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Arcane bond lists out a few things that can be the focus of an arcane bond in the wizard section of the core book.
Is a rod considered a weapon though? capable of being enhanced with Craft Arms & Armor as if the wizard posessed the feat, AND being enhanced with Craft Rod at 9th level as if the wizard posessed that feat too?
( ie. is it possible for a wizard to use a Rod as a focus item and enchant their focus to be a metamagic rod of something )
Arcane bond lists out a few things that can be the focus of an arcane bond in the wizard section of the core book.
Is a rod considered a weapon though? capable of being enhanced with Craft Arms & Armor as if the wizard posessed the feat, AND being enhanced with Craft Rod at 9th level as if the wizard posessed that feat too?
( ie. is it possible for a wizard to use a Rod as a focus item and enchant their focus to be a metamagic rod of something )
What about in a steampunk game? Then I will fail on my diplomacy check to get the wizard to travel to mexico with me. Oh and this wizard is never going back to his/her old school.
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"Physical Description: Rods weigh approximately 5 pounds. They range from 2 feet to 3 feet long and are usually made of iron or some other metal. (Many, as noted in their descriptions, can function as light maces or clubs due to their hardy construction.) These sturdy items have AC 9, 10 hit points, hardness 10, and a break DC of 27."
I'd say you'd be good using it as a masterwork club, ala Ezren. Enchant it as a rod when you qualify for the feat at level 9.
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Owner - Johnny Scott Comics and Games
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"Physical Description: Rods weigh approximately 5 pounds. They range from 2 feet to 3 feet long and are usually made of iron or some other metal. (Many, as noted in their descriptions, can function as light maces or clubs due to their hardy construction.) These sturdy items have AC 9, 10 hit points, hardness 10, and a break DC of 27."
I'd say you'd be good using it as a masterwork club, ala Ezren. Enchant it as a rod when you qualify for the feat at level 9.
So, does this mean that Metamagic Clubs exist? Could I make a +3 Club into a +3 Club of Silent Spell?
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No.
You can treat rods like clubs. You can't do the reverse.
Do you have any reasoning for this? Rods are clubs or light maces that have been magically enchanted with the craft rod feat. Therefore if I had a nice club, I should be able to make it into a rod. If I have a nice rod that acts as a club and is masterwork, I should be able to make it into a +1 club that still works as a rod.
This is something I've been frustrated with, I have made a Mystic Theurge who it would be very much in character for him to have a rod of splendor as his Bonded Object, the omission seems arbitrary at best.
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Do you have any reasoning for this? Rods are clubs or light maces that have been magically enchanted with the craft rod feat. Therefore if I had a nice club, I should be able to make it into a rod. If I have a nice rod that acts as a club and is masterwork, I should be able to make it into a +1 club that still works as a rod.No.
You can treat rods like clubs. You can't do the reverse.
The Rod description explicitly says that many *can* serve as light maces or clubs, but that does not mean that every club is the right shape to be a rod (though there is a certainly at the very least a decent chance it is).
Personally, I'm in the "whole the hell cares what kind of object it is" camp.
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I know some rods function as Light Maces or Clubs as well w/ some enhancement bonus. ( and have craft arms and armor as a requirement, in addition to craft rod . like Rod of the Python )
But I don't know whether Rods were intended to be off the list specifically, or if they're fair game.
I don't think they are. But I don't know if there isn't some rational and allowable loophole, with taking a Weapon bond, and using Craft Rod on it.
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Do you have any reasoning for this? Rods are clubs or light maces that have been magically enchanted with the craft rod feat. Therefore if I had a nice club, I should be able to make it into a rod. If I have a nice rod that acts as a club and is masterwork, I should be able to make it into a +1 club that still works as a rod.No.
You can treat rods like clubs. You can't do the reverse.
The Rod description explicitly says that many *can* serve as light maces or clubs, but that does not mean that every club is the right shape to be a rod (though there is a certainly at the very least a decent chance it is).
Personally, I'm in the "whole the hell cares what kind of object it is" camp.
Yes, but if my PC had a mind to one day have a combination club/rod, I'm sure he would go out and arcane bond with a properly shaped club that could also act as a rod. The rules allow for objects to have multiple enchantments, and a club has the ability to be both a rod and a magic weapon. There is no reason to disallow it.
