| Owly |
I have a player who is grooming his archer to become an Arcane Archer. The party is currently 4th level. He's fond of staying to the rear, and ...well...arching.
QUESTION: Simply put, how do my npc's spot an archer when he's firing at long range? Some of those ranges can get pretty impressive. Does the combat system assume they're "on the map" if they're not stealthed? Give the NPC's a spot bonus since there's a stick pointing back that way?
| SenahBirdR |
Also keep in mind that most terrains have a maximum visible distance that applies to both the PCs and the NPCs. This should severely limit how far back an archer can hang and still attack. Desert, mountain and plains terrain are the ones highly valuable to archers. Hence small groups tend to sneak along in forested or hilly areas to provide cover. An another important point is that the archer is automaticallly seen unless intentionally stealthy. Which should be no problem to remain hidden initially at long range with the +1 DC/10' of the Perception check, which is +2 DC/10' in forests or +1 DC/20' in mountains. Once an archer starts shooting they are automatically seen unless they attempt to snipe, which is a -20 on the Stealtch Check and requires a move action. A sniping archer with Vital Strike at that distance can be a serious threat.
| Frankthedm |
An encounter doesn't take place in a vacuum. Straying too far from the party can and should occasionally trigger a separate encounter for the archer.
If the archer separates from the party, the archer better PRAY that a pack of ambush predators hasn't been stalking the party by scent. Because if they have, the lone member separated from it's herd is EXACTLY what the pack hunters have been waiting for. They will not care about Appropriate Encounter Levels or fair fights, they will charge the lone archer, kill him and tear him apart.
| SenahBirdR |
Being attacked by a predatory pack once in a while can be a good way to keep the players on their toes. As is having the enemies have their own hanging back archers. Or forward scout/rogue/assassins. However this should not be taken to an extreme of punishing players for using their capabilities wisely. For an archer I find that hanging back about 70 feet or so optimal. That places one out of charge range for most enemies, yet leaves you close enough to maneuver against retreating enemies or to retreat back to the group if the situation turns sour out in the back. I currently play a halfling sling ranger so I really hang about 40 feet back when I can. That gives me opportunity to sneak around but I can still close when I need to. My slingstaff also gives me some melee backup when I am charged or enemies come from behind.
| StreamOfTheSky |
Perception as an opposed check is basically only when the other guy is using stealth. Otherwise, visibility range is limited solely by terrain/weather/surroundings, with a moderately difficult flat DC check possibly required in fog and the like.
If the guy isn't hiding, you do not need to make a perception check at all to see him, in general. I can see someone 400 ft away without needing to be able to make a DC 40 perception check. You may need to beat a (again, flat DC) perception check to make out fine details like what shoes she's wearing and if "she" is actually a "he" (ok, that's getting more into the disguise skill, heh), but you could certainly see and shoot at someone in the distance.
The above may or may not be RAW, but it's definitely RAI / common freaking sense.
D&D 3.0 had EXCELLENT rules for starting encounter distance and spot check DCs for various terrain / night time. For some reason, all of this wonderfully useful info was left out of 3.5 and there's been nothing but confusion ever since. :(
| SenahBirdR |
The penalty/bonus for spotting your enemy at night would fall under the favorable/unfavorable/terrible condition modifiers for Perception checks. Generally speaking in a clear day out in the open you get +2 bonus, seeing into dim light a -2, and trying to notice someone in complete darkness a -5. Though the description for these bonuses and penalties are poor and say torchlight and candlelight for the unfavorable and terrible modifiers. They should have used the general light effect descriptors not the source of light.
Different terrain does have different DC effects on spotting, and maximum spotting distance. It is in the enviroment section. So that is still there.
I do agree that determining the starting distance for an encounter is not explcitly stated, but you notice your opponents at a specific distance (barring stealth) and then combat would start depending on if you started acting violent right then or once you came closer. I would further add as a house rule, maybe RAI, that when two groups are stealthing the distance automatically closes to the furthest point the Perception that someone eventually sees the other side and gets their surprise round. I also allow characters to keep receiving surprise rounds until the "surprising" group does something that gets them seen (comes close enough that the other side's previous Perception check indicates they should be seen) or does something that should the other side into initiative order.