|
First of all let me say that I didn't come up with the original idea to give ninja's access to blindsight. Someone else on the boards did but I apologize for not remembering your name and the search isn't leading me to the thread. It was only mentioned though and not fully discussed/interpreted into a trick. This would be a master ninja trick.
Sense the Unseen: Whenever a ninja uses the darkvision ninja trick, she also gains blindsight of 30 feet. She may only take advantage of blindsight when she closes her eyes. A ninja must have the darkvision ninja trick before selecting this master ninja trick. If the ninja's race naturally has darkvision, then she may take this trick as if she already possesses the darkvision ninja trick.
Of course this would replace the See the Unseen ability. You guys thoughts?
I don't like it as an all day ability. If it is available at higher levels in limited uses it would be ok.
|
I don't like it as an all day ability. If it is available at higher levels in limited uses it would be ok.
That's what kaisc006 proposed. The darkvision trick costs a ki point to activate (for too long a duration, but that's another argument). The ninja can take master tricks from 10th level.
My earlier suggestion was blindsense as a trick separate from darkvision, but blindsight as a master trick seems workable as well.
|
|
I don't like it as an all day ability. If it is available at higher levels in limited uses it would be ok.That's what kaisc006 proposed. The darkvision trick costs a ki point to activate (for too long a duration, but that's another argument). The ninja can take master tricks from 10th level.
My earlier suggestion was blindsense as a trick separate from darkvision, but blindsight as a master trick seems workable as well.
10th level for the option to gain blindstrike seems reasonable don't you think? It has slightly more use than See Invisibility (immune to gaze attacks, ect.) but less range. Also fits with ninja's having near supernatural grasps on their surroundings.
Starglim, I thought about it being a stand alone trick too but IMHO requiring the darkvision trick makes sense. At 10th level, among other routes, the current Ninja is capable of either completely negating an opponent's perception (Invisible Blade) or greatly enhancing his own (See the Unseen). Invisible Blade requires you to have vanishing trick first. See the Unseen however has no prerequisite.
+1
|
I like the ability, especially since it is so very tied to the mythos.
What I don't like is half-orcs and dwarves getting a free pass to the ability. It makes sense with that rage power(Nightvision) since it has so little benefit to the darkvision races otherwise, but since this is a master trick with a preceeding trick cost, I feel everyone should have to pay for such an ability. Perhaps have everyone take the preceeding trick then. I'm not sure if I'm ok with darkvision being a "lesser form" of blindsight that this trick is suggesting. Keep them as separate abilities, please.
Blindsight would negate Invisibility, Darkness, and most kinds of concealment are irrelevant, thought the creature must have line of effect to a creature or object to discern that creature or object.
The creature usually does not need to make perception checks to notice creatures within range of its blindsight ability.
........................
As listed in playtest
See the Unseen (Su): A ninja with this trick learns how to
see that which cannot be seen. As a swift action, the ninja
can cast see invisibility, using her level as the caster level.
The ninja can use this ability once per day for free. Each
additional use of this ability uses up 1 ki point.
Lets you see Invisible creatures, but such creatures are still able to use stealth to hide.
....
With blindsight, ninja could see all other ninja in line of sight.
....
just pointing stuff out, do not carry one way or the other..... end the end, rogue or ninja which every is better will live, and the other will vanish.
|
|
With blindsight, ninja could see all other ninja in line of sight.
just pointing stuff out, do not carry one way or the other..... end the end, rogue or ninja which every is better will live, and the other will vanish.
I looked up blindsense just to see if stealth could be used againsts it (lightly stepping to throw off vibrations) but doesn't look like a promising argument. Regardless though I don't think it would be too overpowered.
Line of sight only entails 30 ft. with the blindsense ability as listed. Also, this ability must be activated. It represents the ninja going within herself, truly grasping her surroundings. It is not a 24 hour ability. So someone attempting to stealth up to a ninja with the blindsense trick would first have to give away their presence before the blindsense ninja activates her trick.
