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Well, just a quick couple of questions really..
First off, you have a table in the Bladebound archetype that goes over at what magus lvls your black blade gains int/cha/wis and how much overall ego it will have. But, it also goes over an enhancement bonus that isn't mentioned in the black blade's write up, which is very odd... The CLOSEST thing written up, is the ability a little later on in the write up that costs the blade an arcane point, to increase the damage of your weapon, but that is an unnamed bonus, not an enhancement bonus. Basically, I was just wondering if I should take it as it says in the table, without an explanation, or if this was an oversight. Its just it literally goes over every time it gains a point of int, and cha/wis and ego... Just not the enhancment bonus...
My second big question, is something I kinda felt a little awkward about... Nowhere in the Bladebound write up does it tell you if you can improve upon the Black Blade any other way than lvling up. It kinda goes over that stuff in Intelligent item section, but since this is a class feature, and there isn't anything mentioned of whether you can't mess with it, or whether you can and how... I'm kinda stuck on what to do about that, hehe >.< Anyway, hope i can get some input on these questions real quick.
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rule of thum is unless the rules say you can do something you cant.
so i'm inclined to say no. Because the ego would raise and then the chart would be pointless to print the ego on, they would have given us a formula to calculate its ego
Also it gives a reason for you to use your 1st level arcane pool ability to make it better.
rule of thum is unless the rules say you can do something you cant.
so i'm inclined to say no. Because the ego would raise and then the chart would be pointless to print the ego on, they would have given us a formula to calculate its ego
Also it gives a reason for you to use your 1st level arcane pool ability to make it better.
Not to mention that it specifically says "Due to its flexible and powerful nature, a black blade has a nonstandard ego progression". So if it was to be easy to enchant it further, it'd just have a ego modifier or something...
Being able to independently enchant the blade brings up a couple of problems, notably that the ego progression is hard to figure and the question of what happens if you enchant the blade to total +10 before level 17 (or earlier).
That said, if you're not allowed to enchant it the archetype basically becomes a steaming pile, so I'd try to convince your DM to allow it. The ego thing is annoying but not impossible and the total enhancement can be easily gentlemen's agreement-ed away (ie: don't add over +5 in special ability powers).
your ignoring that it's a magic weapon as part of a class with the ability to enhance magic weapons.
there is no reason to need to enhance it outside of the class.
your ignoring that it's a magic weapon as part of a class with the ability to enhance magic weapons.
there is no reason to need to enhance it outside of the class.
I consider "to save limited use abilities" to be a reason.
Also 'hard' should never be consider synonymous with "can't be done."
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Being able to independently enchant the blade brings up a couple of problems, notably that the ego progression is hard to figure and the question of what happens if you enchant the blade to total +10 before level 17 (or earlier).
That said, if you're not allowed to enchant it the archetype basically becomes a steaming pile, so I'd try to convince your DM to allow it. The ego thing is annoying but not impossible and the total enhancement can be easily gentlemen's agreement-ed away (ie: don't add over +5 in special ability powers).
How does that make the archtype crap? I think its great. You enhance your blade with your arcane pool, it can do all damage as energy damage, unbreakable, teleports to you, and can give you back points for your arcane pool
Its a decent savings on gear price, and it only cost a few points from your arcane pool and your 3rd level arcana.
I think its a fair trade
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M'kay, I was pretty sure that messing with the black blade was a no no, and I'm kinda fine with that. It would have been much more headache then it was worth... But the question of the Enhancement bonus still stands... If it simply states the progression of the Black Blade's, Black Blade Strike damage (which i highly doubt, because again, it calls it an enhancement bonus in the table, but in the description of the ability, its a simple, unnamed damage bonus) then in general, the black blade is rather worthless as a weapon. But if its not, then it can be at least a somewhat decent weapon, best when used in concert with your other magus abilities.. But then, what exactly can you do, if anything, with the enhancement bonus? Does it have to stay a simple +enh bonus, or can you maybe mess with it, and add qualities to it instead?
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your ignoring that it's a magic weapon as part of a class with the ability to enhance magic weapons.
there is no reason to need to enhance it outside of the class.
Right, except that the ability to enhance it requires a limited daily resource that's very valuable in other areas, like spell recall.
Tangent: is there anything that prevent a magus from using arcane pool buffing to put a weapon over +10 total? I don't think it would be broken or anything, just not sure if there's some overarching rule about it somewhere.
