I currently have a front line melee druid build in Pathfinder society. I just recieved high enough limit to be able to purchase an amulet of mighty fists +1.
With the amulet allowing you to substitute a +1 weapon quality for the +1 which one would you take? I am currently LVL 5. I wont be taking it as a +1 enhancement as I either will use GMF or Shilleigh.
First be aware that your Amulet of Mighty Fists won't stack with your Shillelagh, but it will stack with your Greater Magic Fang. Don't mix the two up.
As for good special abilities for your amulet, my first choice would be flaming, frost, or shock. Those do an extra 1d6 damage to anything that isn't resistant or immune, and frankly, when you're wildshaped into a bear with flaming claws, it's going to look very cool.
My take:
Bane: Too limited. Unless your campaign deals very heavily with one kind of creature, this is a bad choice.
Defending: Won't work unless the amulet also has at least a +1 enhancement bonus, which it won't. Besides, even if you maka a +1 Defending amulet, there are far cheaper ways to get +1 AC.
Flaming: My first choice. 1d6 damage and your wildshape would have flaming claws and teeth. How cool is that?
Frost: As good as flaming. Doesn't look as cool, but fewer enemies will have resistance.
Shock: Same as Frost.
Ghost Touch: Fairly good choice, but only if you frequently fight incorporeal stuff. If you don't, then this would be mostly wasted. For that reason, it's not my first choice.
Keen: Not worth it on a weapon that only threatens a crit on a 20.
Ki Focus: You can't use it unless you get some monk levels.
Merciful: Are you that soft-hearted? It's good bonus damage, and it's less likely to kill. As a sneaky aside, almost nothing is immune to it, so it might be more effective than flaming/frost/shock, but it won't look as cool.
Mighty Cleaving: My second choice. Extra attacks are always nice.
Spell Storing: Bah, you have enough. Get a real weapon.
Throwing: Not applicable.
Thundering: Waste of time. Only works when you score a crit, and natural attacks suck at crits.
Vicious: Interesting choice. Lots of damage, but you hurt yourself too. Come to think of it, this might top my list, since you can always prepare a few Cure spells to make up for the self-inflicted damage.
Hope that helps.
First be aware that your Amulet of Mighty Fists won't stack with your Shillelagh, but it will stack with your Greater Magic Fang. Don't mix the two up.
As for good special abilities for your amulet, my first choice would be flaming, frost, or shock. Those do an extra 1d6 damage to anything that isn't resistant or immune, and frankly, when you're wildshaped into a bear with flaming claws, it's going to look very cool.
My take:
Bane: Too limited. Unless your campaign deals very heavily with one kind of creature, this is a bad choice.
Defending: Won't work unless the amulet also has at least a +1 enhancement bonus, which it won't. Besides, even if you maka a +1 Defending amulet, there are far cheaper ways to get +1 AC.
Flaming: My first choice. 1d6 damage and your wildshape would have flaming claws and teeth. How cool is that?
Frost: As good as flaming. Doesn't look as cool, but fewer enemies will have resistance.
Shock: Same as Frost.
Ghost Touch: Fairly good choice, but only if you frequently fight incorporeal stuff. If you don't, then this would be mostly wasted. For that reason, it's not my first choice.
Keen: Not worth it on a weapon that only threatens a crit on a 20.
Ki Focus: You can't use it unless you get some monk levels.
Merciful: Are you that soft-hearted? It's good bonus damage, and it's less likely to kill. As a sneaky aside, almost nothing is immune to it, so it might be more effective than flaming/frost/shock, but it won't look as cool.
Mighty Cleaving: My second choice. Extra attacks are always nice.
Spell Storing: Bah, you have enough. Get a real weapon.
Throwing: Not applicable.
Thundering: Waste of time. Only works when you score a crit, and natural attacks suck at crits.
Vicious: Interesting choice. Lots of damage, but you hurt yourself too. Come to think of it, this might top my list, since you can always prepare a few Cure spells to make up for the self-inflicted damage.Hope that helps.
