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But what if he doesn't flip out. What if he just dangles a string above you while you sleep and drips poison down it and into your mouth?*sigh*
do they flip out and kill people? Okay then.
I presented actual data. i.e. the link above.
This is just anecdotal.ergo, I win the internet.
It's simple logic.
You're really an elf?! I knew it! ;-)Curses! You have guessed my shameful secret!Have you swung an elven curveblade to compare it to a katana? Enquiring minds want to know!As for the Katana , my stance has always been it uses the bastard sword stats. However the Aldori Dueling sword also might work. I do not think the elven curve blade as it is two handed only.Having swung both bastard sword and katana, there's no comparison between the two. I would say use the elven curveblade stats but allow it one-handed or two, but only as a finesse weapon in two hands.
Yes! Oh goddess that is such a relief to say it! I'm tired of hiding my pointed ears! I am coming out of the bushes! I'm an elf, and I'm proud of it!
But what if he doesn't flip out. What if he just dangles a string above you while you sleep and drips poison down it and into your mouth?*sigh*
do they flip out and kill people? Okay then.I presented actual data. i.e. the link above.
This is just anecdotal.
ergo, I win the internet.
It's simple logic.
Deuce.
Ishikawa Goemon (1558–1594) - Goemon reputedly tried to drip poison from a thread into Oda Nobunaga's mouth through a hiding spot in the ceiling,
also see linked citation to Ninja: The Invisible Assassins, by Andrew Adams.
Real ninjas ride velociraptors. Velociraptors with jetpacks. While dual-wielding guns that shoot penguins with machine guns.
But what if he doesn't flip out. What if he just dangles a string above you while you sleep and drips poison down it and into your mouth?*sigh*
do they flip out and kill people? Okay then.I presented actual data. i.e. the link above.
This is just anecdotal.
ergo, I win the internet.
It's simple logic.Deuce.
Ishikawa Goemon (1558–1594) - Goemon reputedly tried to drip poison from a thread into Oda Nobunaga's mouth through a hiding spot in the ceiling,also see linked citation to Ninja: The Invisible Assassins, by Andrew Adams.
Don't try to use Wikipedia on a college paper, dude.
I think the elven curve-blade is basically a katana, it sums it up pretty well so far as I am concerned.
Edit: Genuine ninja are essentially monks or monk/rogues IMHO ...
I always think of the swords from Lors of the Rings myself
Genuine ninjas are commoners! Nobody ever expects to be killed by a commoner. That's why it works.
Beware the ginger ninja the most deadly of them all!
RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8
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I always think of the swords from Lors of the Rings myselfI think the elven curve-blade is basically a katana, it sums it up pretty well so far as I am concerned.
Edit: Genuine ninja are essentially monks or monk/rogues IMHO ...
For the katana, or the elven curved blade.
The only problem I have with elven curved blade=katana is that you can't use it one handed.
I still believe katana = two handed martial, one handed exotic, 1d8/18-20 X2.
YRMV of course.
Oh, and you can make a perfectly good ninja with a pure rogue. You want a 'mystic ninja'? They're called Arcane Tricksters.
Ok, I now return the thread to its regularly scheduled frivolity.
I always think of the swords from Lors of the Rings myselfI think the elven curve-blade is basically a katana, it sums it up pretty well so far as I am concerned.
Edit: Genuine ninja are essentially monks or monk/rogues IMHO ...
For the katana, or the elven curved blade.
The only problem I have with elven curved blade=katana is that you can't use it one handed.
I still believe katana = two handed martial, one handed exotic, 1d8/18-20 X2.
YRMV of course.
Oh, and you can make a perfectly good ninja with a pure rogue. You want a 'mystic ninja'? They're called Arcane Tricksters.
Ok, I now return the thread to its regularly scheduled frivolity.
Nah, I've studied ninjitsu, ninja are monks or monk/rogues. But I'm with you on the katana.
I suppose if you want to completely ignore history, then, yes, katanas are bastard swords. But, if you want a historically accurate rpg (and, let's face it, historical accuracy has long been one of D&D's main selling points), then a katana needs its own stats. It should do 3d12 damage, have a critical hit range of 12-20/x6, and be immune to sunder attacks because it is made of microscopic layers of steel and vibranium.Actually, Katanas were made they way they were because of the abysmal quality of Japanese steel. Without the layering, the Katana would otherwise shatter at the first strong exchange of blows. I'd say that a masterwork sword made of Damascus steel would stand straight up to an average katana. There are just not that many of them which have a family history of being handed down father to son, which accounts for the legendary mystique attached to katanas.
