|
After three runs the party doesn't seem to have had an opportunity to greatly improve their gear.
Sounds about right, you should not expect to be able to get much at only just getting to 2nd level.
The "Economy" in PFS is set to closely match Table 12-4 on pg 399 of the Core book.
The Wealth of a Starting second level PC is around 1000 gp.
|
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
FYI, no need to worry about fame for +1 weapons or armor, they are allowed purchases regardless of fame or chronicle. Here is a reference sheet that might help, all the rules come from the guide to organized play. When I make chronicle sheets for my games I print these on the back.
|
No one can buy a +1 weapon yet due to the fame limits.
This is the only thing I want to point out. Everything else looks perfect. The fame limit does not apply to +1 weapons as they are on the "Always Available" list
Refer to page 19 of the Guide to Society Play V.4 for the complete list of always available items.
Edit:
Ninja'd
One other thing you are off on, the folks in charge have said that the Fame table was worded poorly and should not say "4 or less". You have to have at least 4 to make any purchases that are not always available and up to a max of 500 gold and at least 9 to make those 1500 gold purchases. So your example characters can only buy non-always available items of a value up to 500 gold, not 1500.
And as others have said, +1 arms and armor are always available items, just like those level one potions your characters were buying. Also remember that you have to buy the masterwork version of the weapon or armor, which are also always available, in order to get that +1 on it.
And was the Oil of Invisibility on a chronicle sheet, since that is a 2nd level spell and not always available? Though, of course, upon hitting 4 Fame, the 300 gold cost you list would make it available if it was not on one of the chronicles you listed.
One other thing you are off on, the folks in charge have said that the Fame table was worded poorly and should not say "4 or less". You have to have at least 4 to make any purchases that are not always available and up to a max of 500 gold and at least 9 to make those 1500 gold purchases.
This answers a question that I had no yet asked. Any chance on a link to where this was stated?
|
|
One thing to remember is that items are often upgradeable.
So your characters could purchase masterwork weapons and armour now. Once they have gained 1000 gold, they could get the armour enchanted, or hold off til 2000 for the armour...
Honestly, masterwork items and a few cheap consumables are about right for a 2nd-level character, by the guidelines in the CRB.
|
One other thing you are off on, the folks in charge have said that the Fame table was worded poorly and should not say "4 or less". You have to have at least 4 to make any purchases that are not always available and up to a max of 500 gold and at least 9 to make those 1500 gold purchases.This answers a question that I had no yet asked. Any chance on a link to where this was stated?
Here you go
Thank you kindly.
Cpt_kirstov, thanks for getting the link. I did not have a chance to get back to the forums til now.
Basically, version 3.0 of the Guide had the table correct, but when version 4.0 was done they had their little slip up with the wording on the table.
|
RPG Superstar 2015 Top 32, RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32
|
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Just wanted to chime in on the following:
I was just trying to think of how the players can stay alive as the dangers ramp up if they are always spending their gold on basic items and potions, and not saving it up for the more powerful magic items. I don't always have a balanced party so it'd be pretty easy for the party to make up for this imbalance by purchasing 1st level potions.
Here's a tip:
You can spend 2 Prestige points (and doing so does NOT reduce your Fame score) to acquire any single item valued at 750gp or less - even if it's beyond your current Fame limit and does not appear on a Chronicle.Using that method, it's common practice for most characters to spend their first 2 Prestige points to acquire a Wand of Cure Light Wounds. Then, if they're not able to activate said wand themselves, they just loan it to whoever can activate it (cleric, bard, witch, ranger, etc) and say "here, keep me alive".
That way, you're not spending gold on potion after potion after potion to stay alive. My level 5 fighter is only just starting to near the end of his first wand. It's the single most efficient method of healing out there.
|
|
Forgive the ignorant question, I'm just looking for a rules reference for something that I believe is worded poorly in the GOP.
As far as I can find, the table of prestige vs. price for items doesn't actually accompany a description of what the table refers to. I had someone ask me a month ago how they could buy a 1000 gp item off their chronicle if their fame was only 6, since you need 9 fame to raise your purchasing power to 1500 gp items.
