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Gonna try some of these builds out to see what they do. Wanted to base a character on the quarterstaff. Here is an exhaustive list I was thinking of. Any other builds that belong on the list or any tips for these builds?
Fighter
PROS: feats, weapon training, etc.
CONS: Boring, lack of versatility
Ranger (TWF chain)
PROS, full BAB, free feats, a bit of self-buffing later on, moderate dex ok.
CONS: being a scout requires WIS, not being a scout trivializes many Ranger abilities
Monk (weapon adept)
PROS: free feats to rival the fighter (with flurry), Moderate dex ok, versatility w/out equipment.
CONS: Dependent on Flurry, medium BAB otherwise
(a dip into druid with growth subdomain gets 2 or 3/day shillelagh and quickened enlarge person several times a day and you've got a +1/+1 quarterstaff that does 3d6 damage. Also enhanced versatility and this dude's probably your best scout due to wis instead of dex.)
Wood Oracle
PROS: Versatility of a full caster, never without a level appropriate staff (A KEEN STAFF eventually), wood focus basically keeps you up with full BAB.
CONS: no bonus feats for a feat-intensive combat style, MAD
(am I crazy to want to dip this into paladin for CHA synergy?)
Rogue
Ugh, just ugh. Not a fan, although sneak attack means it always has its uses for TWF. Not something I'd go with, but it deserves to be on the list.
Magus
From what I've heard it can be done, but I'm not too familiar with the class, so I'm leaving it out for now.
Hitting your points one at a time:
Fighter: it's only boring and lacking in versatility if you let it be. Use your imagination, invest in some non-combat feats, and spend a few skill points to do something fun.
Ranger: A really solid choice. You might start with a slightly lower attack stat than you want, but the skill points & bonuses are well worth it. Don't go scout unless your campaign is close to core only or won't make it into the teens. (from an optimization standpoint.)
Monk: Monk is a really strong choice as well, because you'll be applying your full strength bonus to all the flurry attacks. Dipping into druid doesn't give enough of a buff to damage without costing you a round to prepare, though quickened enlarge person is really nice.
Wood Oracle: You hit the big points, but don't forget that Ancestor, Battle, and Metal are all good substitutes as well. You'll be more of a caster hybrid than a true master of the staff, so this might not be what you want.
Rogue: Yeah, avoid it.
Magus: Can't comment.
Hitting your points one at a time:
Fighter: it's only boring and lacking in versatility if you let it be. Use your imagination, invest in some non-combat feats, and spend a few skill points to do something fun.
Ranger: A really solid choice. You might start with a slightly lower attack stat than you want, but the skill points & bonuses are well worth it. Don't go scout unless your campaign is close to core only or won't make it into the teens. (from an optimization standpoint.)
Monk: Monk is a really strong choice as well, because you'll be applying your full strength bonus to all the flurry attacks. Dipping into druid doesn't give enough of a buff to damage without costing you a round to prepare, though quickened enlarge person is really nice.
Wood Oracle: You hit the big points, but don't forget that Ancestor, Battle, and Metal are all good substitutes as well. You'll be more of a caster hybrid than a true master of the staff, so this might not be what you want.
Rogue: Yeah, avoid it.
Magus: Can't comment.
Hey Sean, your oracle guide is what sparked this curiousity -- it started with a wood oracle in mind. Great job!
I guess with fighter for me it's the fact that ANYONE can make a kickass melee fighter -- that's why I say it's boring. It's not boring to play a fighter, but it's boring to come to a game table and say "look, I made a fighter!" It's more fun to me to say "look, I made a wood oracle," or "look, I have a monk/druid," and have people say "I thought you were going to be the damage dealer?!?!"
"I am."
Hey Sean, your oracle guide is what sparked this curiousity -- it started with a wood oracle in mind. Great job!
I guess with fighter for me it's the fact that ANYONE can make a kickass melee fighter -- that's why I say it's boring. It's not boring to play a fighter, but it's boring to come to a game table and say "look, I made a fighter!" It's more fun to me to say "look, I made a wood oracle," or "look, I have a monk/druid," and have people say "I thought you were going to be the damage dealer?!?!"
"I am."
Haha, thanks!
Honestly, I find that to be a really valid reason to avoid the fighter. There's a lot of satisfaction in challenging other people's expectation and blowing their socks off.
If you're interested in going the oracle path I'd almost recommend against the Wood mystery. Wood and Ancestor embrace the hybrid nature of the warrior-type oracle more than the other two melee mysteries: battle and metal. Both of those seem content to offer a bunch of weapon based revelations.
