Hey all,
So a player in my group had his character killed last week and he recently asked me if it would be possible to multi-class as a Sorcerer/Sorcerer so he could play with 2 blood lines.
General thoughts?
no. not at all.
If that was possible every fighter would be:
Fighter 2/Fighter 2/Fighter 2/Fighter 2/Fighter 2/Fighter 2/Fighter 2/Fighter 2/ad nauseum
no. not at all.
If that was possible every fighter would be:
Fighter 2/Fighter 2/Fighter 2/Fighter 2/Fighter 2/Fighter 2/Fighter 2/Fighter 2/ad nauseum
Good point. Never thought of it that way.
No, if you take sorcerer gain, you will simply advance in sorcerer..you can't take the same class more then one. New levels always stack with the old ones.
All that said, consider whether you would allow the character to acquire the second bloodline through one or more feats (probably one for each power or asset he acquires thereby).
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no. not at all.
If that was possible every fighter would be:
Fighter 2/Fighter 2/Fighter 2/Fighter 2/Fighter 2/Fighter 2/Fighter 2/Fighter 2/ad nauseum
Two points:
1) I wouldn't do that with fighter. The armor training and weapon training cannot be duplicated by any number of feats, and you would never get things like weapon specialization because you're still a 2nd level fighter. Just a bad deal.
2) I would probably still not allow this as a DM except for specific classes. Sorc would be one of them, since everything about a Sorc/Sorc multi-class (even with an adapted Mystic Theurge to support it) sucks. I would ask that they come up with an interesting way to combine the themes, however, and possibly make a custom prestige class for those themes that makes them effective (rather than dead weight). Or I'd go with Tarondor's suggestion and allow them to sacrifice their feats to gain progress with a secondary bloodline.
IIRC the core rulebook even states this is a no-no for both sorc and wiz.
A strange request, this is. But not the first time someone wanted to mix spellcasting classes. After all, you can go wizard/cleric/mystic theurge, or sorcerer/druid/arcane hierophant, or even wizard/sorcerer/ultimate magus. If you have access to 3.5 stuff, that is. Which makes me ask the following: can players take 3.5 versions of the base classes? Can they multiclass pathfinder base classes with 3.5 base classes?
Additionally, while the concept is strange, it can have some interesting explanation. Normally, a sorcerer derives his power from his bloodline: the blood of a powerful ancestor, which might be an outsider, runs through their veins. Building a backstory with two such ancestor could be interesting. However, as suggested before, you don't need to actually multiclass sorcerer with itself if you've access to the bloodline feats from 3.5.
$0.02
Hey all,
So a player in my group had his character killed last week and he recently asked me if it would be possible to multi-class as a Sorcerer/Sorcerer so he could play with 2 blood lines.General thoughts?
The book states that it isn't possible. Furthermore a character that cast 5 level spells at level 20th is somewhat useless.
All that said, consider whether you would allow the character to acquire the second bloodline through one or more feats (probably one for each power or asset he acquires thereby).
Orgyborn
Your ancestors were like a box of hamsters.Benefit: You get another bloodline.
Normal: You only get one bloodline, as your ancestors had at least some discretion.
;-)
Yeah, feats was my first thought to fill out a reasonable trade with the player. It was an interesting concept which is why I paused to consider it. He wanted to be the product of a Succubus that seduced an Angel with the Celestial and Abyssal bloodlines. Thanks for the input folks.
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All that said, consider whether you would allow the character to acquire the second bloodline through one or more feats (probably one for each power or asset he acquires thereby).Orgyborn
Your ancestors were like a box of hamsters.
Benefit: You get another bloodline.
Normal: You only get one bloodline, as your ancestors had at least some discretion.
Heh! I'd actually allow that. "What? My grandmother was a Half-Celestial Gold Dragon..."
There's some precedent with the 'dual specialization' allowed to certain wizards back in the day, such as some previous write ups for the Red Wizards, or some Elven PrC in the Scarred Lands that dual specialized in Abjuration and Illusion.
Yeah, feats was my first thought to fill out a reasonable trade with the player. It was an interesting concept which is why I paused to consider it. He wanted to be the product of a Succubus that seduced an Angel with the Celestial and Abyssal bloodlines. Thanks for the input folks.
I would probably consider having him invest one of his first level feats into the other bloodline. Then start taking the powers, choosing between the two bloodlines which one he actually gets as he sees fit. For any powers with a x times/day mechanic, I'd consider giving him both but having them run off the same pool of times per day.
