I've seen several threads devolve into arguments about the animal shaman archetypes of the APG. Well, here's a thread to discuss the animal shamans' merits and weaknesses.
First off, my opinion- druid's are a fairly powerful class, not the most powerful mind you, probably the weakest of the pure casters. That said, every archetype in the APG contains a nerf- all of them in some way penalize your wildshaping abilities- one of your most powerful traits. In theory however, each one gives you something to make up for it. This is hit and miss.
Here's how the Shaman's do it: They get a boost to wild empathy (this doesn't really effect power really) and a change to their nature bond at level one. (this is mixed, some give great domains, some give terrible animal companions- roughly the same as the core options)
At level two, he gets totem transformation, which is a bonus, you give up nothing for it (except maybe wildshape, but it's really added in an effort to make up for the weakened wildshape...so there)
Then at level 5 you get a boost to summoning, which, while cool, won't be too powerful, but it is a boost to summon up some tough animals as a standard action.
You don't get wildshape until level six, but it will be both buff and weakened, mostly weakened, unless you're playing a lion shaman and are focusing on melee.
After that you trade some abilities for feats, which isn't too bad really.
So here's the thing- it weakens wildshape, that's it's problem. And, in most cases, it doesn't make up for it (lion shaman is kind of a wash in terms of power, eagle shaman isn't all that weakened as a caster).
But here's my thing- I didn't want to play one of those tow, I had a wolf shaman in mind. I've gotten to level 2 at this point, and I'm doing fine. I've befriended an average wolf, who, along with my animal companion, trips every other round. My character doesn't seem to be too weak, I figure if I focus on summoning and tripping, I'll have a niche.
Opinions?
As you note, the only real disadvantage of the shaman druids is the hit to wild shape. So if your druid isn't much of a melee fighter anyways, you're really not sacrificing much.
On the down side, the wolf creatures on the Summon Nature's Ally list are pretty weak. For instance, the CR 3 dire wolf is stuck on the SNA IV list with a bunch of CR 4 creatures. Also, the wolf animal companion is one of the weaker animal companions (just one attack, stats are no great shakes).
But cheer up -- you're still a full spellcaster with an animal sidekick. That's nothing to sneeze at!
I love the Animal Shaman!
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Animal Shaman are actually stronger than standard druids:
- Very strong flavor! Having a strong connection to a theme animal is just cool. It's definitely a more focused role-playing shtick.
- Nature Bond - if you didn't want one of those animals/domains, you wouldn't be reading this chapter, so it's a trivial limitation.
- Wild Empathy - small bonus / no penalty.
- Totemic Summons - One type of summon is greatly enhanced, while the rest of your summoning ability is left alone / lose A Thousand Faces at level 13 (when Alter Self is a trivial spell effect to purchase)
- Bonus feats at 9, 13, 17 / Lose Venom Immunity at level 9 (9th level druids don't have to worry about poison. They have excellent Fort saves and all of the anti-poison spells!)
Totem Transformation/Wild Shape:
- Totem Transformation - Better than Wild Shape at levels 2-3 because you HAVE it at levels 2-3.
- At level 4, I think TT is still better, because you can cast spells while transformed, while you can't get Natural Spell until 5th level.
- At level 5, an animal shaman is weaker than a standard shaman at transforming.
- At level 6+, you get a nice boost to your chosen form, and still have access to all of the crazy options, just at a slightly lower level.
You are tying yourself to an animal, so this choice will be critically important:
- Serpent sucks.
- Eagle is rather specialized, but an excellent choice if you were going use Fly & Cast as your primary strategy.
- Lion is a very strong melee/DPR choice.
- Bear is gimped by the animal companion starting at Small and not getting Grab/Grapple like most bears. (Very disappointing!)
- Wolf is decent, a little bit behind lion for damage, but Trip is a good trick. at 50' movement it's a great mount for small druids.
I don't think a Wolf Shaman is a weak character at all!
Serpent sucks.
Funny, I think that the serpent shaman is better than the wolf shaman.
- The constrictor snake animal companion rocks.
- I'd consider summoning a giant constrictor snake with Summon Nature's Ally IV.
- I like some of the totem transformations (+2 natural armor and swim/climb speed are both useful-ish).
The bonus feat list is pretty lame, though.
Funny, I think that the serpent shaman is better than the wolf shaman.
The constrictor snake animal companion rocks.
