have it be made of mithral? Perhaps not, but not everything I rule is only based off of what the developers intended, part of the beauty of table top is there is no coding disallowing me to make mithral celestial armor!
Actually, my group views the 'silver and gold' as 'having a silver and cold coloring theme', and the ridiculously high Max Dex, low ACP and reduced ASF indicate that the whole thing is made of Mithral in the first place.
Celestial armor is not mithral—it's actually made of silver or gold (as mentioned in its description), and thus doesn't gain any of the standard modifiers for being mithral at all. It's its own thing. Its lower arcane spell failure and higher max Dex bonus are a result of its magical qualities, not what it's made out of. In addition, this magic allows folks to wear it as if it were light armor—the mithral versions don't do this because mithral isn't fundamentally magical like the enhancements on celestial armor.
In any event, celestial armor isn't an armor quality. It's a unique kind of armor, and thus has a unique pricing. It does weird stuff; it's really light, it's made of gold, it's REALLY nice looking, it lets you fly, and so on. Its pricing is a result of ALL of these elements, and that's pretty much that.
Second Quote from James Jacobs
- Gauss
Edit: added second quote I found.