I'm running a short game, its just a city and 3 dungeons, followed by an epic level boss. The problem is, I'm not the main DM, he's currently busy, but, he allowed me to run a short interlude for the time being. I have the whole campaign worked out, thats not the issue. The issue is, the DM kind of plays favorites with 1 member in particular, and nothing I throw at her now, works.
She was a 18th level paladin, with Serithial, from the Curse of the Crimson Throne module. Then, after defeating Ileosa, she got the ring(and several 'good' cards from the deck of many things'. But, in the mean time, he led the Paladin and Sorcerer on a side adventure, and gave them both artifacts. So, on top of immunity to all sorts of stuff, saving throws in the upper 30's all around, and able to Brilliant Energy her sword more times then I can throw enemies at her, I'm really stuck. She also has leadership, and a level 16 silver dragon co-hort. (OH, and the artifact upped her to level 20, with everything else).
So, I need to know what I can throw at the Paladin, that isn't evil, outsider or half-dragon. She dropped an evil outsider of 300 HP in one shot. I'm looking for something that won't be affected by Brilliant Energy. This isn't supposed to be impossible, but, I at least want the players to feel like there was some challenge involved. Instead of just walking behind the Paladin who kills everything in one shot.
I stopped using Evil enemies, or outsiders(yeah, I went back and editted my adventure, but I mean, I want this to be fun, not a joke run for gold), I have 1 other evil char, and the other 2 bosses are neutral. But, with the BE power on her sword, I don't want to use a humanoid, if necessary, I'll make the boss a Golem, or Warforged, or something along those lines. Any other advice would be greatly appreciated.
I'm running a short game, its just a city and 3 dungeons, followed by an epic level boss. The problem is, I'm not the main DM, he's currently busy, but, he allowed me to run a short interlude for the time being. I have the whole campaign worked out, thats not the issue. The issue is, the DM kind of plays favorites with 1 member in particular, and nothing I throw at her now, works.
She was a 18th level paladin, with Serithial, from the Curse of the Crimson Throne module. Then, after defeating Ileosa, she got the ring(and several 'good' cards from the deck of many things'. But, in the mean time, he led the Paladin and Sorcerer on a side adventure, and gave them both artifacts. So, on top of immunity to all sorts of stuff, saving throws in the upper 30's all around, and able to Brilliant Energy her sword more times then I can throw enemies at her, I'm really stuck. She also has leadership, and a level 16 silver dragon co-hort. (OH, and the artifact upped her to level 20, with everything else).
So, I need to know what I can throw at the Paladin, that isn't evil, outsider or half-dragon. She dropped an evil outsider of 300 HP in one shot. I'm looking for something that won't be affected by Brilliant Energy. This isn't supposed to be impossible, but, I at least want the players to feel like there was some challenge involved. Instead of just walking behind the Paladin who kills everything in one shot.
I stopped using Evil enemies, or outsiders(yeah, I went back and editted my adventure, but I mean, I want this to be fun, not a joke run for gold), I have 1 other evil char, and the other 2 bosses are neutral. But, with the BE power on her sword, I don't want to use a humanoid, if necessary, I'll make the boss a Golem, or Warforged, or something along those lines. Any other advice would be greatly appreciated.
Single BBEG's dont stand much of a chance. It is more challenging to have a lower CR BBEG with mooks protecting him/getting in the way so the full BAB guys don't have a clear path to him. The entire time the BBEG is in the back tagging the party with the magic.
That way the paladin still gets to use his smite which is probably a big reason why he chose the class, but he does not get to use it immediately to make the bosses cry in 2 rounds.
A huge horde of rust monsters.while you yell " TAKE THAT METAL GEAR!!!"
You could always go for the quicken empowered harm and power word kill.
Sounds like they are way way over wealth by level. Dont know if there is anything you can challenge them with without be cheesey.
Edit - you could go for a straight beat down BBEG encounter.