As for the campaign, this will be for Pathfinder Society. I am considering taking 2 levels of monk for evasion and the + Wisdom to AC while in wildshape after 8th level. But this is not enough to make use of Ki Strike. I agree about spell storing as the only spell really usable would be Poison. I am not a merciful person so thats out.
So of the list above (thanks for making it!) these ones are viable for me still:
Bane: Limited but I do like the idea of buying a few of these such as for undead and outsiders when I have the money so I am prepped when I know I am going to fight them.
Flaming:
Frost: As good as flaming. Doesn't look as cool, but fewer enemies will have resistance.
Shock: Same as Frost.
Ghost Touch: not sure how often I will fight incorporal? higher levels a definite must...
Mighty Cleaving: Extra attacks ARE always nice.
Vicious:
So I am between Mighty Cleaving, Frost and Bane:Outsider as my first amulet in that order. Thoughts?
As for the campaign, this will be for Pathfinder Society. I am considering taking 2 levels of monk for evasion and the + Wisdom to AC while in wildshape after 8th level. But this is not enough to make use of Ki Strike. I agree about spell storing as the only spell really usable would be Poison. I am not a merciful person so thats out.
So of the list above (thanks for making it!) these ones are viable for me still:
Bane: Limited but I do like the idea of buying a few of these such as for undead and outsiders when I have the money so I am prepped when I know I am going to fight them.
Flaming:
Frost: As good as flaming. Doesn't look as cool, but fewer enemies will have resistance.
Shock: Same as Frost.
Ghost Touch: not sure how often I will fight incorporal? higher levels a definite must...
Mighty Cleaving: Extra attacks ARE always nice.
Vicious:So I am between Mighty Cleaving, Frost and Bane:Outsider as my first amulet in that order. Thoughts?
My final suggestion would be to pick something useful in every fight. While it will be, eventually, a good idea to have a golf bag with a (figurative) club for every occasion, you have to ask yourself just how often you would use your outsider bane, and how many fights you will get zero benefit out of it. My guess, at your level, most of your fights will not be against outsiders. Not for several more levels, by which time, it will be easy to buy all the limited-use tricky stuff you want.
Until then, I would go with something solid, something you can depend on every opponent you face, or at least most of them.
Frost works on nearly everything. The stuff you might occasionally fight that is resistant or immune to frost is rare, and most of it is higher level. I would say frost is useful at least 90% of the time, and probably more.
Cleave works on everything, but sometimes, there just isn't another foe adjacent to the one you hit, so while it works on everything, you still won't be able to use it in every fight. I would say off the top of my head that cleavers in my groups are able to use cleaves in (as an average guess) around 2/3 of our fights, but not on every attack of those fights, so maybe about half of their attacks. So let's call this one 50%.
Bane(outsider) at your levels is fairly uncommon. Perhaps even rare. Unless you have reason to believe that your PFS character will really see that many outsiders, then Bane is nice. But for most adventures I've seen in your level range, and even a little higher, I would say you're likely to use this in no more than 10-20% of your fights. Yes, that's just a guess, way off the top of my head, and no, I can't see the future. But it's an educated guess based on many years of DMing and playing adventures of those levels. So I would say 15% useful.
Based on that, I would take Frost. In a couple levels you can enchant it to add Mighty Cleaving. I would probably never add Bane(outsider) to it, but I might buy a separate one for my golf bag.
I currently have a front line melee druid build in Pathfinder society. I just recieved high enough limit to be able to purchase an amulet of mighty fists +1.
With the amulet allowing you to substitute a +1 weapon quality for the +1 which one would you take? I am currently LVL 5. I wont be taking it as a +1 enhancement as I either will use GMF or Shilleigh.
Amulet of mighty fists with a special quality seems like a winning choice here. You have magic bludgeoning with shillelagh, you can get piercing slashing and bludgeoning with wild shape, I would say yah, throw frost on that bad boy and you can use pounce forms/multi-attack to throw down 5d6 frost damage a round.
