It has a 1 hour casting time, lats only 1/hour per level, costs 50 gp per hit die, gains no special abilities, and can turn on you if you DM whims it, and if he doesn't it still has little reason to stick around or contribute to any meaningful task.
I like the idea of a lesser version of this spell, I am just having a hard time justifying taking it over zombies.
It has a 1 hour casting time, lats only 1/hour per level, costs 50 gp per hit die, gains no special abilities, and can turn on you if you DM whims it, and if he doesn't it still has little reason to stick around or contribute to any meaningful task.
I like the idea of a lesser version of this spell, I am just having a hard time justifying taking it over zombies.
it's a terrific distraction - imagine if you could manage to make a simulacrum of someone you don't like. have that double go and commit some horrible crime while in public, and time it so that the original has no alibi. there ya go! instant scandal!
or say you need to go commit some sort of crime. you dress your simulacrum up as you, send him/her off to high tea with the chief magistrate and then go rob someone blind. If you get seen, the chief justice is your alibi witness. nobody knows it was you.
to be more specific, in our Kingmaker campaign, the players are thinking of using various simulacrums to oversee boring court functions while they go and do various/sundry sneaky things in their capital city. they also think it'll be a great way to avoid random assassination attempts. they also want to use the more advanced version of the spell to infiltrate Pitax and Brevoy..but that won't be for a while yet.
Brilliant! except.... why do they want to go to those boring court functions?
Brilliant! except.... why do they want to go to those boring court functions?
I don't think the simulacrums have a choice in the matter.
Also - i'm pretty sure you can magic jar a simulacrum. so in theory, it could be an excellent (if short lived) way to go do something in a lethal environment without putting your actual body at risk. possess the duplicate, load up on disposable magic items (potions, wands and/or scrolls). then go do your business and self destruct the double right after you jump back into your real body.
I can think of a couple reasons where something like that could come in handy.
Brilliant! except.... why do they want to go to those boring court functions?I don't think the simulacrums have a choice in the matter.
Also - i'm pretty sure you can magic jar a simulacrum. so in theory, it could be an excellent (if short lived) way to go do something in a lethal environment without putting your actual body at risk. possess the duplicate, load up on disposable magic items (potions, wands and/or scrolls). then go do your business and self destruct the double right after you jump back into your real body.
I can think of a couple reasons where something like that could come in handy.
Lesser simulacrums have free will, and disposable magic items just seem to cut even more into your money then the simulacrum does. Not to mention it gets a save vs magic jar like any other creature so why spend money on a simulacrum if you can just posses some poor shumck anyway?
Lesser simulacrums have free will, and disposable magic items just seem to cut even more into your money then the simulacrum does. Not to mention it gets a save vs magic jar like any other creature so why spend money on a simulacrum if you can just posses some poor shumck anyway?Brilliant! except.... why do they want to go to those boring court functions?I don't think the simulacrums have a choice in the matter.
Also - i'm pretty sure you can magic jar a simulacrum. so in theory, it could be an excellent (if short lived) way to go do something in a lethal environment without putting your actual body at risk. possess the duplicate, load up on disposable magic items (potions, wands and/or scrolls). then go do your business and self destruct the double right after you jump back into your real body.
I can think of a couple reasons where something like that could come in handy.
yes, but it will STILL be half the HD of the original. so you could still zap it with charm person, beat it into submission, then magic jar it. of course, there's always the point that it considers YOU its creator. so you could always just talk it into being a magic jar target with a diplomacy check.
also - remember, sometimes it can be very helpful to have someone think you are dead. Illusions aren't always reliable and can be seen through at inconvenient times. A paranoid assassin after you has True Seeing up, sees your simulacrum go up in a giant ball of searing flame, or go over the top of the Reichenbach Falls and thinks 'well..that's it then, assignment done'.
could be expensive to pull off, but worth it if you need to fake someone's death. Hell, half the surviving nobility from Galt would see that worth it. send a lesser simulacrum off to face the guillotine while they use alter self to flee the country.
I can do that to a random farmer too. Only it won't cost me 50 gold. (or more if you can't find a 2 HD creature to copy)
Edit: in the instance of being the target of assassination I can see this helping (if you can convince it to walk near a cliff to be fireballed off). A zombie with alter self seems more effective.
Edit2: you can't send him to the guillotine cause when it dies it turns to snow.