I can't think of a really good justification for allowing both sets of powers to fully advance. If they did, then all of his summoned creatures would have DR/evil and DR/good, he'd have a lot of potent energy resistances, and he could eventually have both Ascendence and Demonic Might, which seem pretty incompatible to me.
Actually, that would be interesting. A Mystic Theurge-esque class that allows you to take levels in two arcane casting classes and bring them both up to high level. Sorcerer/Wizard or Wizard/Witch or Sorcerer/Witch or Bard/Witch or Bard/Sorcerer all could be interesting mixes, and as they are all arcane classes it would be thematically 'easier' for the particular PrC to mingle the two classes, rather than trying to work both Arcane and Divine energies like the Mystic Theurge.
I'll try and brain-storm wether or not this is 'worth it'. Idealy, being able to cast 2nd level spells in one class and 1st level spells in the other would be the base requirement, to allow the casters to get into it without the slight drag that the Mystic Theurge causes, but the application of 'double power' Arcane must in turn be balanced by heavy skill requirements and/or special requirements.
Actually, that would be interesting. A Mystic Theurge-esque class that allows you to take levels in two arcane casting classes and bring them both up to high level. Sorcerer/Wizard or Wizard/Witch or Sorcerer/Witch or Bard/Witch or Bard/Sorcerer all could be interesting mixes, and as they are all arcane classes it would be thematically 'easier' for the particular PrC to mingle the two classes, rather than trying to work both Arcane and Divine energies like the Mystic Theurge.
I'll try and brain-storm wether or not this is 'worth it'. Idealy, being able to cast 2nd level spells in one class and 1st level spells in the other would be the base requirement, to allow the casters to get into it without the slight drag that the Mystic Theurge causes, but the application of 'double power' Arcane must in turn be balanced by heavy skill requirements and/or special requirements.
Also look at the Ultimate Magus from the Complete Mage. It combined a spontaneous arcane spellcaster with a prepared arcane spellcaster and didn't advance both classes in spellcasting at the same time, all the time, but it might give you some ideas as well.
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Orgyborn, Greater
Your ancestors were all sluts who screwed anything that moved, flew, slithered, oozed, etc.
Prerequisite: Orgyborn
Benefit: You get yet another another bloodline.
Normal: You only get one bloodline, as your ancestors had at least some discretion.
Note: This feat can be taken multiple times. Each time, another bloodline is gained, and people regard your family with more disgust and revulsion.
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My first instinct was a feat, but there's no beating KaeYoss' suggestion. So as an alternative I'll go with my second instinct, a prestige class.
Ancestral Bloodsurge
Once your arcane magic was influenced by the blood of one of your ancestors. Now, the magic inherent in the blood of another ancestor begins to surface.
Alignment: Any.
Requirements
To qualify to become an ancestral bloodsurge, a character must fulfill all the following criteria.
Spells: Able to spontaneously cast 2nd-level arcane spells.
Special: Must have a bloodline.
Hit Die: d6.
Class Skills
The sorcerer's class skills are Appraise (Int), Bluff (Cha), Craft (Int), Fly (Dex), Intimidate (Cha), Knowledge (arcana) (Int), Profession (Wis), Spellcraft (Int), and Use Magic Device (Cha).
Skill Ranks per Level: 2 + Int modifier.
Lvl/BAB/Fort/Ref/Wil/Special/Spells per day
1/+0/+0/+0/+1/Dormant bloodline surfaces/--
2/+1/+1/+1/+1/Dominant bloodline/+1 level of sorcerer spellcasting
3/+1/+1/+1/+2/Synchronized bloodlines/+1 level of sorcerer spellcasting
Class Features
All of the following are features of the ancestral bloodsurge prestige class.
Weapon and Armor Proficiency: Ancestral bloodsurges gain no proficiency with any weapon or armor.
Spells per Day: At the indicated levels, an ancestral bloodsurge gains new spells per day as if he had also gained a level in sorcerer. You also gain the benefits of your dominant bloodline (see below).
Dormant bloodline surfaces: At first level, pick a second sorcerer bloodline. You gain all the benefits of a sorcerer of that bloodline equal to your sorcerer level.
Dominant bloodline: Choose one of your bloodlines to be your dominant bloodline for the purpose of the benefits gained from increases to your sorcerer caster level. Your non-dominant bloodline is considered your underlying bloodline.
Synchronized bloodlines: Whenever you gain a level of sorcerer, both your bloodlines improve by one level. For example, if you are a sorcerer 4/ancestral bloodsurge 3, when you gain a level in sorcerer your dominant bloodline grants you the benefits of an 7th level sorcerer while your underlying bloodline grants you the benefits of a 5th level sorcerer.