| Dork Lord |
I ran into this in 3.5 and it hasn't changed in Pathfinder. Players put max ranks into Spot (now Perception) and trip over themselves to have the higher Perception score. Heck, I admit even I've done it. Why do we do this? Logically, only one character needs an ungodly Perception skill (usually the Rogue). If the DM says "everyone make a Perception check", regardless of who makes it, the ones who made the check will let the other oblivious characters know what they saw, so the whole thing seems kind of silly... like having multiple characters with Knowledge: Arcana. I dunno, does what I'm saying make any sense?
TriOmegaZero
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Because you never know when a character might wander off to the toilet and have to roll a Perception check to notice the ninja on the ceiling? Basically, you can never be certain that the DM will make everyone roll or not. The warlock in my campaign was the only one who had see invisibility to notice the assassin creeping up on the fighter for the death attack.
| mdt |
Nope,
Let me walk through it.
Surprise round, party is being ambushed.
Ambusher 1 : Stealth 25
Ambusher 2 : Stealth 28
Ambusher 3 : Stealth 20
Rogue : Perception 23
Fighter : Perception 12
Cleric : Perception 4
Wizard : Perception 8
The fighter, cleric, and wizard failed their perception checks, they don't even know they are being attacked. They are flat footed the surprise round, and are attacked without being able to respond. The Rogue didn't beat everyone, but he got at least one ambusher, so he calls out 'AMBUSH' as the ambush occurs. He gets to act this round, everyone acts next round. Low perception is BAD!
Situation the Next,
Rogue is busy searching for magical traps (distracted, 30 feet ahead). 10 goblin archers sneak up on the characters from behind.
Goblins : Lowest Stealth : 18
Fighter : Perception 4
Cleric : Perception 8
Wizard : Perception 15
The poor wizard get's 10 arrows in his back during the surprise round (and keels over dead). Next round, it's the cleric's turn.
| Anonymous Visitor 163 576 |
Some people build their characters based on the idea in their head. If your sarcastic mercenary fighter spent a lot of time of guard duty, he would have put points into Perception to do his job.
What the rogue is doing isn't really relevant from that point of view.
So, this is a question of what's good for you vs. what's good for the group.
| Lathiira |
Also, consider what happens if you're examining an enormous room. Sure, the rogue's got great Perception, but if he's examining a 100' long wall, it'll take him a little while. So the group splits up to examine each wall. So a separate check is needed for each person as they examine their particular walls. Especially if the walls do something mean like start closing in on the party. Who has time to wait for the rogue to make the Perception checks then?
| mdt |
It's a game about, duh, exploring DANGEROUS places full of DEADLY encounters with many TRAPS, AMBUSHERS and other things that want you to NOT NOTICE THEM until it's too late.
So, the very nature of the game leads to Perception being a rather useful skill.
LOL
Let's put it like this. Spot/Listen in 3.5 were so vital to the game that I houseruled them as class skills for every class, even adepts and warriors.
It boggles my mind in 3.5 that a combat veteran, a hardened warrior who had fought in many campaigns, trudged through fields, forests, swamps, fought in fields, towns, castles and on ships, a 15th level fighter who's survived for years on his sword and wits, could have a max rank in spot of 7. A man who'd been through all that could be ambushed by every road bandit who'd been in the woods more than a week.
I much prefer the PF skill method. It doesn't kill you that perception is a non-class skill. It just means you don't get the +3 bonus. It means the Rogue will be better at perception than the fighter, but not by ludicrous amounts. He is, however, much better at perceiving traps than the fighter, which is how it should be.
| Ross Byers RPG Superstar 2008 Top 32 |
Having multiple good rolls also dramatically improves the chances of at least someone succeeding.
Suppose a monster/NPC with good stealth is stalking the party. Since it has maxed stealth, it has roughly the same stealth modifier as the rogue/ranger/perceptive character has a perception modifier, meaning there's roughly a 50/50 chance to succeed on the opposed roll. If everyone in the party except the perceptive guy ignored perception, they're only going to succeed on the really high roll, if at all, so the party has a 50% chance to be ambushed.
However, if even one other character maxed out their perception, the chances of at least one character spotting the ambush is now 3/4. If a third character maxes it, it's closer to 7/8ths, and so on.