couple questions about the crazy Synergy between these two Teamwork feats:
let's assume a pair of 7th level Human Inquisitors Of Sarenrae, weilding a single keen Scimitar each (cause it's easy enough to get)
now, for their feats we've got:
1st:Combat reflexes
Human: Combat Expertise
3rd: Gang Up (concidered Flanking if at least 2 people are adjacent to the same target)
4th (teamwork feat, inquisitor): Paired Opportunists (+4 to hit with AoO's when adjacent to someone with feat, when said person gets an AoO you get an AoO)
5th:i dunno, something like weapon focus Scimitar I guess.
6th:Outflank (when flanking with someone with feat, Flanking Bonus becomes +4, when you crit, they get an AoO)
7th: something else to have fun with /shrug, improved trip for increased Cheese?
what I'm seeing with this is, as long as you can get someone else to come smashy smashy with you, whenever you crit your friend get an AoO, meaning you get an AoO, (do they get an AoO because you got an AoO?), anyways.
what I'm after is: If you or they crit on the AoO (with a 15-20 crit range, it's quite possible) do you/they get a free AoO cause you/they crit?
in short: Will it look like a nice smoothie once the chain starts, or does the chain not take off?
I'm asking because me and a friend are thinking of playing a pair of Inquisitors of sarenrae (convienient example no?) with the Dervish Dance feat and as High as possible dex, for maximum death blender effect. (dex for Attack and Damage when weilding a scimitar one handed with nothing in the off hand) Solo tactics means our third doesn't really need to have any of the requisite feats for teamwork, but he doesn't need to be adjacent to us anyways.
thank you for your input.
couple questions about the crazy Synergy between these two Teamwork feats:
let's assume a pair of 7th level Human Inquisitors Of Sarenrae, weilding a single keen Scimitar each (cause it's easy enough to get)now, for their feats we've got:
1st:Combat reflexes
Human: Combat Expertise
3rd: Gang Up (concidered Flanking if at least 2 people are adjacent to the same target)
4th (teamwork feat, inquisitor): Paired Opportunists (+4 to hit with AoO's when adjacent to someone with feat, when said person gets an AoO you get an AoO)
5th:i dunno, something like weapon focus Scimitar I guess.
6th:Outflank (when flanking with someone with feat, Flanking Bonus becomes +4, when you crit, they get an AoO)
7th: something else to have fun with /shrug, improved trip for increased Cheese?what I'm seeing with this is, as long as you can get someone else to come smashy smashy with you, whenever you crit your friend get an AoO, meaning you get an AoO, (do they get an AoO because you got an AoO?), anyways.
what I'm after is: If you or they crit on the AoO (with a 15-20 crit range, it's quite possible) do you/they get a free AoO cause you/they crit?
in short: Will it look like a nice smoothie once the chain starts, or does the chain not take off?
I'm asking because me and a friend are thinking of playing a pair of Inquisitors of sarenrae (convienient example no?) with the Dervish Dance feat and as High as possible dex, for maximum death blender effect. (dex for Attack and Damage when weilding a scimitar one handed with nothing in the off hand) Solo tactics means our third doesn't really need to have any of the requisite feats for teamwork, but he doesn't need to be adjacent to us anyways.
thank you for your input.
Yeah, it works. Although even at 15-20 that's only like a 1/3 chance to crit assuming you auto-confirm. While it's legit, it probably isn't going to send you into 4-digit damage easily.
oh, I wasn't expecting 4 digit damage (i mean, we're using a one handed weapon one handed that does 1d6 damage afterall), just wanted to know if the crit chain was limited on something other than our dex modifier+1, and with sky high dex, we should be good for blending things with our scimitars.
oh, I wasn't expecting 4 digit damage (i mean, we're using a one handed weapon one handed that does 1d6 damage afterall), just wanted to know if the crit chain was limited on something other than our dex modifier+1, and with sky high dex, we should be good for blending things with our scimitars.
