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I think the subject line pretty much spells it out. Can you take 20 with the Sift spell?
My opinion is that since it's a cantrip and thus can be cast ad nauseum, there's nothing stopping you from doing so. The only difference between that and just using Perception to take-20 would be that it's a standard action to cast the spell, whereas using the skill is a move action. Thus it essentially doubles the time (from 1 minute to 2, since you can take two move actions per round and 10 rounds = 1 minute) required to check.
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Why would you ever cast sift when from 30' away you normally increase the DC by +3, but with sift you apply -5 to the die roll. You are better off just taking the distance bonus penalty rather than the cantrip's penalty.
Which begs the question: What use is Sift?
I think the intent is something different than that. It reads like you're able to do searches that you wouldn't normally be able to do from a distance. It's not at all clear to me where that distinction lies, though, so it would be great if someone from Paizo could clarify it.
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Yes, I don't get this either.
I thought the idea of an inquisitor using spells to magically investigate a room would be nice for low level characters, but it turns out you are better off using a guidance spell to enhance your peception check, than to cast this spell.
You have to be able to see the area you investigate with sift, so you could just do a regular perception check for anything involving sight.
I just don't get why would they get a -5.
Having a perception spell that allows you to ignore the perception range penalty (-3 at 30ft) seemed fine.
The only different I see, is that you could perceive things that could only be felt by the sense of touch, remotely. So, the inquisitor would know that the blood on the floor on the other side of the room, is sticky, or still warm.
Oh.. and this covers a cube of 10ft x 10ft x 10ft, so it is like basically remotely touching everything within that zone in a standard action (at -5 perception penalty)
This is another hold over from 3.5. In 3.5 it took a full round action to search a 5 foot cube so this spell would actually be useful as it would speed up the searching of an area but i can't find rules in pathfinder for how long it takes to search an area.
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Why would you ever cast sift when from 30' away you normally increase the DC by +3, but with sift you apply -5 to the die roll. You are better off just taking the distance bonus penalty rather than the cantrip's penalty.Which begs the question: What use is Sift?
I think the intent is something different than that. It reads like you're able to do searches that you wouldn't normally be able to do from a distance. It's not at all clear to me where that distinction lies, though, so it would be great if someone from Paizo could clarify it.
You generally can't touch things 30ft away using perception.
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So, as there is no rule (as far as I know) to search a 5'x5' area as a full round action anymore, and the distance aspect of 30ft of the spell makes a sight-based perception move-action to be more effective than the spell, the only logical use (beside ways to increase the range of the spell like Sesharan idea of imbued arrows)is use this spell to remotely touch a 10'x10' area at a range of 30ft.
This brings the question, do you have any good suggestion on how this spell can be used in a typical dungeon crawl?
I can think of feelings of cold and heat (like warm blood on the floor) on something you would rather not really touch or on the other side of a chasm.
Lets say you have to jump on the other side of a pit trap.. you could check if the area you would land into is slippery...
You could check how sticky is a spider web.
Any other good uses you can think of?
Any other good uses you can think of?
Triggering Explosive Runes (assuming "close enough to read" isn't literal but included within the 10' radius explosion).
I always figured you could use it to actually look at things in the area that might be covered, like going through a pile of old rags to see if any objects are hidden in it, even though you wouldn't be able to see them by just looking at the pile of rags from 30 feet away.
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RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32
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In PRD Perception: "...Intentionally searching for stimulus is a move action."
I've always use "intentionally searching" squares by squares, so a move action for 5'x5' square.
Given that there's nothing in the Perception skill to suggest this, what lead you to want to run it that way? Does it solve some problem you were having? Produce some benefit I'm not aware of? Just curious. :)
Sift + Imbue Arrow + Abundant Ammunition = take 20 to search any cube within the range of your longbow.
What is Imbue Arrow?
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Re: What good is this spell?
As Dominigo says, it has some common sense applications that maybe aren't covered by the normal rules. It's like a bunch of unseen servants with little eyes. They can pick stuff up, open drawers, etc.
My players have been using it pretty successfully to search dangerous areas without entering them. In particular, they've used it to search up or down cliffsides, or potentially rotten shipwrecks. Situationally useful, but not terribly powerful. Happens that my bard player chose it for the exact right game. Would I take it under normal circumstances? No, but since he happens to have it, they use it all the time.
Sift + Imbue Arrow + Abundant Ammunition = take 20 to search any cube within the range of your longbow.What is Imbue Arrow?
Class feature from Arcane Archer. Allows you to center a spell wherever your arrow lands, even for area spells that are centered on yourself. Great way to turn a Close spell into the equivalent of a CL1 Medium spell (and that's just in one range increment).