Also, there's no other way for a wizard who has bonded with a club to use a metamagic rod without making a concentration check.
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This came up b/c i saw a wizard in PFS society play use the arcane bond to get around crafting a magic item, and craft his bonded rod into a Lesser Quicken Metamagic rod for half price. What i feel is one of the most expensive chain of items in the game (rightly so).
( At that point it becomes kind of a PFS question. but its also a basic rules question: Can a Wizard bond a Rod ).
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Owner - Johnny Scott Comics and Games
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Do you have any reasoning for this? Rods are clubs or light maces that have been magically enchanted with the craft rod feat. Therefore if I had a nice club, I should be able to make it into a rod. If I have a nice rod that acts as a club and is masterwork, I should be able to make it into a +1 club that still works as a rod.No.
You can treat rods like clubs. You can't do the reverse.
If clubs could be treated like rod's they'd have a note in their entry saying such.
And no, rods are not clubs or light maces that have been magically enchanted. Rods are items with a certain description that can sometimes function as a club or light mace. I can make a crowbar function like a key, but I can't make a key function like a crowbar.
So, if I started with a Rod of Silent Spell, would I be able to apply Craft Arms/Armor to give it an enchantment bonus?
It listed what you can use.
Rods aren't on the list.
If the PC wants to bond a club or light mace and fluff that it looks "rod like" then, well, who really cares what it looks like?
But that lets them enchant it as a weapon -not- as a rod.
Rods are specific magical items with specific magical item creation rules.
Rods aren't on the list.
-S
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Here is a Rod of the Python. Notice how it was crafted with both craft rod and craft magic weapons and armour. Here is a Rod of Thunder and Lightning. Notice how it was also crafted with craft rod and craft magic weapons and armour. I'm not completely sure, because I'm just looking at the SRD right now, but I believe both of these are listed in the Core Rulebook.
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It listed what you can use.
Rods aren't on the list.
If the PC wants to bond a club or light mace and fluff that it looks "rod like" then, well, who really cares what it looks like?
But that lets them enchant it as a weapon -not- as a rod.
Rods are specific magical items with specific magical item creation rules.Rods aren't on the list.
-S
This is unnecessarily strict, a break in verisimilitude and depending on whether you'd allow them to enchant when they DO have the feat, possibly flat out RAW wrong.
Some rods are shaped like clubs. If you took a rod-shaped club as a bonded item, why COULDN'T you enchant it as one? It doesn't say "You can only use X feats as though you had the them" and even if it did the caster could still take Craft Rod. If you denied them the ability to craft an explicitly rod-shaped club (which exists by RAW thanks to the Rod rules), then you are REALLY messing with them because at that point the only reason they can't enchant it is because it IS a bonded item (meaning they LOSE enchanting ability for bonding it).
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To create a magic rod, a character needs a supply of materials, the most obvious being a rod or the pieces of the rod to be assembled. The cost for the materials is subsumed in the cost for creating the rod. Rod costs are difficult to determine. Refer to Table: Estimating Magic Item Gold Piece Values and use the rod prices in the rod descriptions as a guideline. Creating a rod costs half the market value listed.
If spells are involved in the prerequisites for making the rod, the creator must have prepared the spells to be cast (or must know the spells, in the case of a sorcerer or bard) but need not provide any material components or focuses the spells require. The act of working on the rod triggers the prepared spells, making them unavailable for casting during each day of the rod's creation. (That is, those spell slots are expended from the caster's currently prepared spells, just as if they had been cast.)
Creating some rods may entail other prerequisites beyond or other than spellcasting. See the individual descriptions for details.
Crafting a rod requires 1 day for each 1,000 gp of the base price.
Item Creation Feat Required: Craft Rod.
Skill Used in Creation: Spellcraft, Craft (jewelry), Craft (sculptures), or Craft (weapons).
This doesn't prove my point, but I think it shows intention.
If you took a rod-shaped club as a bonded item, why COULDN'T you enchant it as one?
Because as a mindless item, it is immune to enchantments. You could certainly enhance it, however.
Sorry to be so pedantic, but if we're going to discuss game rules minutia, let's at least use game rules terminology.
It listed what you can use.
Rods aren't on the list.
If the PC wants to bond a club or light mace and fluff that it looks "rod like" then, well, who really cares what it looks like?