Of course using a scimitar in a dex-based build sreams using Dervish Dance to me. Well, you'll be lacking a bit in the AC department, though.
Gang up requires two OTHER people to be threatening, to the best of my knowledge. You'd need a third teammate.
And the triggering event (getting crit) only provokes once from each person. So yes, if one of you crit, it would provoke an AoO from the other, and in so doing allow you to take an AoO, but that's where it would end.
Which doesn't make any of this useless, mind you. You'll still both be getting lots of AoOs. Thinking about multiclassing rogues at all? I guess not with Sarenrae as a diety. Just remember that you both have to have the
feats either "active" or "selected" for both to receive the benefits. So you'll likely need to work out a strategy until you've actually 'earned' the feats.
7th: something else to have fun with /shrug, improved trip for increased Cheese?You can't use scimitar for tripping, I think; only the weapons with 'Trip' quality can be used for that.
I'm pretty sure having a trip weapon just gives you a bonus (plus getting focus,w eapon training etc added), you can still trip people normally.
else you end up with rediculousness (i'm holding a dagger, so i can't kick out your feet O.o)
looking a the rule, it doesn't say anything about weapons (unlike Sunder which requires a slashing or Bludgeoning weapon IIRC)
as for Gang Up needing 3 people, I did point that out in my example, i just said they didn't need to actually be chilling with us, they just need to threaten the same target.
also: you're saying the triggering event only provokes once, which i see (i mean, if it chained that since i get an AoO, they get an AoO, meaning I get an AoO to infinity is rediculous), I mean if they crit on the AoO, is that a new instance of Crit provoking?
I'm pretty sure having a trip weapon just gives you a bonus (plus getting focus,w eapon training etc added), you can still trip people normally.7th: something else to have fun with /shrug, improved trip for increased Cheese?You can't use scimitar for tripping, I think; only the weapons with 'Trip' quality can be used for that.
You can trip people normally, but its with your foot, not with the weapon, so weapon focus and the like would not apply.
Weapons, Trip (3/5/10)
Q: The wording in pathfinder for trip attempts seems to imply that you can now trip with any type of weapon unlike in 3.5. If you do use a trip weapon the benefit seems to be that one can drop the weapon to if one fails by ten where a non-trip weapon would cause you to be tripped?
A: (James Jacobs 2/17/10) When you want to trip a foe, you don't normally use a weapon. Similarly, you don't normally use a weapon to bull rush, grapple, or overrun a foe. You just lash out with a leg sweep or whatever and try to trip the foe. Doing so is an attack, but that doesn't mean you need a weapon to make the attempt. Now... SOME weapons (not all) allow you to use the weapon to trip a foe, thus giving you a slight advantage since if you mess up the trip attempt, you can just drop the weapon to "counter" the trip that comes back at you.
So yes, if one of you crit, it would provoke an AoO from the other, and in so doing allow you to take an AoO, but that's where it would end.
Keep in mind the non-inquisitor friend will not get to make an AoO when either of the inquisitors crit. But both inquisitors will be able to make an AoO when the non-inquisitor friend crits. Yes, it's the opposite of what the rules actually say, but it was specifically noted in the APG FAQ
so, what I'm seeing from this is, Inquisitors get substantially better the more of them there are.
so, what I'm seeing from this is, Inquisitors get substantially better the more of them there are.
This works well with duelist's too, I posted a thread on a build where I used this a little while back.
it's not so much an inquisitor thing as a team work thing. preplanned builds with these feats are pretty good. the trick though is if your friends char dies and your an inquisitor you just change tactics. as a fighter you would beef tobtrain them all out.
so, what I'm seeing from this is, Inquisitors get substantially better the more of them there are.
I just want to point out that your avatar looks like he stretched a Spidey mask over his snout.
ThatIsAll.
