I'm lightly working on an encounter for one of my groups wherein it struck me as appropriate to use a cavalier. I've statted things out and I'm happy with the challenge he will present to the party. That's all fine.
What occurred to me is that I absolutely wouldn't be surprised if someone in the party manages to capture the cavalier's mount once he's vanquished. Given it's an animal - and a domesticated one at that - I can just see our druid taking the time to Handle Animal this beast into cooperation over time. Problem is... the darned horse has 12 HD, and is independently bad-ass.
I've never had this problem before because with familiars they revert to their prior, "useless" selves. Druids' animal companions tend to be unusual animals which aren't normally easily domesticated so I don't need to worry about the part barbarian adopting a wolf or alligator or whatever.
What I'm thinking The Answer is... is to treat the horse as treasure. If they capture it and convince it to work with/for them, that's great, but it has value. What I don't really get is what value I should assign. I just don't relish the idea that without the cavalier around the horse will wither and revert to Bestiary horse stats.
I'm inviting suggestions on other ways to view the likely outcome, and discussion of what the price of various mounts should be. In this case, it's a 15th-level cavalier.
well based on the cavalier's mount description it says there bond is so strong that when a mount dies the cavalier cant take another until after one week of mourning. so if you dont want them to be able to keep it you could say the animal is enraged at losing its master and either fight to the death with the party or just not allow any of them to get near it regardless of handle animal checks.
i mean it makes enough sense even animals can grow bonds with humans and i dont think any of us here would just go along with someone who killed our best friend.
but for the value? that im not sure on, i apologise
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I'm lightly working on an encounter for one of my groups wherein it struck me as appropriate to use a cavalier. I've statted things out and I'm happy with the challenge he will present to the party. That's all fine.
What occurred to me is that I absolutely wouldn't be surprised if someone in the party manages to capture the cavalier's mount once he's vanquished. Given it's an animal - and a domesticated one at that - I can just see our druid taking the time to Handle Animal this beast into cooperation over time. Problem is... the darned horse has 12 HD, and is independently bad-ass.
I've never had this problem before because with familiars they revert to their prior, "useless" selves. Druids' animal companions tend to be unusual animals which aren't normally easily domesticated so I don't need to worry about the part barbarian adopting a wolf or alligator or whatever.
What I'm thinking The Answer is... is to treat the horse as treasure. If they capture it and convince it to work with/for them, that's great, but it has value. What I don't really get is what value I should assign. I just don't relish the idea that without the cavalier around the horse will wither and revert to Bestiary horse stats.
I'm inviting suggestions on other ways to view the likely outcome, and discussion of what the price of various mounts should be. In this case, it's a 15th-level cavalier.
Treat it the same way you would a Druid or Rangers animal companion when they release it to take a new one. It regresses back to what a normal animal of it's type would be. Remember it's the Bond with the cavalier that makes it more than just a Horse.
If it killed the BBEG the horse would become hostile as it killed someone it had a bond with and should be protective. As for the value that is really tricky but should be worth a lot. MAybe try stating out the horse as a monster and then compare it to golems.
My other thought that just came to me:
Tell the druid point blank that failing to release such a magnificent creature to spread its seed to others of its species, and instead taking it adventuring where it might be killed by unnatural horrors from beyond this world, would qualify as "failing to revere nature" and result in his immediate forfeiture of Druid abilities until he atones.
Bing, bing, bing.
Now that's an excellent role-play angle for which - even if I don't end up using it - I deeply thank you. I've been trying to think of role-play moments to more deeply cement my players' connections with their characters. A druid is more than just a statblock. That sort of thing. This could help, though I'm very big on rewarding in-character sacrifice.
To everyone else, thank for the input. I agree that mechanically the horse should lose its special status but the simulationist in me just won't allow it in this case. I also have issues with the idea that the horse simply can't be tamed; the gameist in me recognizes that arbitrarily saying "no" to my players is lame and second I know there are methods such as dominate monster that can work around that.
So, thanks. In the end I suspect I'll prepare a menu of possible outcomes including a treasure value, and rewards for letting the beast loose. Heck, I happen to have put it's 12th level ability increase into Intelligence, putting it slightly above animal. Could make for a nice recurrent villain. "Yes, that horse is trampling you in your sleep. Yes, in your rope trick." <Grin>
Heck, I happen to have put it's 12th level ability increase into Intelligence, putting it slightly above animal. Could make for a nice recurrent villain. "Yes, that horse is trampling you in your sleep. Yes, in your rope trick." <Grin>
I was going to suggest putting one of its attribute bonuses into Int. Then it might fight to the death or simply flee...but I like your idea better. A reoccurring horse villain.
Heck, I happen to have put it's 12th level ability increase into Intelligence, putting it slightly above animal. Could make for a nice recurrent villain. "Yes, that horse is trampling you in your sleep. Yes, in your rope trick." <Grin>
Now *that* is a truly great way to cement them to their characters and experiences.
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Heck, I happen to have put it's 12th level ability increase into Intelligence, putting it slightly above animal. Could make for a nice recurrent villain. "Yes, that horse is trampling you in your sleep. Yes, in your rope trick." <Grin>
+1
Something the players won't see coming AND it adds to the story in a humorous way! I say go for it!