Cleric BBEG with a wizard co-hort. Hired a merc group of Barbarian with greater elemental rage and greater beast totem. Make everyone neutral because not everyone who opposes a PC is evil. Some just have a different view of things
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1) Context of fights
Disjunction, Anti-magic sphere, encounters where the enemy isn't hosed by movement but the PCs are (like difficult terrain or environments that make fly checks tough).
2) Action economy
So he kills 1 monster a round...if there are many they will persist. Space them out.
3) Specific Precautions
If ranged - wind wall
If mellee - miss chance
A huge horde of rust monsters.while you yell " TAKE THAT METAL GEAR!!!"
You could always go for the quicken empowered harm and power word kill.
Sounds like they are way way over wealth by level. Dont know if there is anything you can challenge them with without be cheesey.
Edit - you could go for a straight beat down BBEG encounter.
Cleric BBEG with a wizard co-hort. Hired a merc group of Barbarian with greater elemental rage and greater beast totem. Make everyone neutral because not everyone who opposes a PC is evil. Some just have a different view of things
The Paladin is immune to all mind compulsion effects, such as power word stun and kill.
Honestly, I would still use outsiders myself in this scenario. But, instead of typical ones, I'd throw some Aeons up against them. Not one aeon, but rather several to many aeons.
These are beings of pure neutrality. It's not a stretch at all to see them going after the paladin and her companions for tipping the balance of Good vs Evil too far in the direction of good.
And since smite evil only goes into overdrive if the outsider in question has the evil subtype, you're in the clear. (but I might have an evil enemy or two try to capitalize on the heroes vs aeons fight and show up to complicate things. That way the Paladin can still get some mileage out of a core class ability.)
EDIT: Inevitables would also be suitable, and if I'm not mistaken would not be overcome by brilliant energy.
anyone else thinking of a 20th level fight with a vorpal scimitar and the imp crit feat? Target auto killed on a natural 15+.
edit - Unless hes immune to crits to for some reason.
Edit 2 - You could always go with my stand by. Magic missle mage from hell. Intensifed , maximized , empowered magic missles x2 per round ( one via a quicken rod )
Vorpal only works on a natural 20 Tagion >.< Has been that way since 3.5anyone else thinking of a 20th level fight with a vorpal scimitar and the imp crit feat? Target auto killed on a natural 15+.
edit - Unless hes immune to crits to for some reason.
awww really? crap nevermind then.
.......Throw Sovereign Glue on there feet and grapple them to keep them in place?
Bunch of rogues with the quick steal and greater steal feats?
i think we could probably help out better if we know what pally was immune to.
As a lvl 18 pally he is immune to:
Fear
Disease
Charms
Compulsions
With this new Artifact that the DM granted the Paladin, she's level 20, for all intents and purposes, she's immune to energy drains also, cause I was gonna throw some level downs her way.
With this new Artifact that the DM granted the Paladin, she's level 20, for all intents and purposes, she's immune to energy drains also, cause I was gonna throw some level downs her way.As a lvl 18 pally he is immune to:
Fear
Disease
Charms
Compulsions
What is the artifact?
Do the bad guys know about it?Can they use it if they get it?
If not do they have anyone who has ranks in knowledge religion or arcana so they can find out how to destroy it if they do get it?
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I like the Lower CR BBEG with lots of minions/cohorts. Make it really fun for them... make them advanced Fast Zombies but the BBEG is Alchemist with implant bomb. Yeah they can kill each Zombie in 1 hit but BOOM! Makes going through a horde of little guys much more interesting. If they have alot of immunities to energies... just switch out bomb type for force or sonic.
Also... not sure if pathfinder has it but 3.5 has rules for Zombie swarms. yeah a 1 hit die zombie cannot hit a high level PC except on a 20 but with swarms of zombies you do dmg each round no matter what their AC is. If PF does not have it using the swarm rules in back of the bestiary should make it easy to make.