I explained that, the way I understand it, the prestige table indicates what's available from the "Always Available" list - that is, once you get to 9 fame, you can buy any item from the valid rulebooks that is worth up to 1500gp. Stuff on the Chronicles is added to the your Always Available list regardless of your fame.
They said, "Oh, that's different. Where does it say that?" I looked, and couldn't find a sentence anywhere that laid it out like that. Can anyone reference that system for me? Or am I reading it wrong after all?
|
RPG Superstar 2015 Top 32, RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32
|
| 1 person marked this as FAQ candidate. 13 people marked this as a favorite. |
Forgive the ignorant question, I'm just looking for a rules reference for something that I believe is worded poorly in the GOP.
As far as I can find, the table of prestige vs. price for items doesn't actually accompany a description of what the table refers to. I had someone ask me a month ago how they could buy a 1000 gp item off their chronicle if their fame was only 6, since you need 9 fame to raise your purchasing power to 1500 gp items.
I explained that, the way I understand it, the prestige table indicates what's available from the "Always Available" list - that is, once you get to 9 fame, you can buy any item from the valid rulebooks that is worth up to 1500gp. Stuff on the Chronicles is added to the your Always Available list regardless of your fame.
They said, "Oh, that's different. Where does it say that?" I looked, and couldn't find a sentence anywhere that laid it out like that. Can anyone reference that system for me? Or am I reading it wrong after all?
Okay, there are three ways for you to gain access to purchase an item:
#1 - The "always available" list. Key word here? "Always." Anything listed as "always available" in the Guide is available for purchase any time you have the money. If your brand-new character's first adventure involved getting seated (due to ridiculous logistical issues) with a table of level 7 PCs and you just stood in the back and tried not to die, and then walked away with 1 Prestige and 3,000 gold, you could immediately buy +1 full plate. Why? Because basic +1 armor is always available, regardless of Fame or chronicles.
#2 - Chronicles. If an item is on a chronicle sheet, you can buy that item. You can buy it now, you can wait and buy it later. But you can buy it. It has permanently become available for purchase (unless a quantity limit is specified on the chronicle, but that's the exception, not the rule). Your Fame doesn't matter if the item is on a chronicle.
#3 - Fame. Your Fame is for "everything else". If something is on the AA list, you can already buy it. If it's on a chronicle, you can already buy it. It's only when a legal item is neither on the AA list nor on a chronicle that Fame even becomes an issue. For such items, you can only buy them (or upgrade to them, in the case of things like +2 weapons) if the final cost of the item would be within the GP limit set by the Fame table in the Guide.
So let's say you have 6 Fame and (somehow) 10,000gp. You could buy anything that's on your chronicles, you could buy anything from the "always available" list, and you could buy any legal item that costs 500gp or less. You could buy a few sets of +1 full plate. Or you could buy a potion or oil of a level 2 spell (or a scroll of a level 3 spell). Or if you had a +1 flaming greataxe on a chronicle you could buy that.
All that make sense?
|
|
Yeah, that's exactly how I thought it worked - but my issue was more about the fact that I can't find anything in the GOP that explains it as well as you just did. Is it made clear there, and I just haven't read it thoroughly enough to notice? Or are we just on the "Everyone knows this, so it doesn't need to be spelled out?" train? Or is it an oversight?
|
RPG Superstar 2015 Top 32, RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32
|
| 1 person marked this as FAQ candidate. |
Yeah, that's exactly how I thought it worked - but my issue was more about the fact that I can't find anything in the GOP that explains it as well as you just did. Is it made clear there, and I just haven't read it thoroughly enough to notice? Or are we just on the "Everyone knows this, so it doesn't need to be spelled out?" train? Or is it an oversight?
It's more that the Guide is organized differently. There's not a single place where it stops and says "Alright, here's how everything related to purchasing power works".
Rather, you have the "always available" list showing up in one spot (I don't have the Guide here at work, but I think it's in the character creation walkthrough part), and then the Fame purchase limit somewhere else (I think where it talks about Fame and Prestige in general, which makes sense), and then the part about buying from chronicles somewhere else.