we are also assuming that the other ninjas are hiding in plain sight.... and that it would be imposable to stop a ninja's blindsight what would the ninjas blindsight be based on hearing ? hmmmmm shout spell deafens ninja loses blindsight its not unbreakable just powerful and a ninja should get it but i think that it should be taken down to like 40 rounds a day even tho these rounds need not be consecutive so if they are fighting creatures with greater invisibility the ninja would have to use it more or hmmmmmmm glitter dust and fairy fire are cheap but were not saying no dont do that are we and they do the same thing or invisibility purge i say give the ninja blindsight it helps them keep up with the balance of power not like having 50/50 for ninja/wizard but gets them away from 20/80 and maybe all the things ninjas can do gives them about 35/65 which is a good balance because rogues are HORRIBLE for balance i mean really take level 10 fighter v level 10 rogue = one dead rogue even if they have the first attack and use poisons rogue is one of the weaker classes a bard could take a rogue and dont get me wrong me a rogue but they lack so much what do they get that no other class can get trapfinding and trap sense magic traps ya really hard only if they reset ever round other wise wizard pulls out want of summon monster I makes summon set off trap makes place with a big chalk X and goes "lets go" trap dealt with or if u have a monk and they happened to get the trait that lets them disable traps or a summoners eidolon can take disable traps also so ya rogues get a 9 out of 10 on the redundant chart unless you min max then they can do some nice damage till the big baddie looks at them they wet them selfs and run away as a ninja would just be like POOF smoke bomb or shadow clone and go ok i am ready
QUOTE="sasuke sarutobi"
We are also assuming that the other ninjas are hiding in plain sight. That it would be imposable to stop a ninja's blindsight. What would the ninjas blindsight be based on hearing ?
Shout spell deafens ninja. Loses blindsight its not unbreakable just powerful. A ninja should get it but i think that it should be taken down to like 40 rounds a day.
Even tho these rounds need not be consecutive, so if they are fighting creatures with greater invisibility, the ninja would have to use it more.
Glitter dust and fairy fire are cheapper, and doing same thing as invisibility purge
I say, give the ninja blindsight it helps them keep up with the balance of power.
It is not like having 50/50 for ninja/wizard, but gets them away from 20/80, and maybe all the things ninjas can do gives them about 35/65.
Which is a good balance because rogues.
I mean really take level 10 fighter v level 10 rogue = one dead rogue even if they have the first attack and use poisons.
Rogue is one of the weaker classes; a bard could take a rogue.
They lack so much, what do they get, that no other class can get trapfinding and trap sense magic traps.
Really hard, only if they reset ever round, other wise wizard pulls out a summon monster I.
Makes summon set off trap; makes place with a big chalk X and goes "lets go" trap dealt with.
If you have a monk, and they happened to get the trait that lets them disable traps.
A summoners eidolon can take disable traps also so ya rogues get a 9 out of 10 on the redundant chart.
Min, max, then they can do some nice damage till the big baddie looks at them. They then wet themselves and run away.
Where as a ninja would just be like POOF, smoke bomb or shadow clone, and go ok i am ready
/QUOTE
..................
Sorry, but i just had to break it up, so i could read it.
PS = You just flunked English 101. That was one long run on Sentence. No periods, no commas, and no paragraph breaks.
Sorry, but i just had to break it up, so i could read it.
PS = You just flunked English 101. That was one long run on Sentence.
No periods, no commas, and no paragraph breaks.
+1
I´m always flabbergasted when people can write so horrificly.When there is no obvous coherent structure, much less PLEASANT structure,
how do they expect to get their ideas across?
I mean, POETRY isn´t necessary, but minor allowances to readability go along way, folks...
|
|
we are also assuming that the other ninjas are hiding in plain sight.... and that it would be imposable to stop a ninja's blindsight what would the ninjas blindsight be based on hearing ? hmmmmm shout spell deafens ninja loses blindsight its not unbreakable just powerful
Vibrations through the floor and walls? Slight disturbances, odours or warm breath in the air? I remember another reference to a ninja blocking his ears because his rival was making random noises around the building to break his concentration.
I see at least a possible argument that deafness wouldn't break a ninja's blindsight/blindsense but might impose a penalty to it.
|
|
what would the ninjas blindsight be based on hearing ? hmmmmm shout spell deafens ninja loses blindsight its not unbreakable just powerful
Deafened would not make him lose his blindsight. Blindsight is "the extraordinary ability to use a nonvisual sense (OR a combination of senses) to operate effectively withouth vision. Such senses may include, vibrations, acute scent, keen hearing, or echolocation." A ninja could use all of these methods to locate a foe. If deafened, she would still suffer the defeaned condition but would have to use vibrations, acute scent, and echolocation, as starglim mentioned, to locate her foe.
+1First of all let me say that I didn't come up with the original idea to give ninja's access to blindsight. Someone else on the boards did but I apologize for not remembering your name and the search isn't leading me to the thread. It was only mentioned though and not fully discussed/interpreted into a trick. This would be a master ninja trick.
Sense the Unseen: Whenever a ninja uses the darkvision ninja trick, she also gains blindsight of 30 feet. She may only take advantage of blindsight when she closes her eyes. A ninja must have the darkvision ninja trick before selecting this master ninja trick. If the ninja's race naturally has darkvision, then she may take this trick as if she already possesses the darkvision ninja trick.
Of course this would replace the See the Unseen ability. You guys thoughts?
ahh yes because everything must be 100% the way you think it should be