There is a ruling on a pally's divine bond going past +10(but I don't remember what it was). I'd apply the same rule about breaking +10 to a magus.
The enhancement bonus is what it says it is. An enhancement bonus. I don't think they thought it had to be spelled out. The other bonus damage is a different ability. It also scales the same as (and stacks with) arcane strike.
The Paladin ruling was that it doesn't specifically say that you can, so you can't go over +10 That means anything over +5 would be redundant in the long run if you are using arcane pool.
The other thing is that so long as you are still getting you expected wealth by level, you'll have a lot more to spend on other stuff. At level three a +1 weapon is about 2/3 of your expected wealth, when it becomes +2 it would be just shy of 80%, and adding in the bonus from arcane pool, makes the difference more significant. This becomes less noticeable at higher levels, a +10 weapon is about a quarter of a level 20's wealth.
On top of that, because it is straight enhancement bonus, you'll most likely be ahead of the curve on straight enhancement bonuses compared to most players. That means that you will be better against DR, as of lvl 9 you can make your weapon +5 and bypass any DR except for B or P, which you can bypass with energy attunement.
Arcane Strike, and Black Blade Strike stack for damage, so you should be relatively ok for static damage modifiers, and since the Blade has a special purpose it should (I think, not to clear on intelligent item rules) have a special purpose power.
You're getting this at the price of one arcana (equivalent to a feat) and an altered pool progression (you actually have more total all the way up, but your use of some is limited). The difference in you personal pool is between 1-4 (2@8, 3@14 4@20).
I can understand how the archetype wouldn't be for everyone, but I don't think it is worse overall.
RPG Superstar 2014 Top 32
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If no weapon can progress past a total of +10 worth of enhancements and powers, then The Bladebound Magus will hit that cap without any outside assistance at level 17. At 17 the blade’s built-in enhancement bonus hits +5, according to table 1-3, and the magus gains the ability to add +5 worth of special abilities through Arcane Pool.
Now for a lower level example look at level 9. The blade’s built-in enhancement bonus is +3, and your Arcane Pool allows you add +3 points worth of special abilities. You could spend 2 points of the Arcane Pool to raise the enhancement bonus to the cap of +5, and still have 1 point to spend on a special ability. You could also spend all 3 points on special abilities. Leaving you with a +3 keen flaming burst sword. Whatever combination works for you.
The only real downside to a free +10 magic item is the limit of what can be added to the weapon with Arcane Pool. You would not be able to add abilities such as Defending, Ghost Touch, Holy or many others.
The enchanting rules are a little confusing, but I still haven’t found anything that would help with how to determine the material the blade is constructed from. Are all black blades considered to be made of steel, or can you find/inherit a sword made of mithral, cold iron or adamantine?
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If no weapon can progress past a total of +10 worth of enhancements and powers, then The Bladebound Magus will hit that cap without any outside assistance at level 17. At 17 the blade’s built-in enhancement bonus hits +5, according to table 1-3, and the magus gains the ability to add +5 worth of special abilities through Arcane Pool.
Now for a lower level example look at level 9. The blade’s built-in enhancement bonus is +3, and your Arcane Pool allows you add +3 points worth of special abilities. You could spend 2 points of the Arcane Pool to raise the enhancement bonus to the cap of +5, and still have 1 point to spend on a special ability. You could also spend all 3 points on special abilities. Leaving you with a +3 keen flaming burst sword. Whatever combination works for you.
The only real downside to a free +10 magic item is the limit of what can be added to the weapon with Arcane Pool. You would not be able to add abilities such as Defending, Ghost Touch, Holy or many others.
The enchanting rules are a little confusing, but I still haven’t found anything that would help with how to determine the material the blade is constructed from. Are all black blades considered to be made of steel, or can you find/inherit a sword made of mithral, cold iron or adamantine?
Well, I'm looking at the Black Blade now and see nothing at all that you can add Flaming and Keen. You can change the damage type to an energy type instead of weapon type damage. But you don't get to add Flaming or any other Ability Enhancement to the weapon using your pool.
rule of thum is unless the rules say you can do something you cant.
actually that is not quite right. This Black Blade is going to need some major adjudicating. It is an item. ALL items can be magically enhanced unless the item says it cannot (including Intelligent items). And, since the Black Blade is magical, and has Intelligence it MUST have an enhancement bonus, even if it is not listed under Black Blade Basics. The chart is just showing you the enhancement bonus it DOES have as the player levels.