The three purchase methods are each subcategories of other topics, and got organized as such, making it a bit of work to put it all together. (I can't tell you how many times I've heard someone protest when they heard someone mention getting dragonhide for their druid - just because dragonhide is excluded from the Always Available list.)
From page 18 of the Guide:
Every item listed on your Chronicle sheets is considered always available for purchase for you, regardless of whether it’s on your first Chronicle sheet or your 21st Chronicle sheet. The only exception here is items that have a purchase limit. You may never purchase more of that item throughout the life of your character than the number amount listed as the purchase limit.
a Wand of Cure Light Wounds... It's the single most efficient method of healing out there.
I agree with this wonderful piece of advice, especially for melees and tanks. But I would like to point one thing out. There is another efficient means of healing that you can get in a 1st level wand.
Infernal Healing recovers 10 hp per charge. It takes a full round to activate, making it less useful in combat, and it is an evil spell which may not sit well with some healers. But if you are not concerned with morals, it makes a more efficient non-combat source of healing.
|
|
Some things to remember about Infernal Healing:
It is not from the Core assumption, so you would need to have a legal copy of the spell, hardcopy book or watermarked PDF (or printout therefore) in order to use the spell; and, IIRC, in order to be able to use the spell, your PC would either have to be a worshipper fo Asmodeus, or use UMD.
Not that I would want to use the spell, but the description of it in the Inner Sea World Guide says nothing about having to follow Asmodeus in order to use it. Plus it is available in both an arcane and divine version, so you don't even have to be a cleric to have it.
Also, where does that healing 10 hp per charge come from? The spell description says it gives the target Fast Healing 1, which, if am reading it right, only recovers 1 hp per round for the duration of the spell.
|
|
Also, where does that healing 10 hp per charge come from? The spell description says it gives the target Fast Healing 1, which, if am reading it right, only recovers 1 hp per round for the duration of the spell.
The spell has a duration of 1 minute. So assuming the target is 10+ hp down and survives the entire minute the 10 per charge is accurate.
|
|
| 1 person marked this as FAQ candidate. |
Not that I would want to use the spell, but the description of it in the Inner Sea World Guide says nothing about having to follow Asmodeus in order to use it. Plus it is available in both an arcane and divine version, so you don't even have to be a cleric to have it.
Also, where does that healing 10 hp per charge come from? The spell description says it gives the target Fast Healing 1, which, if am reading it right, only recovers 1 hp per round for the duration of the spell.
Well, the version I have seen in the past, I think from the AP, said it was only usable by Priests of Asmodeus, although I could have the evil deity name incorrect. Then again, it might not be a 750 gp wand, since it lists one material component that is well above the 1 gp limit, a dose of unholy water...
And the 10 points of healing comes from it being a first level spell, and therefore normally available wand/potion/scroll versions would be CL1, so it would have a duration of 1 minute, 10 rounds, for 10 points of healing.
Anyone know what the price in gp would be for a drop of devil's blood? either 50 drops of devil's blood, or 50 doses of unholy water, or some combination of the two, would be needed to create a wand of Infernal Healing...
Well, the version I have seen in the past, I think from the AP, said it was only usable by Priests of Asmodeus, although I could have the evil deity name incorrect. Then again, it might not be a 750 gp wand, since it lists one material component that is well above the 1 gp limit, a dose of unholy water...
And the 10 points of healing comes from it being a first level spell, and therefore normally available wand/potion/scroll versions would be CL1, so it would have a duration of 1 minute, 10 rounds, for 10 points of healing.
Anyone know what the price in gp would be for a drop of devil's blood? either 50 drops of devil's blood, or 50 doses of unholy water, or some combination of the two, would be needed to create a wand of Infernal Healing...
The spell, as printed in the Inner Sea Guide, has no roleplay requirement (not even restricting good-aligned characters from receiving it). So any caster that can use spells with the evil descriptor can use the wand (mind you, that includes wizards, sorcerers, summoners, witches and magi, making it more likely a party member can activate it than a wand of CLW).
