Hi! Do you know if there's a plane where time flows slower? As we are "against the clock" from now on (le sigh) it seems like I won't have as much time for crafting as I'd like (after I spent 3 damn feats on it -____-). I know I could craft in half the time by adding a +5 DC to check but my char (a cleric) isn't specially adept at it (maxed spellcraft but low INT). I know I could pick skill focus and the one that gives +4 to UMD and spellcraft. I probably will. However, having access to planeshift and all, perhaps I could go to "sleep" to the slow-time plane where I could craft for "days" or so and return before the night is over in the material plane. Is there such a plane? like Goku's training room (1 year there, 1 day in real world)? of sort?
I read there's a "Dimension of time/The hidden dimension" plane which is about time and all but I don't think it's exactly what I'm looking for. A week for a day basis would be perfect.
Thanks!
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There are, and there are ways for a character to make their own planes (at higher level). I don't know any off hand, but there is a problem. A planeshift with a DC 15ish Know the Planes check should be all you need for this specifically, though you need to remember that you don't control the time flow, and it isn't that time moves faster or slower in that plane, just that it doesn't align with other planes. If you spend 5 years there, and only a week travels by on the material plane, you are still 5 years older, have still spent 5 years worth of living resorces, etc. . .
You also probably don't want a timeless plane, as you will not heal or be able to replenish any spells while there, though, for short periods of time (from your perspective), this might be very beneficial with "eternal" short term buffs like Bull's Str. Just remember that time will catch up.
So there used to be a way with the 3.0 Genesis spell to create a personal demiplane where time flowed infinitely slower so you could plane shift in combat, research a spell for the situation, and pop back the next round.
That spell is no longer core (though it is still compatible if you have an agreeable GM) but Paizo have created the Create Demiplane spell, along with lesser and greater versions. They're higher level, I think starting at 7th level, but they do allow for time manipulation. I think the best you can get is half or double with the spell, because the Timeless planar trait is pretty ambiguous.
But there ya go!
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In PF, there are 3 spells that do this. Create Demiplane, (and Lesser and Greater) from 7th - 9th level. They are from the Ultimate Magic, and I believe the 8th and 9th level allow you to pick the time traits. But they are also expensive, and if you are talking about that level of play, honestly there are other ways to do it.
Honestly, if you are simply wanting a quick way around the time limitations the Dm/story is implementing, a Know Planes check with a Plane Shift (or similar spell) to a random plane that fits your needs should fit the bill.
Contributor, RPG Superstar 2010 Top 16
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Ask your GM, this sort of cosmology question is pretty variable from campaign to campaign.
The rules say "Some planes blah blah blah..." but really don't touch on specific planes, how you would find a plane with certain characteristics, or how common planes with specific characteristics are. Even if you KNEW there was a plane that had slow time finding it might be a problem? What creatures are you likely to encounter there?
The create demiplane spells are likely your best bet for a definitive answer.
No alternate planes needed my friend. The munchkins got your back. Behold -
http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/advanced/spells/napStack.html#nap-stack-
With this spell you can get rid of the pesky sleeping habit and use the extra time for crafting!
Time constrant that GM! Muahahahaah.
No alternate planes needed my friend. The munchkins got your back. Behold -
http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/advanced/spells/napStack.html#nap-stack-
With this spell you can get rid of the pesky sleeping habit and use the extra time for crafting!
Time constrant that GM! Muahahahaah.
Too bad the rules say "no":
The caster can work for up to 8 hours each day. He cannot rush the process by working longer each day, but the days need not be consecutive, and the caster can use the rest of his time as he sees fit.
Emphasis mine
Thanks everyone! couldn't find my thread :P so had to search for it in my account xD. Anyway...
Yeah! I remember I saw the create demiplane thing months ago (perhaps that's how the idea seed growed in my mind like in inception or perhaps I read it from a 3.5 source.
And the nap stack is a great idea, too bad it can only be used every week. Sadly as a cleric I can't benefit much from it as I have to wait for a certain hour to recall spells... (which btw in another such plane i could just planeshift, get spells, get back. =0)
Im totally aware id get older sooner than i would otherwise with all this time traveling and that I can't work more than 8 hours (however I can rush and get a day of work in mere 4 hours x2 by adding +5 to the craft difficulty (in a plane that is 2x faster is already 1/4 crafting time, which seems pretty much decent imho)
Definetly aware of plane shifting issues like wandering monsters and so on. Fortunately my DM was leninent and didn't roll for monsters or anything, perhaps because im not a fighter. Dunno.
Thanks everyone! I'll read the create demiplane stuff and work on one where I can craft stuff in peace. btw i have terrible knowledge the planes/int (cleric with terribad stats, had to dump pretty much everything), so had to go to a library and find the info in a book :P
Living resources is easy : lvl 12 already so I can cast heroes feast or create food and water. I cast it pretty much everyday so no one has to care about bringing meals (even if one can get bored from eating bland bread everyday =/).