I like the Lower CR BBEG with lots of minions/cohorts. Make it really fun for them... make them advanced Fast Zombies but the BBEG is Alchemist with implant bomb. Yeah they can kill each Zombie in 1 hit but BOOM! Makes going through a horde of little guys much more interesting. If they have alot of immunities to energies... just switch out bomb type for force or sonic.
There were 3.5 zombies that exploded and did cold damage based on the HD of the zombie. I will use those for Carrion Crown. Thanks for the reminder. :)
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There were 3.5 zombies that exploded and did cold damage based on the HD of the zombie. I will use those for Carrion Crown. Thanks for the reminder. :)
Your welcome. I do remember those... it was the cascading effect. Then their were those that blew up in negative energy burst that hurt you and healed the other undeads around them. Pretty nasty buggers.
Your welcome. I do remember those... it was the cascading effect. Then their were those that blew up in negative energy burst that hurt you and healed the other undeads around them. Pretty nasty buggers.
There were 3.5 zombies that exploded and did cold damage based on the HD of the zombie. I will use those for Carrion Crown. Thanks for the reminder. :)
That might be what I am talking about.
After checking: Yeah that was it, which also reminds me I have never use the cyst spells from Libris Mortis on anyone.
Not even on the DM? :(Your welcome. I do remember those... it was the cascading effect. Then their were those that blew up in negative energy burst that hurt you and healed the other undeads around them. Pretty nasty buggers.
There were 3.5 zombies that exploded and did cold damage based on the HD of the zombie. I will use those for Carrion Crown. Thanks for the reminder. :)That might be what I am talking about.
After checking: Yeah that was it, which also reminds me I have never use the cyst spells from Libris Mortis on anyone.
Most NPC's die in combat(first contact) so I saw no reason to take them as a PC, but as a GM I can make them suffer even if they win a fight.
I think you missed my joke Wraithstrike.Most NPC's die in combat(first contact) so I saw no reason to take them as a PC, but as a GM I can make them suffer even if they win a fight.Not even on the DM? :(Your welcome. I do remember those... it was the cascading effect. Then their were those that blew up in negative energy burst that hurt you and healed the other undeads around them. Pretty nasty buggers.
There were 3.5 zombies that exploded and did cold damage based on the HD of the zombie. I will use those for Carrion Crown. Thanks for the reminder. :)That might be what I am talking about.
After checking: Yeah that was it, which also reminds me I have never use the cyst spells from Libris Mortis on anyone.
I thought it was a joke, but I was not sure. I blame it on the fact that it is 5 AM. :)
With this new Artifact that the DM granted the Paladin, she's level 20, for all intents and purposes, she's immune to energy drains also, cause I was gonna throw some level downs her way.As a lvl 18 pally he is immune to:
Fear
Disease
Charms
CompulsionsWhat is the artifact?
Do the bad guys know about it?
Can they use it if they get it?
If not do they have anyone who has ranks in knowledge religion or arcana so they can find out how to destroy it if they do get it?
I'm not sure exactly, I was apparently not supposed to know at all, but, since I'm running a one shot, they had to tell me, so, the DM was going to bolster them and not tell me and my partner anything at all. Big surprise there. Anyway, I think it was called either the Spear(or Sphere) of Imodae. And, the Sorcerer, who hasn't got as big of a boon from his, got some piece of a set, of Artifacts regarding Nethys, God of Magic.
My idea for now, is, since I can't -stop- Brilliant Energy, I'll fool the Paladin, the BBEG is a Chaotic Neutral Rakshasa, so, I was going to have the big fight lead up to him in his Shapeshifted form, THEN, have him 'lie' about changing to his true form but, he just shapeshift into the look of a Golem, so, she thinks her Brilliant Energy doesn't work.
Edit 1: To make things more....'fun' I did give the Rakshasa a Half Plate of Determination, so, once his HP hits 0, he gets back up at full HP once. I also gave him the spell Clone, in case things get dicey, but, those are just prepared bandaids for a broken face, lol.