Common Japanese stell was awful, yes, but the way the katana was made (with the layering and from the choicest pieces of starting metal) made them a very high quality composite steel. Damascus steel was extremely good, but I would not want to put money on either in a contest.
** spoiler omitted **
I can prove everything I've just said. First, do you know how many zombies I've killed in Left 4 Dead 2 with the ninja sword? Plus, here is the video evidence.
Moron.
Ah Kill bill..Or Why we don't give Solar Exalted Access to yellow track suits.
*nods*
Actually, Katanas were made they way they were because of the abysmal quality of Japanese steel. Without the layering, the Katana would otherwise shatter at the first strong exchange of blows. I'd say that a masterwork sword made of Damascus steel would stand straight up to an average katana. There are just not that many of them which have a family history of being handed down father to son, which accounts for the legendary mystique attached to katanas.
Wrong again. I've personally witnessed a Katana cut through 6 inches of tank armor to kill the driver.
Actually, Katanas were made they way they were because of the abysmal quality of Japanese steel. Without the layering, the Katana would otherwise shatter at the first strong exchange of blows. I'd say that a masterwork sword made of Damascus steel would stand straight up to an average katana. There are just not that many of them which have a family history of being handed down father to son, which accounts for the legendary mystique attached to katanas.Wrong again. I've personally witnessed a Katana cut through 6 inches of tank armor to kill the driver.
while I wouldn't go that far, I HAVE seen a blue orchid katana punch through a car door to the hilt. I know it missed the reinforcing points on the door, but it was still pretty impressive.
Not if the car was a Trabant or a Lada.
I'm not sure but... are some people taking this thread seriously? D:
Most people don't realize, Ninja are actually marsupials. Closely related to the platypus. It is a very well kept secret.Incorrect, the most powerful ones are amphibians
1. Ninjas are mammals.
The Platypus is a GOD to the Ninja - what other warm blooded animal has sonar, lays eggs, dosent have nipples yet secrets milk, a poison spur, and can use an electric charge in its bill to stun prey.... its cousin the Echidna and it has massive spines all over its body... Ninja are dust compared to the POWER of the MONOTREMES.
The Sword of Heroes! Said to be so sharp you can cut yourself just by looking at—Oww!
My apologies if that one has already been linked in this thread... :)
Actually, Katanas were made they way they were because of the abysmal quality of Japanese steel. Without the layering, the Katana would otherwise shatter at the first strong exchange of blows. I'd say that a masterwork sword made of Damascus steel would stand straight up to an average katana. There are just not that many of them which have a family history of being handed down father to son, which accounts for the legendary mystique attached to katanas.Wrong again. I've personally witnessed a Katana cut through 6 inches of tank armor to kill the driver.while I wouldn't go that far, I HAVE seen a blue orchid katana punch through a car door to the hilt. I know it missed the reinforcing points on the door, but it was still pretty impressive.
I am guessing this was a modern Katana? A well made Modern arming sword could most likely do the same to be honest. Hell all In the car but I could put a sharped steel rod though the doors of most cars if I miss the reinforcement beams which I say he did.
Keep in mind Modern steel is much better then what was used for historical weapons. And Lazarx is right, Japanese steel was horrible which was why the folding was even invited.
Guys the Katana is a nice weapon but lets be honest it was no better a weapon then any other well made blade at the height of the bladesmithing arts. Don't get me wrong they are good weapons, but they are not the be all end all of bladed weapons and vs a foe with say plate, I would not recommend.
Was that before or after the Barbarian unleashed Lighting bolts from his codpiece?
Before, obviously. It was such an impressive stroke that it electrified the Barbarian.
Was that before or after the Barbarian unleashed Lighting bolts from his codpiece?Oh, you were at that party too?
If it also involved a naked midget riding a goat while singing loudly and off key, then yes.
The Katana is the only thing to permanently turn off the Tarrasque's regeneration. That's pretty good... I guess...
Nah, I've studied ninjitsu, ninja are monks or monk/rogues. But I'm with you on the katana.I always think of the swords from Lors of the Rings myselfI think the elven curve-blade is basically a katana, it sums it up pretty well so far as I am concerned.
Edit: Genuine ninja are essentially monks or monk/rogues IMHO ...
For the katana, or the elven curved blade.