If you're really just looking to get the most out of using a staff, the monk is absolutely your best bet. You list dependency on flurry to get your damage as a con, but every single melee combatant has a reliance on full attacks to succeed.
The monk has the benefit of getting all of the TWF feats for free, applying your full strength bonus to all of your attacks, a really decent AC, a strong option to pursue combat maneuvers, and a whole bag of tricks just to pass the time with.
Monk: See Ranger about stats. No bonus damage, but more feats. Also smaller hit die, fewer skill points, and less AC except against touch attacks. Monks should be good with quarterstaves, but really they aren't. They're better with another weapon or no weapon.
You forget that monks get full strength damage to all of their weapon attacks, unlike every other staff wielder on the list.
It's even better because the Weapon Master archetype trades away stunning fist (lame for a quarterstaff) in favor of perfect strike.
Re Magus:
While I agree it seems a bit lame to be a 'quarterstaff master' but then only use one end of it, I still think the quarterstaff magus rocks pretty hard. With channeling shocking grasp through it plus your regular melee attack (plus an extra one cuz of course you've hasted yourself and friends) things can get pretty toasty for your foes. Plus your staff also give you a bonus to dex (which you can increase further using arcane pool points) and eventually use a magic staff instead of a quarterstaff
Well, YMMV of course, but here's one for you to check out for yourself.
Ayaleth, Quarterstaff/Cabalist Magus (comments & criticisms welcome : )
Different strokes for different folks, MyTThor.
Indeed. My only pathfinder fighter so far has been a Cayden Cailean wannabe who I talked my dm into letting me use an oversized iron tankard as a small shield and I did twf shieldbash.
In my opinion, you should go with a straight staff magus. you can get weapon spec pretty early and if your GM is allowing outsourced materials...check out AEG's FEATS, in there is a feat called Bo Master.
You have mastered the art of fighting with a quarterstaff,
learning to meld strength and speed together.
Prerequisites: Dex 15+, Weapon Focus (quarterstaff),
Weapon Specialization (quarterstaff) or monk level 4th+.
Benefit: You may add your Dexterity bonus to your
attack and damage rolls with a quarterstaff. In addition, on
a successful critical hit, your critical hit multiplier is
increased by 1. Thus, a normal quarterstaff has a critical
hit multiplier of X2. With this feat, the multiplier
becomes a X3.
Personally going fighter besides being a bit boring wouldnt really fit well with a classic staff fighter, which I consider to be a warrior in light or no armor and a deceptively simple weapon.
Monk seems to fit this best, but if you want to sprinkle magic into it, magus, ranger or dervish dancer make a good fit as well. I think there is a fighter archetype that in the society field guide that trades medium, light armor and shields for more skill points (for int based skills), replaces bravery 1 with the expertise feat and armor training with a +2 on CMB and CMD for every step of AT. I think it would make a decent multi-class with monk levels, making for a skilled and wise fighter with no armor.
I would think to make a character similar to the female character in thundercats (kitiara I think) which seems to be very much like a monk, possibly with some fighter or ranger levels. I'd probably ask my DM to allow for the use of dex with the quarterstaff, not unreasonable for a character proficient with martial weapons or to use a feat to use dex otherwise allowing for decent defense with no armor and shield, damage will be less than optimal but your defenses will be decent to good with a fair bit of flexibility considering you likely have no magical ability, trip and disarm maneuvers coupled with a good number of attacks and decent skill use will determine ur efficiency.
MAD is still a problem since you would like to invest in all scores but charisma.
str 14, dex 16, con 14, int 13, wis 14, cha 7 will be a likely starting point with points going towards dexterity if ur GM does not allow the use of dex for quarterstaff swap str and dex. Any kind of increase to physical ability is welcome, a wisdom item to increase defenses and ki ability is a good investment as well. I think it will turn out to be an allround character rather than a brutal damage dealer though, but considerable staying power and flexibility compared to a basic fighter.
Without reading up on it, monk levels might be spent in weapon adept or sohei, which gets weapon training at higher levels.
In my opinion, you should go with a straight staff magus. you can get weapon spec pretty early and if your GM is allowing outsourced materials...check out AEG's FEATS, in there is a feat called Bo Master.
** spoiler omitted **
Great feat! Thanks! Even better than Weapon Finesse!