Edit 2: I've decided to put some adds in the big fight, 2 stone golems. I had a question, their AC is pretty low, would it be feasable to craft armor around them, like, giving a stone golem iron fullplate, for the purpose of further increasing its AC, maybe adding magic trinkets? Could you add a amulet or ring of proc to a stone golem?
With this new Artifact that the DM granted the Paladin, she's level 20, for all intents and purposes, she's immune to energy drains also, cause I was gonna throw some level downs her way.As a lvl 18 pally he is immune to:
Fear
Disease
Charms
CompulsionsWhat is the artifact?
Do the bad guys know about it?
Can they use it if they get it?
If not do they have anyone who has ranks in knowledge religion or arcana so they can find out how to destroy it if they do get it?I'm not sure exactly, I was apparently not supposed to know at all, but, since I'm running a one shot, they had to tell me, so, the DM was going to bolster them and not tell me and my partner anything at all. Big surprise there. Anyway, I think it was called either the Spear(or Sphere) of Imodae. And, the Sorcerer, who hasn't got as big of a boon from his, got some piece of a set, of Artifacts regarding Nethys, God of Magic.
My idea for now, is, since I can't -stop- Brilliant Energy, I'll fool the Paladin, the BBEG is a Chaotic Neutral Rakshasa, so, I was going to have the big fight lead up to him in his Shapeshifted form, THEN, have him 'lie' about changing to his true form but, he just shapeshift into the look of a Golem, so, she thinks her Brilliant Energy doesn't work.
To make things more....'fun' I did give the Rakshasa a Half Plate of Determination, so, once his HP hits 0, he gets back up at full HP once. I also gave him the spell Clone, in case things get dicey, but, those are just prepared bandaids for a broken face, lol.
I cant believe he dropped a game on you but did not give you all the info. That sucks.
Dispel Magic stops brilliant energy.
With this new Artifact that the DM granted the Paladin, she's level 20, for all intents and purposes, she's immune to energy drains also, cause I was gonna throw some level downs her way.As a lvl 18 pally he is immune to:
Fear
Disease
Charms
CompulsionsWhat is the artifact?
Do the bad guys know about it?
Can they use it if they get it?
If not do they have anyone who has ranks in knowledge religion or arcana so they can find out how to destroy it if they do get it?I'm not sure exactly, I was apparently not supposed to know at all, but, since I'm running a one shot, they had to tell me, so, the DM was going to bolster them and not tell me and my partner anything at all. Big surprise there. Anyway, I think it was called either the Spear(or Sphere) of Imodae. And, the Sorcerer, who hasn't got as big of a boon from his, got some piece of a set, of Artifacts regarding Nethys, God of Magic.
My idea for now, is, since I can't -stop- Brilliant Energy, I'll fool the Paladin, the BBEG is a Chaotic Neutral Rakshasa, so, I was going to have the big fight lead up to him in his Shapeshifted form, THEN, have him 'lie' about changing to his true form but, he just shapeshift into the look of a Golem, so, she thinks her Brilliant Energy doesn't work.
To make things more....'fun' I did give the Rakshasa a Half Plate of Determination, so, once his HP hits 0, he gets back up at full HP once. I also gave him the spell Clone, in case things get dicey, but, those are just prepared bandaids for a broken face, lol.
I cant believe he dropped a game on you but did not give you all the info. That sucks.
Dispel Magic stops brilliant energy.
Are you sure? Its one of her Paladin powers, Serethial doesn't have BE normally, but, she uses her divine bond to give her sword the BE property. So, using Dispel magic would negate that? Antimagic Field perhaps?
Are you sure? Its one of her Paladin powers, Serethial doesn't have BE normally, but, she uses her divine bond to give her sword the BE property. So, using Dispel magic would negate that? Antimagic...
Divine Bond (Sp): Upon reaching 5th level, a paladin forms a divine bond with her god. This bond can take one of two forms. Once the form is chosen, it cannot be changed.
SP=spell like ability and those can be dispelled.
The caster level is equal to the caster's HD when using SLA's.
Being a spell-like ability it also provokes attacks of opportunity.
