Arcane Eldritch Heritage Wizard and his Familiar

[Richard Leonhart]

I've searched for this thread, but couldn't find it, only a lot of sorcerors complaining that everyone gets their goodies.

What happens if a wizard takes eldritch heritage for the arcane one, only the first feat for the familiar.
The ability very clearly states that it stacks with wizard levels.

So what insane familiar would a lvl 20 wizard get?

What I think is:
38 HD
half the lvl 20 wizards hp, or does he add imaginary sorceror hp?
attack, saving throws, skills, same as HP above.

Natural armor adjustment: +19
intelligence: 24
special: ? wait for epic handbook
spell resistence: 33

If you had to guess, what improved familiar could a lvl 38 "wizard" have?
Colossal dragon? Balor?

So, is there any merit in taking twice the bonded item? (I think not, as wizard level doesn't matter)
Are my stats correct? What about HP, attack, saves ect?

What abilities would you give at epic levels?
How can you (ab)use 38 HD? My guess is poison from familiar.

Do you think this use was intended? (I doubt so, but it seems an obvious abuse)

[meowstef]

so it's HD equals yours so no change

HP half yous so again no change

attacks save ectra are all based on your so no change

you might talk a GM into letting you have a very smart armored familiar but I think most would say something like you already count as having that bloodline sorry try again

[Richard Leonhart]

thanks, haven't seen that HD is based on character level, not class level (which in this case would be higher).

So all I would get is natural armor, intelligence and specials.
Spell resistance says "masters level", I suppose that means class level.

Yes that might indeed not be worth it.

For the fluff argument, wizards don't have an heritage, that's why they have to study for it. However I would understand a GM who wouldn't allow it, altough that would be a houserule.

[LazarX]

Richard Leonhart wrote:

I've searched for this thread, but couldn't find it, only a lot of sorcerors complaining that everyone gets their goodies.

Wizards already have the arcane bond class feature. 2 of the same feature does not stack. Even if you want the item for one and the familliar for the other it's still the same feature.

[mdt]

LazarX wrote:

Richard Leonhart wrote:

I've searched for this thread, but couldn't find it, only a lot of sorcerors complaining that everyone gets their goodies.

Wizards already have the arcane bond class feature. 2 of the same feature does not stack. Even if you want the item for one and the familliar for the other it's still the same feature.

I disagree.

If you multiclassed Wizard/Sorcerer, you could have arcane bond for the Wizard using an item, and Arcane Bond for the Sorcerer using a familiar. Since you chose different options for both classes, the ability wouldn't stack (it would only stack if you chose the same option for both classes). An option is just that, an option. If a druid multiclassed Ranger and the Ranger took the ability to share his bonsues with allies instead of an animal companion, you wouldn't force him to take animal companion to make them stack. He made a different option with each class.

The stacking is if you choose the same option.

So, I see no reason why a wizard couldn't take Arcane Bond (Focus) for his wizard option, and Arcane Bond (Familiar) for his eldritch heritage option.

There's no reason for a wizard to choose familiar for both class option and feat option, unless he was multiclassing and wanted his familiar to be as high as his HD regardless of what classes he took.

[Midnight_Angel]

Huh? As far as I can see, there is no automatic 'Arcane Bond' for Sorcerers, unless they belong to an Arcane Bloodline

The Bloodline Power states:

Quote:

Arcane Bond (Su): At 1st level, you gain an arcane bond, as a wizard equal to your sorcerer level. Your sorcerer levels stack with any wizard levels you possess when determining the powers of your familiar or bonded object. This ability does not allow you to have both a familiar and a bonded item.

Which, in my opinion, is a clear "reason why a wizard couldn't take Arcane Bond (Focus) for his wizard option, and Arcane Bond (Familiar) for his eldritch heritage option"...

[Quandary]

See above for trying to mix Bonded Object and Familiar.

Re: taking the Familiar option twice (via Wizard and Eldritch Heritage),
The Arcane BL Sorceror class ability is written assuming that Sorceror levels are mutually exclusive with other class levels (i.e. multiclassing Sorceror and Wizard), which is the context of `class levels stacking`. When Wizard levels are counting as relevant class levels for Arcane Bond (via Eld. Heritage) that suberts that clear distinction, but I would say the same class level can`t count twice towards a given ability... The `stacking` wording is to combine independent `stacks` into one stack, but it doesn`t mean you count any class level twice. Imagine if the Wizard gained the Familiar ability twice (not specifying a 2nd Familar, just the exact same ability). That would be redundant, and wouldn`t provide any additional benefit. Same thing here.

The Eldritch Heritage for the Wizard character is really only helpful if they are multi-classing and want to keep INT, Nat. Armor, Special Familiar abilities, and qualification for Improved Familiars at max character level.

[Eschatar, Karcinal]

Richard Leonhart wrote:

So, is there any merit in taking twice the bonded item? (I think not, as wizard level doesn't matter)
Are my stats correct? What about HP, attack, saves ect?

The Arcane Bloodline explicitly states that your wizard levels (not character levels) stack with sorcerer levels when determining the power of the arcane bond.

This means a Bonded Item can cast your freebie spell at CL 38 when your wizard level is at Level 20. Assuming Illusion isn't one of his opposition schools, your wizard could cast Simulacrum and have replicas of Lucifer doing your bidding. Who needs familiars when you can have more than one simulacrum? Better yet, make a simulacrum of a spellcaster, and have it get a mascot familiar that can deliver touch spells for the whole party.

If your wizard is a half-elf, casting Paragon Surge through the Bonded Item will give you early access to higher-level Feats and Arcane Discoveries. At 11th level, placing a permanent Paragon Surge effect on his Bonded Item will give a wizard the Immortality Arcane Discovery so long as he wears it. Alternatively, he could have two Contingency spells placed on him at the same time, and they could both be of 6th spell level.