Reflex save replacing Initiative roll ?

[Maxximilius]

Just toying around the idea. Naturally buffs nimble classes with high Reflex saves like the Rogue, nerfs spellcasters. Lightning Reflexes would obviously not increase this initiative roll ; only Reflex-related saving throws, same for Improved Initiative.
Could it be a viable idea, or am I missing something ?

[ShadowcatX]

I don't see why not to allow lightning reflexes / improved initiative to work. Reflex is the weakest of the saving throws, so lightning reflexes has always been an under powered feat, adding +2 initiative would make it about right, IMO. What about a cloak of resistance?

You are adding a lot of power to the paladin though and taking some away from the inquisitor.

Edit: If you have to house rule everything that adds to saving throws to not work for initiative, then its probably a bad rule. (A house rule that needs other house rules to function isn't a good idea, IMO.)

[Maxximilius]

Lightning reflexes is underpowered... but adding both to saves and Initiative would probably be too good in comparison to other similar feats.

Classes that get a bonus to their Initiative rolls would still get this bonus. The only exception being that they use their base Reflex bonus + their Dexterity modifier instead of only their Dexterity modifier for the purposes of an initiative roll.
Resistance bonuses to saving throws would only apply to saving throws, not initiative rolls.

EDIT : It's not something that requires several houserules to comprehend, the final rule would be "to roll Initiative, you roll a d20 to which you add the base Reflex bonus to saving throws given by your class + your Dexterity modifier".

[cranewings]

The system as is, is not balanced. This will have little impact, but it will help the characters that are suppose to be faster, seem faster. I like it. Just let all bonuses stack. Who cares.

[xorial]

I suggested this many time on these boards. I either get a bunch of people saying NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO...or a bunch saying it's great. I have used this & it is just fine with no issues.

[Maxximilius]

Well, I'm still waiting for the people saying nooooo. Again, just I idea I wanted to share, as I believe some may like it enough as to incorporate it in their own game. I don't see any real issues with the concept, except that people may not like how it puts the power back to high-base reflex saves classes.

[TriOmegaZero]

No thanks, I get widely varying initiative counts as it is. I prefer there to be a small span of numbers, hence my plan to change initiative rolls to d12 instead of d20.

[Shifty]

TriOmegaZero wrote:

No thanks, I get widely varying initiative counts as it is. I prefer there to be a small span of numbers, hence my plan to change initiative rolls to d12 instead of d20.

I remember the old days of D6.

[TriOmegaZero]

Man, give that d12 the love!

[Shifty]

D12 needs a bit more attention. Since it stopped being used to resolve Longsword damage it has really been cast adrift.

[Hodge Podge]

Poor d12. :(

But yeah, I like this. It makes sense to me, so I'll probably start using it at some point. Thanks. :D

[demontroll]

Well your system has good intentions, but since high charisma Paladins have insane saves, I can't support anything that helps them.

Why not just use the standard system, but house rule Fighters/monks gaining +2 class bonus to initiative and rogues/ninja getting +4.

[Maxximilius]

Again, paladins would not get their Charisma to Initiative. Initiative rolls would use the base Reflex save as much as a CMB roll uses BAB : it uses the same basis as another kind of roll, but with it's own bonuses.

[Terronus]

Maybe letting lightning reflexes let you refill initiative once a day or something? I think it is an interesting idea.