IIRC the paladin is level 18 so the DC is 29. In short if the main bad guy has 20 caster level he has to roll a 9 on the dice. Give him a low level witch to use the hex on the BBEG that allow him to take the better of two rolls.
Fortune (Su): The witch can grant a creature within 30 feet a bit of good luck for 1 round. The target can call upon this good luck once per round, allowing him to reroll any ability check, attack roll, saving throw, or skill check, taking the better result. He must decide to use this ability before the first roll is made. At 8th level and 16th level, the duration of this hex is extended by 1 round. Once a creature has benefited from the fortune hex, it cannot benefit from it again for 24 hours.
edit:It makes the sword nonmagical period for 1d4 rounds. Using empower(metamagic feat) on the dispel magic might help make it longer.
edit2: Have the witch cast ill omen on the paladin which forces him to roll twice, and then cast disjunction on the sword. That shuts it down for 1min per caster level.
An anti-magic field would wreak havoc with a lot of the paladin's class features (all Su and Sp ones, at least, plus any spellcasting). Depending on the circumstances, a dragon wouldn't mind fighting in a large anti-magic field as it still has a multitude of Ex attacks and the like, but the paladin can't Smite Evil (plus her armour and weapons are temporarily reduced to masterwork items).
I didn't suggest the antimagic field because it is personal IIRC, and it would have to be widened to make sure the paladin did not use a reach weapon.
Ill Omen is a compulsion so never mind for that idea. I forgot the pally was immune to those.
I had fun sending my party into a pit with an anti-magic field trap and a carniverous blob. Surprisingly effective. It should be noted that AMF has no effect on artifacts.
So, any word on putting armor/trinkets on golems? It doesn't say on the monsters info that I -can't- but, it doesn't say I can either.
Point of interest: Just because the Paladin is immune to everything under the sun does not make the other party members immune. Dominate something friendly. My next session, which is essentially a one-shot because we have rotating GMs, will involve an Antipaladin and an Enchanter team for the main fight. The Antipaladin is ranged. This means you can use Smite Good + Greater Named Bullet (auto-crit on the non-GNB damage) to really scare the Paladin right out the door.
Pull out the Advanced Races Guide playtest file, make a Construct race, then make a Duelist out of it. Why, hello there, impotent Brilliant Energy!
As mentioned before, non-evil enemies are great. Inevitables, Aeons, Primordials, etc. are all good choices.
Point of interest: Just because the Paladin is immune to everything under the sun does not make the other party members immune. Dominate something friendly. My next session, which is essentially a one-shot because we have rotating GMs, will involve an Antipaladin and an Enchanter team for the main fight. The Antipaladin is ranged. This means you can use Smite Good + Greater Named Bullet (auto-crit on the non-GNB damage) to really scare the Paladin right out the door.
Pull out the Advanced Races Guide playtest file, make a Construct race, then make a Duelist out of it. Why, hello there, impotent Brilliant Energy!
As mentioned before, non-evil enemies are great. Inevitables, Aeons, Primordials, etc. are all good choices.
I have never heard of Inevitables, not sure what those even are. But, I've decided that I'm adding a few mobs to the fight. 2 Iron Golems, a witch cohort, and then a summoned Pit Fiend. :)
I have never heard of Inevitables, not sure what those even are. But, I've decided that I'm adding a few mobs to the fight. 2 Iron Golems, a witch cohort, and then a summoned Pit Fiend. :)Point of interest: Just because the Paladin is immune to everything under the sun does not make the other party members immune. Dominate something friendly. My next session, which is essentially a one-shot because we have rotating GMs, will involve an Antipaladin and an Enchanter team for the main fight. The Antipaladin is ranged. This means you can use Smite Good + Greater Named Bullet (auto-crit on the non-GNB damage) to really scare the Paladin right out the door.
Pull out the Advanced Races Guide playtest file, make a Construct race, then make a Duelist out of it. Why, hello there, impotent Brilliant Energy!
As mentioned before, non-evil enemies are great. Inevitables, Aeons, Primordials, etc. are all good choices.