Guess a cleric is pretty much self-sufficient as long as you have magic left
Demiplane of Malevolent Vulpines?
Personally, if time was an issue, I'd want one where time flows faster... Get things done quicker than on the material plane which would be moving slower... ;)
+1
Glad someone else noticed this flaw.
You can do the following (it works better for a wizard but a cleric still might find it useful):
First of all carry all of your needed equipment (heat soure, materials etc.) for crafting in a big bag of holding.
Be wearing the ring of sustenance for at least a week.
Do not do anything at all for a full day, do not prepare spells, do not craft and don't do anything (so that we deal with that 24 vs day in the rules).
Now the day after you did nothing:
1)You awake at the same time as your rest party.
2)Spent 1 hour to prepare your spells (i assume wizard without fast study).
3)Spent the next 13 hours with your group (gather equipment, unset camp, adventuring, setting camp, take first watch etc.).
4)Cast rope trick (might be needing a rod of extend here). (this happens during the last hour of step 3).
5)Unload your crafting equipment and have your party help you move it into the extradimensional space you created. (this happens during the last hour of step 3).
6)Go in your extradimensional space you created with your spell.
7)Be sure to take a cage with 7 hamsters with you.
8)Craft for 8 hours (and since you are doing it the normal way you get the full benefit of 8 hours crafting).
9)Pack your equipment and sleep for 2 hours (be sure to thank your nice little ring).
10)Go to step 1 and repeat.
Now as you see with that 9 steps you don't violate the rule of preparing spells more than once per day or the rule of crafting for a maximum of 8 hours, and it only costs you 3 things:
1)a ring of sustenance.
2)one of your 1st level spell slots since you needed for the rope trick. (make sure you prepare one each day)
3)maybe one of your uses of your lesser rod of extend.
4)a big bag of holding.
I hope that it's clear enough.
Can it be done? Probably.
However it is great way to destroy a campaign. Casters are already the most powerful classes in the game at that point, and crafting lets them be even more powerful. In fact the only limits to buying power through crafting are those time limits and gp costs. Considering the massive amounts of gp flying around at high levels, and time not being a factor, you basically have access to anything in the book.
It is a logical course of action to take, but you are subverting the rules of the game in my opinion.
@leo: =0 yeah sounds like a great idea, and much more easier to do than planeshift jumping (which ties you spells (8hr of counts against spells of next day rule :O). Thanks!
@fergie: I can see your point but I believe that was much more of an issue in 3.5 than in PF. I believe casters have been hugely nerfed and classes that were underpowered in 3.5 like the pally are kings of the mountain in PF.
Actually there's another factor. Perhaps in other campaigns people are but I'm not rich by any degree. *and* if you screw a craft roll, you just lost all your time and money. Last session I crafted a cloak for me in which I had 25% chance to fail and I was like crossing fingers when rolling the die, else I would have lost 12k gp in absolutely nothing. On the other side I'm already spending feats (3 crafting feats) that could be used elsewhere (and make me more effective in another area). Sadly in Fortress of Stone Giants there were absolutely no loot for me. Zero. Everyone was like "oooh the full plate goes to the tank, ooooh this goes to X. I just got share of the money at the end of the campaign module :S. I don't know. I'd say: great feats? yes. Risk for profit? yes. Overpowered and campaign destroyer? I'm not sure, when I start doing everything inside and outside combat like the paladin Ill change my PoV. Also, Im the healer/buffer =/. Even if i were having access to op items I think I'm the role that would affect the game the least. (compared to "oops I accidentally 1 shotted the mob")
Summarizing: Crafting: DC roll to craft (risk), time, feats and the same gold other chars of your party have (opposed to infinite gold for crafting purposes)
also: you grow older faster. who wants that? perhaps OOC it doesn't matter much. What about IC? I would have a problem with that.
The create demiplane spells are probably the best way to go...
Using a custom crafter build (feats that reduce time and cost) you can get your crafting time/costs down.
The point was made that crafting at high levels can break a game. This has always been the case since the 3.5 rules came out. There are steps a GM can take to reduce the likelihood of that happening... first and foremost talk with the player. If that is not enough remember that each settlement (from thorp to metropolis) has a limit on how much magic is available there. This also means that your crafter is limited to how much he can sell (and at what price). I recommend the GM giving them a percentage of what is possible (level + d? whatever you like).
The GM can also tax any crafting, require the crafter to be a member in good standing with a guild or subguild of crafters.
A question I would like answered is in regard to flowing time: how would it stack with multiple castings of create demiplane?
I'm tryin' to sleep here.
"I believe casters have been hugely nerfed and classes that were underpowered in 3.5 like the pally are kings of the mountain in PF." - This is demonstrably false. But whatever power levels you are comfortable with in your game is your call! :)