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Alright, let me preface this by saying this is NOT something I practice, nor would I ever. I apply my GM credit right as I'm filling out the chronicle sheets for everyone at my table. I also don't know anyone who does this, but I had a little thought game with myself to ask this question. I'm just honestly wondering what rules are in place to stop something like this from happening if it is illegal.
So, what's to stop a GM who holds onto chronicle sheets to apply to a future character from arranging them in an order that is most advantageous for the character? For example, let's say the GM has a level 5 fighter character, 1 XP away from level 6. Let's then say he GMs two games, and Scenario 01-30 (TDWK Part II: Cassomir's Locker) and Scenario 00-17 (Perils of the Pirate Pact) - and he GM'ed them in that particular order.
Is he allowed to apply #00-17 before #01-30 even though he GM'ed that one second? It would be advantageous to his fighter to apply #00-17 before #01-30.
Now, I know that most of the things on the chronicle sheet really don't matter because you should have a relative amount of PA equal to the cost of items for the tier you are taking credit (maybe less if you just suck at Faction missions when playing). But, I'm not sure I'm comfortable with the idea of picking and choosing which chronicles go in what order. I mean, maybe items might not matter so much, but they could definitely decide to apply Tier 1-5 scenarios before applying Tier 1-7 just so they can maximize the gold the character has. Thoughts?
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Much of the reporting system is based on GM trust. There is 'nothing' to prevent bad activity by GMs other than the knowledge they're cheating.
Of course if they are caught, they can be booted from PFS play by a coordinator or Venture Captain I think, but the reality of that is they can't play in local and regional events more than anything.
This system relies on the good nature of the select few who chose to GM and/or coordinate.
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Ha, I would consider that minor on the cheating scale. Still cheating though. You should be applying chronicles in the order that you receive them by date. However, if you gm a scenario that is tier 5-9 and the character you wish to apply it to is not yet level 5, you need to hold out until you are high enough level to apply it. This would then have them out of date order.
For example: As it stands, I only have one character above 4th level. If I play with my high level and then GM a scenario of tier 5-9 or higher, who do I give the chronicle to? Which ever character I choose will have to wait until they are high enough level. And in this case the chronicles would not be in order by date played/run.
On the other hand, (and I saw this used too often in Living Greyhawk because if you GMd a mod before playing it you ate it for no credit) what's to stop a person at home from having Fluffy, their labradoodle, from being the "GM" for the scenario? If you had already run it once and wanted the player credit, you need to find someone willing to run it for you. I believe in the current system this is unlikely, but it is possible. (An extreme case, I know.)
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Ha, I would consider that minor on the cheating scale. Still cheating though. You should be applying chronicles in the order that you receive them by date. However, if you gm a scenario that is tier 5-9 and the character you wish to apply it to is not yet level 5, you need to hold out until you are high enough level to apply it. This would then have them out of date order.
For example: As it stands, I only have one character above 4th level. If I play with my high level and then GM a scenario of tier 5-9 or higher, who do I give the chronicle to? Which ever character I choose will have to wait until they are high enough level. And in this case the chronicles would not be in order by date played/run.
That's exactly how I see it.
On the other hand, (and I saw this used too often in Living Greyhawk because if you GMd a mod before playing it you ate it for no credit) what's to stop a person at home from having Fluffy, their labradoodle, from being the "GM" for the scenario? If you had already run it once and wanted the player credit, you need to find someone willing to run it for you. I believe in the current system this is unlikely, but it is possible. (An extreme case, I know.)
That's just sad and depressing, really. The reason I love roleplaying is because I get to interact with people face to face and see all the creativity they bring with their characters. Take that away and I might as well play a MMORPG (no disrespect, I just can't personally get into them - I'm a fps player at heart).
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I hadn't actually thought about this issue, but is it really important? Keep in mind that GM's loose a few player benefits. (1) No boons, (2) no day job roll, (3) cannot take credit for a higher sub-tier when your PC is at a level that falls between sub-tiers. Yes, they do not risk death or use resources, but IMHO, the players are at an advantage in the realm of tangible rewards. However, that does not account for those of us that actually prefer to GM over playing. I use my GM rewards to maintain a character in each tier, so I can play whatever game is offered when I do get a bug to play. A GM who "games" the system for a few extra gold, is unlikely to break the average gold per level.
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How does this rate vs. a player downloading the scenario and printing out their own chronicles?