Inevitables are manifestations of Law, functioning purely on logic. Many of them are constructs. They are typically LN aligned.
Well, this is/was my one shot. The main caster of the group. A Tiefling Sorcerer named Gomoric, is approached by a familiar with a letter of invitation. The sweet words and invitation to a secret society of mages is too much for the Tiefling to pass up, and, wanting to gloat to his allies, invites them along.
Upon arrival at the destination, all the party finds is a small temple(30x30) with 4 pillars, with words carved into them, Elven. The four words are, Knowledge, Wisdom, Intelligence, and Experience.
After some looking around, the party finally decides to step into a teleportation circle and are sent up to the floating city of Greymire. Though it is considered a city, they have no need of a shopkeep, and as such, the town has no shops, and no wares for sale.
On arrival, the party notices 6 Golems around the room, and surmise its for defensive purposes, likely to keep unwanted visitors out. Also, around the floating city is a regenerating cloud of acid.
Upon leaving the underground entrance(as thats where the exit of the circle was), The party is greeted by a half elf named Bahrune. He is the headmaster of the magic college, the society, and essentially, the mayor of the city. Invited to explore and look around the city, the party, a half-orc cleric of Gorum, a paladin of Imodae, and a human summoner(not counting the Tiefling, or their cohorts, yay for leadership feat).
After a quick look around the Library, College, and City hall, they stop in at the Tavern to eat up and then retire for the evening. (At this point, I would have initiated a surprise attack, upon arrival at their resting quarters, but, the sorcerer has a psuedo-dragon for a pet, and, it detected the invisible being in the room.) With a failed attempt to kidnap the partys main spell caster, the captured man admits he is doing this for the headmaster, that his family was taken hostage, and that the place is a trap.
The party immediately return to the teleport pad, only to find out its been dimensionally locked, and there is no way out. From here, the party decides to rest regardless, and investigate in the morning. (From here, they explore either the Library, College, or City hall, encounter nothing but mage enemies, and after some exploring, find a secret door in each building, leading to a underground dungeon.)
I just thought I'd share that with everyone here, incase someone wanted to take my concept and tweak it. The end boss is a Rakshasa, level 25, with character levels in Sorcerer(10), Cleric(5) and Mystic Theurge(10). He has Mithril Fullplate of Determination +3 on(instant Breath of Life, upon death, or 0 HP) and the Clone spell active. He has a level 23 Witch(14 Witch, 9 Demoniac), and the Demon Lord she is tethered to. I added 2 Iron Golems, since its essentially a 8 on 3 fight, a 8-5 isn't as rough.
The gist of everything is;Elves weren't always the people that we'd thought them to be. Long, long ago, forgotten, even by them, they were power hungry, magically power hungry. Within the walls of this floating city, beneath the stone and rock, lies a chamber that drains away ones magic power, and grants it to another. The partys main caster was the target of this, and the headmaster, sought to drain the sorcerer of all his magic powers and grant them to himself. (feel free to bolster the boss with more spells then normal, to reflect his doing this previously)
I think it would be a fun boss to re-encounter, since he'll only show up once his new Clone is created and he can regain his 2 levels in the meantime of his preperations to try and kidnap the main caster again. Also, if you have a paladin in the party, like I had, and was afraid of the Brilliant Energy Divine Bond. I found a work around. Have the Rakshasa use his Shapeshift ability to assume the form of a Golem, or a Warforged, changing from half-elf to that, and mention this is his 'true form' leading the party to believe that Brilliant Energy wouldn't work against him. :D
This leaves lots of play room for story tweaking, and re-encounters with this boss. ^_^ Happy Gaming everyone!
Dang, got here too late.
My advice was going to be just have someone steal it. Not cheaply to eliminate it, but give the players the need to run around and chase someone down, maybe in the combat, to get their power items back. Honestly it's realistic, as most rogues would love to get their hands on giant, magic, power items.
Hope it worked out the way you wanted, then. :)