| 1 person marked this as FAQ candidate. |
So which bonuses stack and which do not?
Like if I have a Tiefling with the Scaled Skin Trait (+1 natural AC) and then later take Armor of the Pit (+2 to natural AC), do all those bonuses stack to Natural AC?
And what if he gets a magical bonus to natural ac? would that stack with his non magical bonus to natural ac or no? Otherwise then an Amulet of Natural AC +1 would be useless to a Tiefling with Armor of the Pit wouldn't it?
|
| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
Scaled Skin and Armor of the Pit unfortunately do not stack to give you a higher armor bonus, Armor of the Pit just gives you resistance to the two resistances you gave up for Scaled Skin.
Either of those abilities would however stack with an Amulet of Natural Armor, since it provides an Enhancement bonus to your existing natural armor.
Kinda lame. I'd rather have the +2 to Natural AC. So don't take Scaled Skin trait and then take armor of the pit...
I see now what it does though. So if you have Scaled Skin you have a +1 to Natural AC AND 5 vs one type of energy. If you also take Armor of the pit later on then you will gain 5 vs two other energy types and still keep your +1 Natural AC but your natural AC doesn't go up to +2 or "stack". Still decent but I lean towards the +2 to natural ac instead...
Well, this is slightly annoying.
So, to clarify - a Kobold (who has a natural armour bonus of +1 at first level, assuming no feats) who takes the Draonic Bloodline up to 3rd level (thereby gaining a bloodline natural armour bonus of +1) would still only have +1 natural armour, because both are bonuses?
Well, this is slightly annoying.
So, to clarify - a Kobold (who has a natural armour bonus of +1 at first level, assuming no feats) who takes the Draonic Bloodline up to 3rd level (thereby gaining a bloodline natural armour bonus of +1) would still only have +1 natural armour, because both are bonuses?
I'm pretty certain that these bonuses do stack. Natural armor is kinda weird that way, but racial/class abilities that grant natural armor tend to stack. Only things that grant an "enhancement bonus" to armor do not.
Peet
Well...that's going to cause some headaches.
There is a monster feat that increases natural armor by one every time you take it...
Well, this is slightly annoying.
So, to clarify - a Kobold (who has a natural armour bonus of +1 at first level, assuming no feats) who takes the Draonic Bloodline up to 3rd level (thereby gaining a bloodline natural armour bonus of +1) would still only have +1 natural armour, because both are bonuses?
You could skip the NA +1 for levels 1 and 2, and instead get resistance 5 to an element of your choice with alternate traits.
There is a monster feat that increases natural armor by one every time you take it...
I did not even know that Improved Natural Armor could be taken multiple times.
Now I kinda want to roll up a guy just for lulz who's like a Monk (MoMS)/Fighter who pumps Wis and Dex to the exclusion of all else (besides the 13 Con) and only takes Improved Natural Armor except for the Crane Style feats.
Maybe a Kobold unless someone knows another good race with Nat Armor. Wait, actually, Scarred Hobgoblin, get that Natural Armor without taking the hit to Str so he doesn't suck as much, and more points leftover to bump Wis/Dex. Unarmed Fighter for the other free Crane Feat.
Lessee if that's possible with a 20 PB.
Dump: Int, Cha, Str to 7, Con 11 = 11 points
Dex + Wis requires 34 points for 18 in both, 31 available.
Dex = 18 = 17 points
Wis = 17 = 13 points
1 point left, nowhere to put it.
End up with 20th level:
Str: 7
Dex: 24
Con: 13
Int: 7
Wis: 18
Cha: 7
Bump Wis at 4, Dex at 8, 12, 16, 20
So that's what, +18 AC from Improved Nat Armor, +1 normally, +4 Wis, +7 Dex, +5 fighting defensively for a total of 35 with no magic items? Plus the ability to deflect a hit once per round.
Completely useless at everything else, but man would he be hard to hit.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
My understanding of natural armor:
A natural armor bonus does not stack. A Kobold with Draconic Bloodline has +1 Natural armor from his/her race and (at level 3) +1 Natural armor from the bloodline. They don't stack, so it is only +1. Continuing along the bloodline, when the sorcerer bonus goes up beyond 1, that begins to take over.
However, there are also improvements to natural armor.
Benefit: The creature's natural armor bonus increases by +1.