Heres my question. What is the personality the devs imagine for a lesser simulacrum. Does it know it was given free will and a life span of only a few hours? How does the lesser simulacrum feel about having free will but no time to exercise this free will? What is the lesser simulacrum's starting attitude toward its creator? Does the simulacrum have the memories or personality of the creature it is meant to be a likeness of?
I can do that to a random farmer too. Only it won't cost me 50 gold. (or more if you can't find a 2 HD creature to copy)
Edit: in the instance of being the target of assassination I can see this helping (if you can convince it to walk near a cliff to be fireballed off). A zombie with alter self seems more effective.
Edit2: you can't send him to the guillotine cause when it dies it turns to snow.
actually, you CAN send it to the guillotine - by the time they figure it out, you SHOULD be miles away.
Heres my question. What is the personality the devs imagine for a lesser simulacrum. Does it know it was given free will and a life span of only a few hours? How does the lesser simulacrum feel about having free will but no time to exercise this free will? What is the lesser simulacrum's starting attitude toward its creator? Does the simulacrum have the memories or personality of the creature it is meant to be a likeness of?
Those were my first questions, my conclusion? they would say "ask your DM" so that doesn't help.
Zombies on the other hand are loyal and last indefinitely, at the same level, just because evil is better I guess. That's why i am working to find uses.
actually, you CAN send it to the guillotine - by the time they figure it out, you SHOULD be miles away.
Would you mind painting the scenario for me?
Would you mind painting the scenario for me?
actually, you CAN send it to the guillotine - by the time they figure it out, you SHOULD be miles away.
think about it. you KNOW that the hordes of peasants are coming to raid your estate and chop off your head. you know also that the mob generally doesn't waste time on trials or very thorough searches/investigations. so you go home, cook up a quick simulacrum and get it ripping drunk. leave it passed out in the living room and leave something shiny for the mob to find.
then you alter self, grab the more valuable and portable treasures and high tail it outta town dressed as a dirty commoner.
the mob shows up wielding pitch forks and torches. they find the simulacrum standing around being all drunk and sloppy. they loot the shiny stuff, down whatever beer is left in the fridge and haul your double off to be executed in the town square.
now...depending on level, the double isn't gonna last you all night. But it should last long enough to satisfy the mob that they got the real deal. they get worked up into a blood frenzy, they go to haul the simulacrum out to the guillotine and...bam! they find a puddle of water.
now they're obviously gonna be a mite angry about it. But by this point they've wasted at least several hours looting and drinking. you've spent several hours changing disguises three times, and hauled ass along a pre-determined escape route that NOBODY else knows about. unless you've been exceptionally stupid, odds are very much in your favor that you'll be across the border into the the River Kingdoms by the time the mob has gotten itself organized enough to even THINK about tracking you down. And it's possible that the mob will lose interest and just find another target...either way, you're out a cheap simulacrum and keep your head on your shoulders.
Would you mind painting the scenario for me?
actually, you CAN send it to the guillotine - by the time they figure it out, you SHOULD be miles away.
think about it. you KNOW that the hordes of peasants are coming to raid your estate and chop off your head. you know also that the mob generally doesn't waste time on trials or very thorough searches/investigations. so you go home, cook up a quick simulacrum and get it ripping drunk. leave it passed out in the living room and leave something shiny for the mob to find.
then you alter self, grab the more valuable and portable treasures and high tail it outta town dressed as a dirty commoner.
the mob shows up wielding pitch forks and torches. they find the simulacrum standing around being all drunk and sloppy. they loot the shiny stuff, down whatever beer is left in the fridge and haul your double off to be executed in the town square.
now...depending on level, the double isn't gonna last you all night. But it should last long enough to satisfy the mob that they got the real deal. they get worked up into a blood frenzy, they go to haul the simulacrum out to the guillotine and...bam! they find a puddle of water.
now they're obviously gonna be a mite angry about it. But by this point they've wasted at least several hours looting and drinking. you've spent several hours changing disguises three times, and hauled ass along a pre-determined escape route that NOBODY else knows about. unless you've been exceptionally stupid, odds are very much in your favor that you'll be across the border into the the River Kingdoms by the time the mob has gotten itself organized enough to even THINK about tracking you down. And it's possible that the mob will lose interest and just find another target...either way, you're out a cheap simulacrum and keep your head on your shoulders.