Amulet of mighty fists with a special quality seems like a winning choice here. You have magic bludgeoning with shillelagh, you can get piercing slashing and bludgeoning with wild shape, I would say yah, throw frost on that bad boy and you can use pounce forms/multi-attack to throw down 5d6 frost damage a round.I currently have a front line melee druid build in Pathfinder society. I just recieved high enough limit to be able to purchase an amulet of mighty fists +1.
With the amulet allowing you to substitute a +1 weapon quality for the +1 which one would you take? I am currently LVL 5. I wont be taking it as a +1 enhancement as I either will use GMF or Shilleigh.
Or wildshape into a squid for 10d6 frost every round...
How long does it take for a squid to "drown" on dry land?
Amulet of mighty fists with a special quality seems like a winning choice here. You have magic bludgeoning with shillelagh, you can get piercing slashing and bludgeoning with wild shape, I would say yah, throw frost on that bad boy and you can use pounce forms/multi-attack to throw down 5d6 frost damage a round.I currently have a front line melee druid build in Pathfinder society. I just recieved high enough limit to be able to purchase an amulet of mighty fists +1.
With the amulet allowing you to substitute a +1 weapon quality for the +1 which one would you take? I am currently LVL 5. I wont be taking it as a +1 enhancement as I either will use GMF or Shilleigh.
Or wildshape into a squid for 10d6 frost every round...
How long does it take for a squid to "drown" on dry land?
Can't do the 10 attacks with regular squid, just gets arms and bite (using d20srd, not sure if that's changed with beastiary)
However giant squid gets 10 tentacles and a bite and could fight for 6 rounds before it risked drowning. It has no land speed however so you'd be stuck in place without magical movement of some type. could be ok in a small room with no way out besides through the squid :)
Amulet of mighty fists with a special quality seems like a winning choice here. You have magic bludgeoning with shillelagh, you can get piercing slashing and bludgeoning with wild shape, I would say yah, throw frost on that bad boy and you can use pounce forms/multi-attack to throw down 5d6 frost damage a round.I currently have a front line melee druid build in Pathfinder society. I just recieved high enough limit to be able to purchase an amulet of mighty fists +1.
With the amulet allowing you to substitute a +1 weapon quality for the +1 which one would you take? I am currently LVL 5. I wont be taking it as a +1 enhancement as I either will use GMF or Shilleigh.
Or wildshape into a squid for 10d6 frost every round...
How long does it take for a squid to "drown" on dry land?
Can't do the 10 attacks with regular squid, just gets arms and bite (using d20srd, not sure if that's changed with beastiary)
However giant squid gets 10 tentacles and a bite and could fight for 6 rounds before it risked drowning. It has no land speed however so you'd be stuck in place without magical movement of some type. could be ok in a small room with no way out besides through the squid :)
Thats why you stick with the Giant Octupus (Large so you can do this at 6th) which has a land speed, 8 attacks (at 20ft reach) and a bite...and I will take the drowning rules and only be able to be in the form for double my constitution minus one for each standard action I take...im ok with that.
What sort of animal / type are you using to be a melee druid? My druid says in earth elemetnal form all the time, so I just use magic fang which at 12th level gives me +3 for 12 hours, and keeps me up with the magic weapons in the party. So unless you want to get something like flaming etc, then why bother?
What sort of animal / type are you using to be a melee druid? My druid says in earth elemetnal form all the time, so I just use magic fang which at 12th level gives me +3 for 12 hours, and keeps me up with the magic weapons in the party. So unless you want to get something like flaming etc, then why bother?
Magic Fang +Flaming or a Bane your are facing a lot is really helpful especially if you are making a lot of attacks...Like I said above, octopus is an extreme, but even some of the cats with 5 attacks would benefit....
As for Earth elemental I agree on staying in that form most of the time, but I would be using a club for shilliegh and other hand open for slam.
I'd go with Merciful, although Evil Outsider Bane is good at higher levels.