The constrictor snake Animal Companion has a speed of 20, and one attack for 1d3 (constrict for 1d3 per turn). After it advances at 4th level, that becomes 1d4 (constrict 1d4/turn). Even after Animal Companion strength increases, that will never be enough damage to kill anything worthwhile. It might, if it can manage to catch someone with 20' move, manage to grapple a caster effectively.I'd consider summoning a giant constrictor snake with Summon Nature's Ally IV.
There are no summonable snakes over 3rd level. With the templates you could make an Advanced+Giant Constrictor at 5th level, which is CR 4 while everything else on the SNA 5 list is CR 5-6. After 5th, you just don't have anything left on your summon list. I think SNA4 is probably the only level that a summoned snake would even make the "maybe" list.
I like some of the totem transformations
Swim and climb speeds could be useful at level 2-5, but after that you can turn into whatever animal you'd like. The other totems give you +10 move, +20 move, or flight, none of which ever get old.
Scales for +2 natural armor is nice.
I think what really kills Serpent Shaman for me is that snakes are just too darn slow! It will be hard for them to get into melee with most enemies and makes them poor flankers, which I consider to be one of the best uses for an animal companion. So, whether I have one as a companion, summon one with a spell, or turn into one, I have extra-slow movement to overcome. While most animals, and notably all four of the other Animal Shaman choices, have 40+ movement.
I think snakes would be cool of they'd increase all of the sizes by one category. Then, the grappling might be good enough to be worth sacrificing movement and other abilities. They'd also have to add one or two larger snakes to the summon list. I'd also start bears off at medium rather than small.
I'd happily house-rule the following for any game I run:
Dinosaur Shaman
Elemental Shaman (Pick one element)
Horse Shaman
Funny, I think that the serpent shaman is better than the wolf shaman.The constrictor snake animal companion rocks.
The constrictor snake Animal Companion has a speed of 20, and one attack for 1d3 (constrict for 1d3 per turn). After it advances at 4th level, that becomes 1d4 (constrict 1d4/turn). Even after Animal Companion strength increases, that will never be enough damage to kill anything worthwhile. It might, if it can manage to catch someone with 20' move, manage to grapple a caster effectively.
The snake does 1d3+3 damage (avg=5), and the wolf does 1d6+1 damage (avg=4.5), but the snake has a better chance to hit. At level 4, that likely increases to 1d4+10, possibly doubled if it can constrict. The wolf's trip attack is pretty good though, and it works against larger creatures than the snake's grab. Also, I agree the snake is a bit slow. But a climb speed is nice.
I'd consider summoning a giant constrictor snake with Summon Nature's Ally IV.
There are no summonable snakes over 3rd level.
There might be some in the Bestiary 2 (e.g. there's an amphisbaena and a giant anaconda in Bestiary 2). At any rate, there are no summonable canines over 4th level (the fairly lame Dire Wolf), so what's your point?
I like some of the totem transformations
Swim and climb speeds could be useful at level 2-5, but after that you can turn into whatever animal you'd like. The other totems give you +10 move, +20 move, or flight, none of which ever get old.
All of those get just as old; note that you can't use Totem Transformation and Wild Shape at the same time, so you can either wild shape into a wolf or use your +20 move, but not both at once.
I think what really kills Serpent Shaman for me is that snakes are just too darn slow! It will be hard for them to get into melee with most enemies and makes them poor flankers, which I consider to be one of the best uses for an animal companion.
I guess. In my experience, fast movement isn't that exciting, but YMMV, of course.
There might be some in the Bestiary 2 (e.g. there's an amphisbaena and a giant anaconda in Bestiary 2). At any rate, there are no summonable canines over 4th level (the fairly lame Dire Wolf), so what's your point?Actually, James Jacobs said in no unsure terms that the summoning lists will never be updated. This makes me sad, but what are you going to do.
@hogarth
Good points all around. For some reason, I thought there was a high-level summonable wolf up there with Dire Bear and Dire Tiger at 6th level.
I really like Lion, and I think Eagle is a good choice for a non-melee druid. Bear's not bad. Serpent and Wolf don't seem to hold up well.
Actually, James Jacobs said in no unsure terms that the summoning lists will never be updated. This makes me sad, but what are you going to do.
That makes me sad too. I don't think the lists need to double, or even undergo an overhaul, but it would be really nice to round out some of the tables.
Just my take on the serpent shaman, I am currently playing one, if you allow the player to just increase the size of the large snake to huge it becomes the bane of melee fighters. I know it is a house-rule but I feel like not being able to up-size (especially a snake) was just an oversight anyway. My grapple beats just about any CMD and pinned creatures can't fight back, and still take decent bite and constrict damage. (yay for power attack and INA)