How far away are the peasants? If you have two hours to create him get him drunk and pack, why didn't you just pack and leave in the first place?
How far away are the peasants? If you have two hours to create him get him...
it takes a mob a bit of time to work itself up into a proper frenzy. Besides, you WANT them distracted, remember?
it takes a mob a bit of time to work itself up into a proper frenzy. Besides, you WANT them distracted, remember?
How far away are the peasants? If you have two hours to create him get him...
Why? you only want them distracted so you have a couple hours to escape, but you already have that time, so you should just escape.
Why? you only want them distracted so you have a couple hours to escape, but you already have that time, so you should just escape.it takes a mob a bit of time to work itself up into a proper frenzy. Besides, you WANT them distracted, remember?
How far away are the peasants? If you have two hours to create him get him...
that's just it - you don't really have the time to escape. they're LOOKING for you, remember? But if they've already found you, then they aren't looking anymore. that's why you let them catch the simulacrum.
Contributor, RPG Superstar 2010 Top 8
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Need to negotiate a deal with a local nobleman, but suspect he's going to double-cross you? Send a Simulacrum!
It's got half your skill ranks, so while it may not be quite as good at Diplomacy as you, it's going to be quite a bit better than a zombie.
If you are betrayed, the Simulacrum is smart enough to know when to try to escape, and when to stand and fight. It shouldn't be too worried about dying either, because it's life is over in a few hours no matter what.
Need to negotiate a deal with a local nobleman, but suspect he's going to double-cross you? Send a Simulacrum!
It's got half your skill ranks, so while it may not be quite as good at Diplomacy as you, it's going to be quite a bit better than a zombie.
If you are betrayed, the Simulacrum is smart enough to know when to try to escape, and when to stand and fight. It shouldn't be too worried about dying either, because it's life is over in a few hours no matter what.
you can also make a lesser simulacrum of someone and then interrogate it. sometimes you want information but can't risk grabbing the original.
granted, the simulacrum won't have perfect knowledge of what the original knows...but it might know just enough to point you in the right direction. maps of secret areas, key details of political meetings, locations of equipment caches, passwords to magical traps...even if you only get ONE of those out of the simulacrum it might be enough.
Need to negotiate a deal with a local nobleman, but suspect he's going to double-cross you? Send a Simulacrum!
It's got half your skill ranks, so while it may not be quite as good at Diplomacy as you, it's going to be quite a bit better than a zombie.
If you are betrayed, the Simulacrum is smart enough to know when to try to escape, and when to stand and fight. It shouldn't be too worried about dying either, because it's life is over in a few hours no matter what.
Why would it waste its short life negotiating with politicians? Seems like a waste from its view.
that's just it - you don't really have the time to escape. they're LOOKING for you, remember? But if they've already found you, then they aren't looking anymore. that's why you let them catch the simulacrum.
I would say two hours is sufficient time to escape.
Edit: I don't believe it gets the originals knowledge, it is a shadow illusion not a clone.
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Contributor, RPG Superstar 2010 Top 8
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Why would it waste its short life negotiating with politicians? Seems like a waste from its view.Need to negotiate a deal with a local nobleman, but suspect he's going to double-cross you? Send a Simulacrum!
It's got half your skill ranks, so while it may not be quite as good at Diplomacy as you, it's going to be quite a bit better than a zombie.
If you are betrayed, the Simulacrum is smart enough to know when to try to escape, and when to stand and fight. It shouldn't be too worried about dying either, because it's life is over in a few hours no matter what.
Because fulfilling one's reason for existence is spiritually satisfying?
Or because you convinced it to by offering it some reward (a little coin for wine and women in its final moments)?
Or if, as a copy of you, it shares your alignment (which if I recall correctly simulacrum do), it might go along with your plan because it agrees with your goals. ("If I can save all those orphans with my brief life, then I shall!")
Because fulfilling one's reason for existence is spiritually satisfying?
Or because you convinced it to by offering it some reward (a little coin for wine and women in its final moments)?
Or if, as a copy of you, it shares your alignment (which if I recall correctly simulacrum do), it might go along with your plan because it agrees with your goals. ("If I can save all those orphans with my brief life, then I shall!")
Relying on DM fiat makes my stomach churn. And no, it shares nothing personality wise with whoever it is modeled after. It gains none of your experiences.
I'll stick to being evil. Thanks though, I don't want you to think I don't appreciate the effort.