A a GM, I honestly don't care where/how you got your chronicles. What I care about is that your character is built w/in the rest of the rules (wealth, items, feats, mathematics) and that you show up to have fun WITH the other players at your table.
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I'm probably on the "less than perfect" list* as well. It seems like I judge so freakin' much (yeah, yeah, I'm no JudgeBot5000 like DougDoug, but I have a lot to me) that I have about 10 chronicles, dated and noted with when and where I judged the mod, in a folder.
Usually, I don't have an active character at that tier...but often don't know which character I want to apply a chron to.
Then again, the characters that I really really LIKE playing, I don't WANT to apply unplayed/judged chronicles to them. It seems like more of a penalty than a benefit in that instance. (IMO, extra XP on a character that you enjoy playing for the sake of playing is painful...I'd rather not 'waste' play opportunities.)**
Should I tear up the extra judge rewards?
Should I not judge a mod unless I have a character that I don't care about enough to apply a chron to right then and there?
Is my dream of retiring a character without ever playing him dead (with 33 or so unassigned chrons)?
Or is this really too small an issue to really worry about?
For what it is worth, all my characters have full audited and accounted chrons.
-Pain
*=with Todd Morgan, probably
**=failing to completely kill urge to comment on LFR and their quest 'rewards'
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Then again, the characters that I really really LIKE playing, I don't WANT to apply unplayed/judged chronicles to them. It seems like more of a penalty than a benefit in that instance. (IMO, extra XP on a character that you enjoy playing for the sake of playing is painful...I'd rather not 'waste' play opportunities.)**
I just created my 3rd character (a neg-channel Cleric of Asmodeus) for this very reason. My primary Cleric of Sarenrae is taking a little break after her very personal meeting with Sarenrae, and my 2nd character (Barbarian/Witch) just hit 4th level and I've only actually played her at the table twice. I'd like to play her through a few levels. So now it's time for a negative energy channeling, teleporting around the battlefield Cleric of Asmodeus to soak up some GM credit :)
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I too have left Chronicle sheets unassigned for the very same reason as Painlord! I don't want to advance my character w/out playing them. I would hope that anyone who dedicates themselves to being an ambassador (GM) of the system has a strong grasp on the 'Spirit of the Game'.
Even in the most obvious of circumstances, I will always refrain from using the word Cheat in PFS (either on this forum or at my tables).
-@z
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I always apply my GM sheets immediately. (I vaguely remember a Frost post saying you can't sit on GM chronicle sheets unless you don't have a legal character to apply them to, but you could just toss them instead.)
How I "maximize" my GM rewards:
I never apply them to an in between tier character as that would give me the gold from playing down.
90%+ of the time I have a character at the bottom of a subtier to maximize my rewards.
ex. If I run a 1-5 I will if possible put the sheet on a 1 or 4. However if I run a 5-9 I will put the sheet on a 5 or an 8.
Making sure to maximize these rewards has led me to having 5 characters and as I no longer have a level 1 has tempted me into making a 6th.
There are some levels that I play through since there's no "optimal" GM rewards. Not that I really do any better playing my lvl 2 in a 1-2 subtier then I get from GMing but for some reason applying GM credits "inefficiently" bothers me.
<-Evil Powergamer
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I'm probably on the "less than perfect" list* as well. It seems like I judge so freakin' much (yeah, yeah, I'm no JudgeBot5000 like DougDoug, but I have a lot to me) that I have about 10 chronicles, dated and noted with when and where I judged the mod, in a folder.
-Pain
*=with Todd Morgan, probably
This is a list I know I'm on :P
I judge fairly often as well, but I try to keep them in order. When in doubt, I just start a fresh character (I have one of every class).
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I am getting ready to run a tier 7-8 / 10-11 module. I think it will likely be the 7-8 level. My highest level character is Goldfrapp at 8th. He will only be played at Cons from now on. Not Game Days or Online Play. You just can't get naked at an online game and make it nearly as disturbing. My next is Blue the Vengeful Mite of Cassomir at 5th. Next is 3 first level characters. I don't want to give credit to either Goldfrapp or Blue because I enjoy playing those characters. So I'm unsure of what I should do with my GM credit for this module. Because it's such a high teir module, and I hold onto it for one of the first level characters, am I breaking the rules. I don't think so - there's something in the guide that discusses holding onto a chronicle sheet until your character is the appropriate level. However, I do suppose that if I were to go back, I'd find that I didn't give many of my characters GM credit, especially if I'd already played it.