The only problem I have with elven curved blade=katana is that you can't use it one handed.
I still believe katana = two handed martial, one handed exotic, 1d8/18-20 X2.
YRMV of course.
Oh, and you can make a perfectly good ninja with a pure rogue. You want a 'mystic ninja'? They're called Arcane Tricksters.
Ok, I now return the thread to its regularly scheduled frivolity.
+1. I see the conversation going like this:
Monk: "hey ninja, I can dimension door, I run 90 miles and hour, throw 8 shuriken in a full attack, and seal my own wounds with my mind? What tricks can you perform?"
Ninja: "umm i have some rogue talents ..."
Edit-
Monk: "oh yeah, I can jump 13 feet straight up from a standing jump and am immune to all poisons and diseases."
Ninja: "christ ..."
Monk: "and when I hit you with my quivering palm, you die... but not immediately. I will you to die later, like after you make a sandwich..."
Ninja: "let me see that list of prestige classes again ..."
Actually, Katanas were made they way they were because of the abysmal quality of Japanese steel. Without the layering, the Katana would otherwise shatter at the first strong exchange of blows. I'd say that a masterwork sword made of Damascus steel would stand straight up to an average katana. There are just not that many of them which have a family history of being handed down father to son, which accounts for the legendary mystique attached to katanas.Wrong again. I've personally witnessed a Katana cut through 6 inches of tank armor to kill the driver.while I wouldn't go that far, I HAVE seen a blue orchid katana punch through a car door to the hilt. I know it missed the reinforcing points on the door, but it was still pretty impressive.
I am guessing this was a modern Katana? A well made Modern arming sword could most likely do the same to be honest. Hell all In the car but I could put a sharped steel rod though the doors of most cars if I miss the reinforcement beams which I say he did.
Keep in mind Modern steel is much better then what was used for historical weapons. And Lazarx is right, Japanese steel was horrible which was why the folding was even invited.
Guys the Katana is a nice weapon but lets be honest it was no better a weapon then any other well made blade at the height of the bladesmithing arts. Don't get me wrong they are good weapons, but they are not the be all end all of bladed weapons and vs a foe with say plate, I would not recommend.
no doubt. Lets see, it takes 3 months to craft, and takes special steel that is chosen by skilled specialist, treated like holy relic, painted with kanji prayers before being made razor sharp. Smells like the master craftsman feat to me.
It took so long to craft as the steel sucked and had to be folded. Really the end product for most were no better then anyone else steel.
So no not all where masterwork, no more then all European swords wee masterwork. Some sure but not all.
It took so long to craft as the steel sucked and had to be folded. Really the end product for most were no better then anyone else steel.
So no not all where masterwork, no more then all European swords wee masterwork. Some sure but not all.
Well tempered steel is what it is, a very effective way to hold a razor's edge. I think the most effective sword they've seen on Deadliest Warrior was actually a turkish scimitar, cut clean through a pig carcass in one swing. Curved blades is great for slashin'.
There are reports of katanas tested on condemned prisoners that cut through 3 bodies stack on top of each other. "3 body blades" were few, but they did exist.
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Yes a few issues with all that.
1: You used Deadliest Warrior as evidence.
2: Any sword if thrust can cut though a few folks if it is long enough and you do not hit bone.
I am not saying they suck or are sub par weapons. But they were just weapons, the folding made up for the sucky steel. Pound for pound most European and middle eastern sword were just as good at what they were made for.
So sure some where super crafted by by no means were all of them so well made.
Yes a few issues with all that.
1: You used Deadliest Warrior as evidence.
2: Any sword if thrust can cut though a few folks if it is long enough and you do not hit bone.I am not saying they suck or are sub par weapons. But they were just weapons, the folding made up for the sucky steel. Pound for pound most European and middle eastern sword were just as good at what they were made for.
So sure some where super crafted by by no means were all of them so well made.
well Deadliest Warrior is not a scientific journal per say, but its not complete shite.
And testing of katana's sharpness was with a cut rather than a poke. See Tameshigiri.
Hate to tell ya man but most any blade of the same size could do as well. Some two handed ones much better as they were made to do just that.
As as I said the Katana is nice and all but no better then most other swords at what it does.
In all seriousness, the katana is rated by the professionals as the deadliest overall personal combat weapon ever devised. That does not mean there are not close contenders - such as:
* Western broadswords (the D&D bastard sword and greatsword) could cut as well, were better for thrusting but had the disadvantage of being heavier and slower to swing.
