If I cast Expeditious retreat on myself and have haste caste on me by the groups wizard what is my movement rate? Do the two effects stack?
If I cast Expeditious retreat on myself and have haste caste on me by the groups wizard what is my movement rate? Do the two effects stack?
Hi! Good question.
The answer unfortunately is no. This is because the movement speed bump from Haste is an enhancment bonus and the speed bump from Expeditious Retreat is also an enhancement bonus.
The two enhancement bonuses affect the same parameter (movement speed ) and thus do not stack, just the greater bonus applies. As they are both 30 feet, you'll get an increase of 30 feet.
nor do they stack with a monk's fast movement class feature.
Mechanically true, but I wonder why.
Halfling Monk level 9, speed is 20+30.Human Wizard, speed is 30.
Apply Haste (or Expeditious Retreat).
The wizard is now faster than the monk.
Logic ?
I think just for simplicity Louis. In 3.5 Monk speeds greater than +30 were considered an enhancement bonus (per Sage Advice).
Haste and Expeditious Retreat don't stack, but there are advantages to having both, if you are base speed of 20 (as Enaris mentioned), or if you have movement types other than land (which Haste affects but Expeditious Retreat does not).
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nor do they stack with a monk's fast movement class feature.Mechanically true, but I wonder why.
Halfling Monk level 9, speed is 20+30.
Human Wizard, speed is 30.
Apply Haste (or Expeditious Retreat).
The wizard is now faster than the monk.
Logic ?
Logic is that the monk is always at that speed while the wizard's runs out in rounds/level. So 24hours a day vs rounds per day.
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while all this is true it isn't necessarily always true because as a GM I have ruled that they do stack and they can stack with a monk movement bonus..... for example I had a monk player who also had level in wizard his base move was 30 his monk speed was +60 he cast expeditious which was +30 then he cast haste which is x2 (instead of the 30 or x2) move and attacks in initiative and a +1 dodge to AC so he had a total speed of 240
This is the rules forum. Houserules don't really belong here.
By RAW they don't stack.
so he had a total speed of 240
And that's why imo, its a good thing that they do not stack. Running faster than most dragons can fly seems difficult to fathom to me. Yes, fantasy game, his table, all that I grant you. Just making a comparative note.
Great! Thanks for the input.
nor do they stack with a monk's fast movement class feature.Mechanically true, but I wonder why.
Halfling Monk level 9, speed is 20+30.
Human Wizard, speed is 30.
Apply Haste (or Expeditious Retreat).
The wizard is now faster than the monk.
Logic ?
Yes cause your sample is is flawed.
Human any thing 30ft
Halfing any thing 20ft
Human will always run faster.
Monk level 9 +30 feet all the time
Some one that cast Haste +20 or +30 for rounds equal to cater level Short time.
Some one that cast Exeditious Retreat +30 for minutes equal to cater level Short time.
PS I know "Absolutely" nothing about cars so please do not counter cause I have no care. I am a Gamer not car guy.
Your car can 100 MPH or 150 MPH with nitro for 20 seconds.
My can goes 125 MPH all the time.
In a drag race you win hand down. In Long 500 mile race I smoke you.
I win by 1 hour.
So realy is it realy fair. Yes... It just what race do you want to run.
The real problem is Hafling and Gnome move 20ft and Goblins and Kobolds move 30ft. All small all not the same.
Dwarf is meduim theat move like a small 20ft.
And Haste gives an enhancement bonus to your normal land speed.
It doesn't actually say that. Indeed, it says it "affects the creature's jumping distance as normal for increased speed", and the acrobatic rules (what the word "normal" is refering to) say "Creatures with a base land speed above 30 feet receive a +4 racial bonus on Acrobatics checks made to jump for every 10 feet of their speed above 30 feet." In order to actually do what Haste says it does, it needs to indeed affect "base land speed", and not "land speed"*. And therefore, the two spells don't stack.
*) "Base land speed" or just "base speed" is before encumberance, "land speed" is after encumberance.
Always hilarious when someone comes in 6+ years after the last post and says something categorically wrong.
Make that 11 years...
Expeditious Retreat has its niche even when Haste is available: Not capped to double base speed, lower spell level (for example easier to quicken) and longer duration. So it's not that much of a problem that they don't stack.
Beyond that, does anyone really want level 5+ characters run around with 90 ft lightning speed on the usually small maps? It might feel cool a few times, but then it becomes cheesy. And as usual, the GM can use the same tactics for their NPCs...