I can see no reason in the rules as written that a Magus cannot add Enhancement Abilities to the Black Blade. As a GM I would rule the player has at most +5 worth of enhancement to use on abilities since NONE of the powers the Black Blade can do replicates enhancement abilities.
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If no weapon can progress past a total of +10 worth of enhancements and powers, then The Bladebound Magus will hit that cap without any outside assistance at level 17. At 17 the blade’s built-in enhancement bonus hits +5, according to table 1-3, and the magus gains the ability to add +5 worth of special abilities through Arcane Pool.
Now for a lower level example look at level 9. The blade’s built-in enhancement bonus is +3, and your Arcane Pool allows you add +3 points worth of special abilities. You could spend 2 points of the Arcane Pool to raise the enhancement bonus to the cap of +5, and still have 1 point to spend on a special ability. You could also spend all 3 points on special abilities. Leaving you with a +3 keen flaming burst sword. Whatever combination works for you.
The only real downside to a free +10 magic item is the limit of what can be added to the weapon with Arcane Pool. You would not be able to add abilities such as Defending, Ghost Touch, Holy or many others.
The enchanting rules are a little confusing, but I still haven’t found anything that would help with how to determine the material the blade is constructed from. Are all black blades considered to be made of steel, or can you find/inherit a sword made of mithral, cold iron or adamantine?
Black Blade is the name of the ability, or weapon type. It is a magic item so can be made of any material the GM decides. This should be a GM decision, in my opinion, and not a Player one. The player chooses the type of blade, whether rapier or whatever. But I think beyond that it makes sense for the GM to design it, since it can be part of treasure (and I think it should be counted as treasure as far as GP per level goes- though it does not say so in the rules and therefore can be just "free.")
Well, I'm looking at the Black Blade now and see nothing at all that you can add Flaming and Keen. You can change the damage type to an energy type instead of weapon type damage. But you don't get to add Flaming or any other Ability Enhancement to the weapon using your pool.
The basic Arcane Pool ability that the Magus gets at level 1 begins to allow you to buy weapon abilities such as flaming and keen beginning at level 5. There is also very little reason to bother with special materials with the Bladebound, +3 enhancement bonus overcomes DR/silver and cold iron, +4 overcomes adamantine, and +5 overcomes alignment. Beginning at level 5, if you are having difficulty with DR you can just allocate the arcane pool to enhancement bonuses and you ignore everything but alignment, weapon type, epic, and -. If that doesn't do it you can swap your damage type to an element and ignore DR altogether, but that gets expensive.
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your ignoring that it's a magic weapon as part of a class with the ability to enhance magic weapons.
there is no reason to need to enhance it outside of the class.
Right, except that the ability to enhance it requires a limited daily resource that's very valuable in other areas, like spell recall.
Tangent: is there anything that prevent a magus from using arcane pool buffing to put a weapon over +10 total? I don't think it would be broken or anything, just not sure if there's some overarching rule about it somewhere.
There is a ruling on a pally's divine bond going past +10(but I don't remember what it was). I'd apply the same rule about breaking +10 to a magus.
The enhancement bonus is what it says it is. An enhancement bonus. I don't think they thought it had to be spelled out. The other bonus damage is a different ability. It also scales the same as (and stacks with) arcane strike.
Well, the primary reason I asked about it, although I was fairly sure of the answer, was the fact that in general, if its part of a class feature, they pretty much always spell it out. The odd part is the fact that the enhancement bonus is only mentioned in the table, and is completely neglected within the actual archetype description. Even if Paizo doesn't come out and tell you what it does and doesn't do, they would normally at least put in the enhancement bonus and at what levels it increases within the description of the statistics of the black blade. The questions I mentioned were in reality, for the most party anyway, things I figured were things that were most likely overlooked. While I was curious upon the input of the community, I also wanted to state the lack of clarity within the Bladebound archetype :P But still, I appreciate the community input so far, and wished to thank everyone for their time.
There is also very little reason to bother with special materials with the Bladebound, +3 enhancement bonus overcomes DR/silver and cold iron, +4 overcomes adamantine, and +5 overcomes alignment.
Where in the rules does it say this?
Where in the rules does it say this?
There is also very little reason to bother with special materials with the Bladebound, +3 enhancement bonus overcomes DR/silver and cold iron, +4 overcomes adamantine, and +5 overcomes alignment.
Page 562, under Overcoming DR.