* Middle-Eastern scimitars could match the keen edge and speed of the katana but didn't hit with as much force.
* Light thrusting swords - from the western rapier, epee and foil to the Chinese thrusting swords - were faster but did not deal as much damage as the katana.
As for the manufacture of the katana, it had a very finely tempered steel edge that - regardless of the quality you started with - was very high quality steel. This was backed with a milder steel core and back that gave added toughness to the combination, making it a composite material. Now the quality of individual blades did vary - some were churned out for the rank-and-file that were much poorer quality, while those made for the top nobility were superb and pretty much unmatched. I'd therefore object to the idea that all katanas are masterwork weapons. The elven curve-blade stats work for me, in any event.
I think the Katana would use the same stats as the Bastard Sword except it would always be masterwork and be less weight and would require Weapon Finesse to use it. Just being a Katana doesn't give one the skill to use it properly. With out weapon finesse you would apply no strength to you to hit with the Katana.
I'm thinking the feats that would be used with Katana to match it traditional use would be.
Weapon Focus and Furious Focus would give the power accuracy of the weapon.
Improved Critical, Power Attack, weapon specialization and Bleedling Critical adds to the lethality of the weapon.
Weapon focus for accuracy.
Only thing missing is the ability to Watershed, the defensive part of the Katana, which could be added as feat for the Katana that allows a +2 AC to block a blow with the flat of the blade braced against you arm.
With this the Katana really isn't any better than any other exotic weapon and it's your feat selection that makes it truly a deadly weapon.
I think the Katana would use the same stats as the Bastard Sword except it would always be masterwork and be less weight and would require Weapon Finesse to use it. Just being a Katana doesn't give one the skill to use it properly. With out weapon finesse you would apply no strength to you to hit with the Katana.
They are very different weapons, although they are very similar in actual damage dealt.
I'm thinking the feats that would be used with Katana to match it traditional use would be.
Weapon Focus and Furious Focus would give the power accuracy of the weapon.
Improved Critical, Power Attack, weapon specialization and Bleedling Critical adds to the lethality of the weapon.Weapon focus for accuracy.
Only thing missing is the ability to Watershed, the defensive part of the Katana, which could be added as feat for the Katana that allows a +2 AC to block a blow with the flat of the blade braced against you arm.
With this the Katana really isn't any better than any other exotic weapon and it's your feat selection that makes it truly a deadly weapon.
I like that idea, having specific feats for the weapon.
I think the Katana would use the same stats as the Bastard Sword except it would always be masterwork and be less weight and would require Weapon Finesse to use it. Just being a Katana doesn't give one the skill to use it properly. With out weapon finesse you would apply no strength to you to hit with the Katana.
Ya know except a Bastard sword should also be lighter. "Bastard swords" didn't wight 6 pounds any more then a katana did.
Also why the hell should ALL katana's be masterwork?
Well I know the bastard sword weighs more than the katana, whichever way it works, but I agree that not all katanas were masterwork, which is why I prefer the elven curveblade stats.
Also why the hell should ALL katana's be masterwork?
Read the title of the thread. Duh.
Also, watch your language young man. Do you text your mother with those fingers?
I don't like the curveblade as it can not be used one handed, but eh thats ok as well. After all we have Falchions and Khopeshes as two handed weapons which still hurts my head and is a WTF item for me.
Also why the hell should ALL katana's be masterwork?Read the title of the thread. Duh.
Also, watch your language young man. Do you text your mother with those fingers?
where are you from that you find me saying hell bad language? A 1950's tv show?
I don't like the curveblade as it can not be used one handed, but eh thats ok as well. After all we have Falchions and Khopeshes as two handed weapons which still hurts my head and is a WTF item for me.
Me too. The Khopesh was a one-handed sword in effect, with a 'hook' to allow easier tripping and dissarming. The Falchion was supposed to be a one-handed weapon, like a heavy scimitar. There WERE two-handed scimitars, but ... well lets just say they were pretty similar to greatswords. And don't get me started on kusari-gamas ...
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where are you from that you find me saying hell bad language? A 1950's tv show?Also why the hell should ALL katana's be masterwork?Read the title of the thread. Duh.
Also, watch your language young man. Do you text your mother with those fingers?
The fact that usage has become more commonplace than in the 1950s does not elevate it above the 'bad language' threshold.
That said, I'm pretty sure he was at least mostly joking.