But that lets them enchant it as a weapon -not- as a rod.
Rods are specific magical items with specific magical item creation rules.Rods aren't on the list.
-S
This is unnecessarily strict, a break in verisimilitude and depending on whether you'd allow them to enchant when they DO have the feat, possibly flat out RAW wrong.
Some rods are shaped like clubs. If you took a rod-shaped club as a bonded item, why COULDN'T you enchant it as one? It doesn't say "You can only use X feats as though you had the them" and even if it did the caster could still take Craft Rod. If you denied them the ability to craft an explicitly rod-shaped club (which exists by RAW thanks to the Rod rules), then you are REALLY messing with them because at that point the only reason they can't enchant it is because it IS a bonded item (meaning they LOSE enchanting ability for bonding it).
I second this.
Also, I would like to ask if it is pathetic that I do not know what RAW stands for.
It listed what you can use.
Rods aren't on the list.
If the PC wants to bond a club or light mace and fluff that it looks "rod like" then, well, who really cares what it looks like?
But that lets them enchant it as a weapon -not- as a rod.
Rods are specific magical items with specific magical item creation rules.Rods aren't on the list.
-S
This is unnecessarily strict, a break in verisimilitude and depending on whether you'd allow them to enchant when they DO have the feat, possibly flat out RAW wrong.
Some rods are shaped like clubs. If you took a rod-shaped club as a bonded item, why COULDN'T you enchant it as one? It doesn't say "You can only use X feats as though you had the them" and even if it did the caster could still take Craft Rod. If you denied them the ability to craft an explicitly rod-shaped club (which exists by RAW thanks to the Rod rules), then you are REALLY messing with them because at that point the only reason they can't enchant it is because it IS a bonded item (meaning they LOSE enchanting ability for bonding it).
I second this.
Also, I would like to ask if it is pathetic that I do not know what RAW stands for.
Rules as written.
I was wondering for a while what UMD meant. (Use magic device)
It listed what you can use.
Rods aren't on the list.
If the PC wants to bond a club or light mace and fluff that it looks "rod like" then, well, who really cares what it looks like?
But that lets them enchant it as a weapon -not- as a rod.
Rods are specific magical items with specific magical item creation rules.Rods aren't on the list.
-S
This is unnecessarily strict, a break in verisimilitude and depending on whether you'd allow them to enchant when they DO have the feat, possibly flat out RAW wrong.
Some rods are shaped like clubs. If you took a rod-shaped club as a bonded item, why COULDN'T you enchant it as one? It doesn't say "You can only use X feats as though you had the them" and even if it did the caster could still take Craft Rod. If you denied them the ability to craft an explicitly rod-shaped club (which exists by RAW thanks to the Rod rules), then you are REALLY messing with them because at that point the only reason they can't enchant it is because it IS a bonded item (meaning they LOSE enchanting ability for bonding it).
I second this.
Also, I would like to ask if it is pathetic that I do not know what RAW stands for.
Rules as written.
I was wondering for a while what UMD meant. (Use magic device)
Thanks. I suppose that makes RAI Rule as Intended?
Yes, it does.
Actually it stands for Rubies Annadiane investment.
Arcane bond lists out a few things that can be the focus of an arcane bond in the wizard section of the core book.
Is a rod considered a weapon though? capable of being enhanced with Craft Arms & Armor as if the wizard posessed the feat, AND being enhanced with Craft Rod at 9th level as if the wizard posessed that feat too?
( ie. is it possible for a wizard to use a Rod as a focus item and enchant their focus to be a metamagic rod of something )
Others have already weighed in on this, but here is my take on it:
- A rod can be shaped and used as a light mace, the example of the rod of the python that strikes as a quarterstaff has been brought up. So a wizard could take a club as a bonded item and specify that it fulfills the properties as a rod. He could enhance it as a weapon.
- If the wizard takes craft rod, he can make a rod out of it. He still has to pay the cost for that.
- If someone feels uncomfortable with the above way, a wizard could also take weapon as bonded item, take craft rod, create a rod that functions as a calub, replace his bonded item with the rod and enhance it. This is unnecessarily complicated IMO though.
- In any way, you have to take craft rod as a feat. You do not get two feats (craft arms & armor AND craft rods) for free just because you take a weapon-shaped rod.