As for the unholy water and demon's blood, neither are given a gp cost in the spell stat block and thus are assumed to be in a spell component pouch. I know that it seems weird to have unholy water for free (not that you can use it as just unholy water), but if the component had an additional cost, it would be listed in the spell as was done with the spell Dirge of the Victorious Knights on the opposite page in the Inner Sea Guide.
|
|
The spell, as printed in the Inner Sea Guide, has no roleplay requirement (not even restricting good-aligned characters from receiving it). So any caster that can use spells with the evil descriptor can use the wand (mind you, that includes wizards, sorcerers, summoners, witches and magi, making it more likely a party member can activate it than a wand of CLW).
BTW, in case anyone is assuming that CLW has been rendered suboptimal now, remember that Cure spells can be held charged to inflict damage to undead (so "charging up" is a good tactic for mobility-inclined rogues w/UMD in a surprise round if the enemy is beyond 30'; they can either heal a wounded ally or flank/sneak an undead in the next round).
|
|
Well, the version I have seen in the past, I think from the AP, said it was only usable by Priests of Asmodeus, although I could have the evil deity name incorrect. Then again, it might not be a 750 gp wand, since it lists one material component that is well above the 1 gp limit, a dose of unholy water...
And the 10 points of healing comes from it being a first level spell, and therefore normally available wand/potion/scroll versions would be CL1, so it would have a duration of 1 minute, 10 rounds, for 10 points of healing.
Anyone know what the price in gp would be for a drop of devil's blood? either 50 drops of devil's blood, or 50 doses of unholy water, or some combination of the two, would be needed to create a wand of Infernal Healing...
The spell, as printed in the Inner Sea Guide, has no roleplay requirement (not even restricting good-aligned characters from receiving it). So any caster that can use spells with the evil descriptor can use the wand (mind you, that includes wizards, sorcerers, summoners, witches and magi, making it more likely a party member can activate it than a wand of CLW).
As for the unholy water and demon's blood, neither are given a gp cost in the spell stat block and thus are assumed to be in a spell component pouch. I know that it seems weird to have unholy water for free (not that you can use it as just unholy water), but if the component had an additional cost, it would be listed in the spell as was done with the spell Dirge of the Victorious Knights on the opposite page in the Inner Sea Guide.
Infernal healing was intially printed in the Cheliax book, and was noted as being a spell granted by Asmodeus.
However, the version in the Inner Sea World Guide supercedes and replaces the Cheliax version, as it is from a newer source. This version has no limitations regarding which clerics can prepare it. Of course, clerics can't prepare spells with alignment descriptors that oppose their own alignment or their deity's alignment, so good-aligned clerics or clerics of good-aligned gods are out of luck.
Also, regardless of what the fluff says about the material components, if it doesn't list a price in the spell, there is no price for those components.
|
|
Anyone know what the price in gp would be for a drop of devil's blood? either 50 drops of devil's blood, or 50 doses of unholy water, or some combination of the two, would be needed to create a wand of Infernal Healing...
Um, I have some blood... although it's muddied somewhat with human ancestry. Let me figure out how much I want to charge for it. ^_^
|
|
Anyone know what the price in gp would be for a drop of devil's blood? either 50 drops of devil's blood, or 50 doses of unholy water, or some combination of the two, would be needed to create a wand of Infernal Healing...Um, I have some blood... although it's muddied somewhat with human ancestry. Let me figure out how much I want to charge for it. ^_^
Devil's blood? Devil's blood is free. It's arguable that 'a dose of unholy water' might have a price, since holy water is a consumable that exists for purchase in the Core, and unholy water is explicitly just that, but...unholier. However, nowhere in Pathfinder can you purchase 'a drop of devil's blood', nor even 'a pint of devil's blood'. You also can't purchase a bit of fur, an amber rod, bat guano, multicoloured sand, and so on. What you can purchase is a spell component pouch. What does this do, you ask?
'A spellcaster with a spell component pouch is assumed to have all the material components and focuses needed for spellcasting, except for those components that have a specific cost, divine focuses, and focuses that wouldn't fit in a pouch.'
There's no specific cost for a drop of devil's blood given in the writeup of infernal healing or anywhere else. Therefore, you have as much as you need in your spell component pouch. Just don't use it to write messages on the bathroom mirror. It's tacky.