We'll see as we approach the higher tiers and get more local players with mid+ tiered characters.
Theocrat Issak
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No you're not breaking any rules. I see nothing that says if you have a character of the appropriate level, you must apply the credit to that character. Only that you choose which character to apply the credit to. If that character is not of a level appropriate, the credit is held until such time as it can be applied legally. But if you already have high-tier characters and GM a lot of events, why apply the credit at all. Just chalk it up as a GM'd session. Maybe in the future, if you run that scenario again and have a character that could benefit from the credit, apply it at that time.
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RPG Superstar 2010 Top 16
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Theocreat, I asked that question here a week or two ago. If I understood the answer correctly, we can choose to (a) apply the GM credit to a character as soon as the character is eligible, or (b) skip that character with that particular GM credit. The credit remains unspent and available for future characters.
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Theocrat, for what it's worth, I currently have SEVEN tier 7-11 chronicles that I've never applied. I have two level 7.0 characters, but no plans to apply the chronicles unless there's some extreme need to fill out a subtier 10-11 table. (also have 3 tier 5-9's... So I guess in theory, one of my 7's could be level 10.1 instantly)
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You folks DO realize that in order to REPORT your GM-credit chronicle sheets, you have to assign them at the time you report the module?
Unless you close the entire reporting session, you can go back later and edit the session...
Some of us just add new tables to an existing batch, keepiong the same number. Simplifies some of the reporting.
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Some of us just add new tables to an existing batch, keepiong the same number. Simplifies some of the reporting.Maybe for you. That muddies our numbers on this end, though, as it appears more tables have been played than actually were.
I am not sure what you mean here?..
I think he is talking about adding more tables to the same event, not splitting a table into 2 tables.
For example, since I started in my PFS here I have been using the same event since July last year, just adding more days and inputing what we ran that day..
Are we supposed to make a new event for each game day? I hope not..
Director of Brand Strategy
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Are we supposed to make a new event for each game day? I hope not..
If it's actually a different event, yes. If it's a different night of the same event (like a weekly or monthly game day) then that's fine. But it would be nice if the number of sessions (tables) reported was the actual number of tables run.
In the given example, making a new session as a means of crediting a GM for something he ran months earlier makes it look to us like there were two tables of that event when there was really only one. It's always better to edit an existing table than just create a new one to get a single player or GM reported who wasn't added to the table originally.
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Are we supposed to make a new event for each game day? I hope not..If it's actually a different event, yes. If it's a different night of the same event (like a weekly or monthly game day) then that's fine. But it would be nice if the number of sessions (tables) reported was the actual number of tables run.
In the given example, making a new session as a means of crediting a GM for something he ran months earlier makes it look to us like there were two tables of that event when there was really only one. It's always better to edit an existing table than just create a new one to get a single player or GM reported who wasn't added to the table originally.
I think I was unclear. I run a PFS Game Day at a local game store on Fridays. I usually run it the Friday of the week before, and teh Friday of the week after, the local big Game Day on Saturday.
Instead of creating a new event for each session, I create new sessions with a table reported for that session.
What I was advocating above was, instead of creating a new table or a new session, was, as long as the original event was not closed as complete, that the coordinator should be able to go back into that event/table and add the GM's PC for credit.
I am unsure if you can edit a table at a session that was previously checked as completed.
My apologies for giving a wrong impression. And I still need to edit my event for next month's games...
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Owner - D20 Hobbies
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Is he allowed to apply #00-17 before #01-30 even though he GM'ed that one second? It would be advantageous to his fighter to apply #00-17 before #01-30. Thoughts?
There is no rule allowing you to apply credit out of order except the rule allowing you to hold a sheet until you are a valid player. So while you can retain the level 7-11 modules until you are 7th level, you can't apply the 1-5 after the 7-11.
It is highly implied you add the modules in order of GM, so if you are holding a bunch of modules you are not yet qualified to play you then apply them in the order of play when allowed.
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Venture-Captain, Missouri—Cape Girardeau
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Yes, you are capable of editing a previously reported session, even if you had previously recorded it as fully reported.
Unless it has been retired; I found this out the hard way when I failed to add the GM to The Asmodeus Affair. At least a Chronicle trumps reporting.