Contributor, RPG Superstar 2010 Top 16
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I remember. You forget that there's a feat for that. Rangers will delay getting it because they can't meet the dex prerequisite, but everyone else can have it at level 3 or 5 if it's worth getting. Fighters and humans could have it at level 1.Monk: See Ranger about stats. No bonus damage, but more feats. Also smaller hit die, fewer skill points, and less AC except against touch attacks. Monks should be good with quarterstaves, but really they aren't. They're better with another weapon or no weapon.You forget that monks get full strength damage to all of their weapon attacks, unlike every other staff wielder on the list.
It's even better because the Weapon Master archetype trades away stunning fist (lame for a quarterstaff) in favor of perfect strike.
Since the monk uses flurry, he doesn't have to pay to enhance both halves of his staff. With the TWF feat tree you are still attacking with alternating sides of the staff which means TWF pay double for magic sticks.
The monk staffer can also have a staff enhanced with two different weapons enhancements and choose when he attacks which side to strike with. For example, if he has undead bane on one side of the staff and human bane on the other he can flurry with just the human bane side.
Not a huge benefit, but a nice perk.
Wowzers, I never thought I'd actually find a thread already started for this subject!
Anyway, I'm looking to play a Spell-less Ranger (Vanara Race) who utilizes either a Quarterstaff explicitly or a combination of Quarterstaff and Bow.
Are there any Quarterstaff Feats I need to be aware of?
Is there already a Quarterstaff Combat Style for Rangers that isn't mentioned in the rulebooks? Perhaps some 3rd Party Pathfinder stuff?
weapon master monk- perfect strike is handy and you get WF and wpn spec for free (on top of all the normal monk bonus feats). the quarterstaff master feat will let you wield it one handed, which means you can have a hand free for deflect arrows, or crane wing or whatever, and still threaten with your staff.
Hey Sean, your oracle guide is what sparked this curiousity -- it started with a wood oracle in mind. Great job!
I guess with fighter for me it's the fact that ANYONE can make a kickass melee fighter -- that's why I say it's boring. It's not boring to play a fighter, but it's boring to come to a game table and say "look, I made a fighter!" It's more fun to me to say "look, I made a wood oracle," or "look, I have a monk/druid," and have people say "I thought you were going to be the damage dealer?!?!"
"I am."
Haha, thanks!
Honestly, I find that to be a really valid reason to avoid the fighter. There's a lot of satisfaction in challenging other people's expectation and blowing their socks off.
If you're interested in going the oracle path I'd almost recommend against the Wood mystery. Wood and Ancestor embrace the hybrid nature of the warrior-type oracle more than the other two melee mysteries: battle and metal. Both of those seem content to offer a bunch of weapon based revelations.
If you're really just looking to get the most out of using a staff, the monk is absolutely your best bet. You list dependency on flurry to get your damage as a con, but every single melee combatant has a reliance on full attacks to succeed.
The monk has the benefit of getting all of the TWF feats for free, applying your full strength bonus to all of your attacks, a really decent AC, a strong option to pursue combat maneuvers, and a whole bag of tricks just to pass the time with.
decent AC????
monk got the worst AC ever.
if you have AC you dont have STR. if you got str - no armor and only med dex/wis (cant tank CON ... ) so = poor AC.
Thanks for that comment 2 years later...
Here is an idea for a monk: Martial Artist 1/Invulnerable Barbarian X. This should solve most of the defensive problems through sheer DR and the natural armor bonuses from Beast totem. the other advantage of this build is that Flurry of Blows is a "full attack action" and thus qualifies for pounce. Combining the ability to use a full STR mod for damage and RAGE can make it worthwhile.
For a fighter, how about a mobile fighter? It only trades away the later two armor trainings, so few problems there. The real draw for a TWF is that it gets a pseudo pounce (loses the highest BAB attack)
For bards, I would either advice the Dervish Dancer of the Dawnflower Dervish (confusing, I know). The Dervish Dancer also gets a Pseudo Pounce at level 12 (one move + full attack...but it also has bonuses to speed so it is like 2 moves). The Dawnflower Dervish on the other hand APPEARS to be built around the use of dervish dance. But the fact that it doubles the effects of inspire courage on the user means that it would do much better to be a TWF uses. It starts out getting +2 to attack and damage and end up getting +10 to attack and damage per hit later on. Add in arcane strike and any other buffs, and that is downright dangerous.
EDIT:Good god where do people find these threads to necro? 2 years? Never trust the search engine unless you look at the dates.