Natural Armor Increase (Ex): As his skin thickens, a dragon disciple takes on more and more of his progenitor's physical aspect. At 1st, 4th, and 7th level, a dragon disciple gains an increase to the character's existing natural armor (if any), as indicated on Table: Dragon Disciple. These armor bonuses stack.
In this case, a Kobold Sorcerer who took Improved Natural armor would have a +1 improvement to it's natural armor. I would assume that you can choose which to apply it to (in other words, the higher one), but I could be wrong on that.
Either way, a Sorcerer/Dragon Disciple, for example, gets their natural armor bonus of X, with an increase to it of Y from Dragon Disciple.
Last but not least, is an enhancement bonus to natural armor, such as Barkskin and Amulets of Natural Armor.
The effect grants a +2 enhancement bonus to the creature's existing natural armor bonus. This enhancement bonus increases by 1 for every three caster levels above 3rd, to a maximum of +5 at 12th level.
...giving him an enhancement bonus to his natural armor from +1 to +5, depending on the kind of amulet.
These are applied similar to the increase, but do not stack with themselves. So if you have a Sorcerer with an amulet of natural armor of X, he may also have an enhancement bonus of +Y, which will go on top of it. If he also gets barkskin placed on him, he will use the higher of either of those enhancements to his Natural Armor.
Summary:
Natural Armor Bonuses: Don't stack.
Increases/Improvements to Natural Armor: Stack
Enhancements to Natural Armor: Don't Stack
Total Natural Armor Bonus = Highest Natural Armor Bonus + All Improvements to Natural Armor + Highest Enhancement to Natural Armor
Example: Kobold Sorcerer 9/ Dragon Disciple 7 with Improved Natural Armor Feat, Amulet of Natural Armor +3, and Barkskin at caster level 12.
2 Natural Armor Bonus (1 From Kobold OR 2 from Sorcerer 9) + 4 Improvement (3 from dragon disciple 7 AND 1 from Improved Natural Armor feat) + 5 (3 from Amulet of Natural Armor OR 5 from Barkskin)
You could also boil it down to: 6 Natural Armor Bonus(2+4, as above) + 5 (Enhancement, as above)
Total makes for +11 Natural Armor Bonus to AC.
Disclaimer: I am not entirely positive on all of this, but it is my best understanding of it. If anyone knows better, please let me know.
What about polymorph spells like Monstrous Physique? Is it a size bonus to natural armor? Or would it just overlap any existing natural armor?
I'm personally inclined to say it is a regular natural armor bonus(i.e. one that would overlap with existing NA).
Comparing Monstrous Physique with the Large evolution for a summoner's eidolon.
...and a +2 natural armor bonus.
...and a +2 bonus to its natural armor.
Though the evolution apparently doesn't use a size bonus for its stats either. Regardless, not entirely sure. Related discussion here. (And the circle of linking is complete...)
I'd like to make a Tiefling or Hobgoblin fighter who just takes Improved Natural Armor and doesn't wear any actual armor because he "doesn't need it".
Make him a Cad and have him use improvised weapons to.
It's kind of funny. Basically, if it's a typed bonus to Natural Armor (like Enhancement, or Racial) it stacks. If the wording of the ability says it increases your natural armor, it stacks. If it says gives you natural armor, then it doesn't stack and you take the highest.
For example :
If an ability says you gain +2 natural armor, and it's not typed, that's the type that doesn't stack with anything else. So, the kind you get from your race (racial) is your base natural armor. If you had +1 Racial granted Natural Armor Bonus, and you got something that said it gives you a +2 natural armor, the untyped +2 overrides your racial bonus, being higher.
If you later got an ability that said it 'increases your natural armor bonus by +1', like DD does, then you'd have a +3 Natural Armor (+2 from the first ability, and +1 increase from DD).
Finally, if you put an Amulet of Natural Armor on, that's an enhancement bonus to Natural Armor, and it adds to your +3. So if it was a +2 amulet, your Natural Armor would be +5 total.
Dodge bonuses stack. Natural armor bonuses do not, unless they're in very specific ways (enhancements or other increases specifically to the natural armor). Much like multiple armor bonuses don't stack, but enhancements to a suit of armor do increase it.
To the best of my knowledge, Dodge is the only thing (AC related that is) that stacks though.
|
|
This might be helpful. Here is a list of Bonus Types and it specifies if they stack. WHY IS THIS NOT IN THE CRB?!