as a rough way to do 0 level style p,ay it seems fine. though due to your opening statement I cannot tell if your trying to make 1st level harder.
My games are often deadly, especially when low levels so I'm thinking of...
having players choose an NPC class, no feats (two traits), roll HP add Con mod. Then calling the attack bonus, save bonuses, Character creation bonuses. They are essentially level 0 but with a little umph. Thinking it will provide some ideas for players' backgrounds and such, plus give them extra hp, save bonuses, maybe a couple spells (adept).
When player obtains first level (after a simple quest), they choose their class and are first level (first feat, etc...). If a character with +0 BAB has the warrior npc class they still do not qualify for feats requiring +1BAB because for this start-up the warrior's BAB is changed to a "Char creation attack bonus" (CAB). At first level, the player gets full HP + Con modifier for whichever class they choose (keeping their rolled NPC-prelevel HPs). Progressing onwards as normal from there. I'm thinking this may also help provide a small bonus to saves if the game is low magic (an extra +2 to a save).
ex.
Level: 0, XP: -50, Attack bonus+saves: called Character creation bonuses, Feats: 2 Traits, HP: Roll NPC class hp + Con modifier; whatever you'd have them do to get 50 XP needs to be super easy otherwise same problems as first level...Talk to constable Bob about the goblin infestation--reward 50 XP. Yipee - 1st level.
Level: 1, XP: 0, Attack bonuses+saves: per standard rules for chosen classes, Feats: as per normal character generation, HP: Max HP for class chosen + Con modifier. ---Basically like a normal game by the book---
thoughts?
thanks
1st level is dangerous enough with regular classes so I don't see the point. If you just allow them to fight easier monsters at level 0 then you are just going through extra trouble to produce the same difficulty that a level 1 character goes through anyway.
How is making someone weaker going to give them extra ideas? People that can come up with interesting ideas generally, and those that dont, well, don't.Edit:If you mean start off as a level 0 class then go to level 1(regular classes) I understand, but how are they going to get the training? You don't just wake up one day and know how to cast spells or be able to use multiple weapons, and armor. I do like the idea of going from level 0 to the basic classes as long as the immersion is not ruined.
You mentioned your games are often deadly, so you're doing this: starting them at level 0. Yeah, that would make it pretty deadly all right... unless you're sending them against anemic kobold shopkeepers it seems like it's even harder. Or did you mean you were giving them a bonus of 1 level of a commoner or expert NPC class or something in addition to their first level of a PC Character Class? That would be different, I suppose, although there are easier ways to give your players a bump to increase their chances of survival... adding another level of commoner to your 1st-level Fighter just seems unnecessarily complicated.
Instead try: a Hit Point Kicker (+8, +10, whatever) or double HD at 1st level. Bonus Feat or Trait at 1st level. More skill points to start out with. Better equipment or starting gold. Etc.... just a couple ideas.
I did this with my king maker game. I didn't start them as NPC class. I let them pick an NPC and make background based around the NPC class they chose. Turned out pretty good, made them more survivable at 1st and gave some interesting backgrounds as commoner was the base if you didn't do a background.
Thanks for all the comments....
They start off at 0 (NPC - i.e. bonus), they do the minor task (speak to somone)...leads to them being offered training in a class of their choice. The mayor of the town has a number of retainers to train those willing to go the 'extra mile' (i.e., begin a career as an adventurer). Months later they are ready to go... and all the while get a better feel for the surrounding area...(hour or so of roleplay, or tasks where skills are used, but little threat to survival)...
Ok. My DM was going to something like this one. I was thinking of doing it myself if he does not do it.
I give Con (the attribute not the modifier) as starting hit points + class dice + Con modifier. That tends to help on the survivability of low level characters some.
RD
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When I start a game at first level (usually I start games at 4th-6th) I ask Players to make level 0 PCs. They tell me what Class, Alignment, Feats, Skills and such they want to earn at 1st level and during the first session they do things that would make them a Fighter or Wizard or whatever.
Also, when they hit 1st level they give a few examples of things they did that makes them whatever Alignment -- and if it sounds about right they ge that Alignment.
I give Con (the attribute not the modifier) as starting hit points + class dice + Con modifier. That tends to help on the survivability of low level characters some.
RD
I agree with RuminDange on giving the characters Constitution score as a bonus at first level only.
I prefer to give the following as a standard:1st level Hit Points: Constitution score + class hit die + Constitution modifier. After first level, the standard rate applies (class hit die + Constitution modifier).
Wealth: Player's choice (approval required): Standard average allotment +20%, standard rolling +10%, or standard average allotment + special.
Trait: Standard two. Some traits must have approval before selection.
Feats: Pathfinder only, and even some must be brought before me for approval (those outside Core + APG).
I have an unfair reputation as a heavy handed/killer game master. I only wish to be amused...
I have all my players start as 0-level commoners, actually I do this with all humanoids without racial HD.
It follows the standard rules for a 1st lvl commoner, with a few minor changes. Essentially it is just an extra d6 HD, which I allow PCs to max and some extra skill points, it makes more sense to me and makes them a bit tougher.
- I give them a feat they can swap out at 1st lvl.
- This lvl does not stack with most calculations for HD or level except for determining bonus HP.
- It does not stack with levels to determine the maximum skill ranks a PC or NPC can have.
- Instead of proficiency with a simple weapon, and class skills I give them their two startig traits. Though they can keep the simple weapon and class skills of a commoner instead, if they want.
I should say I do not actually use the commoner class for except as a starting HD for humanoids with no racial HD.
Adding to my post above, since it applies to low level, I often change the standard orc or other humanoids encountered a bit too following my suggestion to make them less lethal.
Orc militia (commoner-0)
str 17
dex 10
con 12
int 7
wis 8
cha 7
studded leather, falchion
alertness feat
AC 13, hp 4, saves F +1 R +0 W -1
falchion +2 2d4+4/18-20
perception +5, sense motive +1, stealth -1
(+0 base, +3 str, -1 armor non-proficiency)
A veteran orc would have a warrior level added, while otherwise not changing much. Making them a bit tougher.
chain shirt, falchion
alertness feat
AC 14, hp 11, saves F +3 R +0 W -1
falchion +4 2d4+4/18-20
perception +5(1), sense motive +1, stealth -1(1)
I would probably assign a CR of 1/3, 1/2 respectively since orcs are a bit strong for their CR to beging with.