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7th: something else to have fun with /shrug, improved trip for increased Cheese?You can't use scimitar for tripping, I think; only the weapons with 'Trip' quality can be used for that.I'm pretty sure having a trip weapon just gives you a bonus (plus getting focus,w eapon training etc added), you can still trip people normally.
else you end up with rediculousness (i'm holding a dagger, so i can't kick out your feet O.o)
looking a the rule, it doesn't say anything about weapons (unlike Sunder which requires a slashing or Bludgeoning weapon IIRC)
as for Gang Up needing 3 people, I did point that out in my example, i just said they didn't need to actually be chilling with us, they just need to threaten the same target.
also: you're saying the triggering event only provokes once, which i see (i mean, if it chained that since i get an AoO, they get an AoO, meaning I get an AoO to infinity is rediculous), I mean if they crit on the AoO, is that a new instance of Crit provoking?
Well, as BNW posted above, the official answer is that you need a weapon with the 'Trip' quality to trip someone; this is more explicitly pointed out on another thread (I can try to dig up the link if you still disagree).
You can trip with an unarmed attack, though.
(BTW, you're quoting me for what Bobson said; I never mentioned Gang Up in my short reply)
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7th: something else to have fun with /shrug, improved trip for increased Cheese?You can't use scimitar for tripping, I think; only the weapons with 'Trip' quality can be used for that.I'm pretty sure having a trip weapon just gives you a bonus (plus getting focus,w eapon training etc added), you can still trip people normally.
else you end up with rediculousness (i'm holding a dagger, so i can't kick out your feet O.o)
looking a the rule, it doesn't say anything about weapons (unlike Sunder which requires a slashing or Bludgeoning weapon IIRC)
as for Gang Up needing 3 people, I did point that out in my example, i just said they didn't need to actually be chilling with us, they just need to threaten the same target.
also: you're saying the triggering event only provokes once, which i see (i mean, if it chained that since i get an AoO, they get an AoO, meaning I get an AoO to infinity is rediculous), I mean if they crit on the AoO, is that a new instance of Crit provoking?
Well, as BNW posted above, the official answer is that you need a weapon with the 'Trip' quality to trip someone; this is more explicitly pointed out on another thread (I can try to dig up the link if you still disagree).
You can trip with an unarmed attack, though.
(BTW, you're quoting me for what Bobson said; I never mentioned Gang Up in my short reply)
you can trip someone while you are holding a greatsword in both hands, you are just not using the greatsword (and it's bonuses if any) for the trip.
If you have a weapon with the "trip" quality it allows this:
- You can use the weapon to trip, including any + to-hit that you have for that weapon from spells, enhancements, feats, class abilities, etc..
- If the trip fails by 10 or more, you can choose to drop the weapon, rather than being tripped yourself.
Without a "trip" quality weapon you:
- Trip as an unarmed attack. If you do not have Improved Trip, than you generate an Attack of Opportunity.
- Fail by 10 or more, you are tripped yourself.
Well, as BNW posted above, the official answer is that you need a weapon with the 'Trip' quality to trip someone; this is more explicitly pointed out on another thread (I can try to dig up the link if you still disagree).
You can trip with an unarmed attack, though.
(BTW, you're quoting me for what Bobson said; I never mentioned Gang Up in my short reply)
hrmm, I'll have to go looking for that, cause it doesn't make sense that I need to get three feats to be able to kick out your legs without provoking (IUS, Combat Expertise, and improved Trip), you should just need Improved trip, since y'know, it's supposed to make you not provoke while tripping.
the FAQ that BNW quoted supports me in this I do believe.as for the stuff in Parenthesis, I generally use things like 'as for' and "also:(stuff)" to denote I'm changing a topic, and may not be strictly talking to the person quoted, because I've noticed on Paizo boards that Quote trees can get pretty big pretty fast.
as for the Kobold Avatar: It was either a Kobold or Gnoll, and Let's face it, Kobolds are just a smidgeon cooler. Plus, Karjak Rustscale is totally not a Gnoll name.