What sort of animal / type are you using to be a melee druid? My druid says in earth elemetnal form all the time, so I just use magic fang which at 12th level gives me +3 for 12 hours, and keeps me up with the magic weapons in the party. So unless you want to get something like flaming etc, then why bother?
flaming, freezing, shocking, (assuming fighting evils)holy amulet of mighty fists. You'll probably want to craft your own as that is expensive. Greater magic fang yourself when you get up in the morning.
Add multi-attack and a pounce form and you're doing 5 attacks at +1/magic each doing normal damage +1d6 fire, +1d6 cold, +1d6 electric, +2d6 holy on standard attacks i.e. the surprise round. Pounce lets you full attack when you charge, you can charge as a standard action if you are limited to a standard action. Most likely at least 2d6 extra damage per hit, and on most targets +5d6 per hit. You are now a melee machine. This is wonderful for druids because they can charge in a lot of terrains where other characters couldn't. Extra move speed also helps jump checks to bypass some things that would block charge lines.
What sort of animal / type are you using to be a melee druid? My druid says in earth elemetnal form all the time, so I just use magic fang which at 12th level gives me +3 for 12 hours, and keeps me up with the magic weapons in the party. So unless you want to get something like flaming etc, then why bother?flaming, freezing, shocking, (assuming fighting evils)holy amulet of mighty fists. You'll probably want to craft your own as that is expensive. Greater magic fang yourself when you get up in the morning.
Add multi-attack and a pounce form and you're doing 5 attacks at +1/magic each doing normal damage +1d6 fire, +1d6 cold, +1d6 electric, +2d6 holy on standard attacks i.e. the surprise round. Pounce lets you full attack when you charge, you can charge as a standard action if you are limited to a standard action. Most likely at least 2d6 extra damage per hit, and on most targets +5d6 per hit. You are now a melee machine. This is wonderful for druids because they can charge in a lot of terrains where other characters couldn't. Extra move speed also helps jump checks to bypass some things that would block charge lines.
What is even better is throwing Rhino armor on top of this...the armor does not work but you still get the benefit of +2d6 on a charge/pounce
What is even better is throwing Rhino armor on top of this...the armor does not work but you still get the benefit of +2d6 on a charge/pounceWhat sort of animal / type are you using to be a melee druid? My druid says in earth elemetnal form all the time, so I just use magic fang which at 12th level gives me +3 for 12 hours, and keeps me up with the magic weapons in the party. So unless you want to get something like flaming etc, then why bother?flaming, freezing, shocking, (assuming fighting evils)holy amulet of mighty fists. You'll probably want to craft your own as that is expensive. Greater magic fang yourself when you get up in the morning.
Add multi-attack and a pounce form and you're doing 5 attacks at +1/magic each doing normal damage +1d6 fire, +1d6 cold, +1d6 electric, +2d6 holy on standard attacks i.e. the surprise round. Pounce lets you full attack when you charge, you can charge as a standard action if you are limited to a standard action. Most likely at least 2d6 extra damage per hit, and on most targets +5d6 per hit. You are now a melee machine. This is wonderful for druids because they can charge in a lot of terrains where other characters couldn't. Extra move speed also helps jump checks to bypass some things that would block charge lines.
It works if you make it wild later on :)
It works if you make it wild later on :)What is even better is throwing Rhino armor on top of this...the armor does not work but you still get the benefit of +2d6 on a charge/pounceWhat sort of animal / type are you using to be a melee druid? My druid says in earth elemetnal form all the time, so I just use magic fang which at 12th level gives me +3 for 12 hours, and keeps me up with the magic weapons in the party. So unless you want to get something like flaming etc, then why bother?flaming, freezing, shocking, (assuming fighting evils)holy amulet of mighty fists. You'll probably want to craft your own as that is expensive. Greater magic fang yourself when you get up in the morning.
Add multi-attack and a pounce form and you're doing 5 attacks at +1/magic each doing normal damage +1d6 fire, +1d6 cold, +1d6 electric, +2d6 holy on standard attacks i.e. the surprise round. Pounce lets you full attack when you charge, you can charge as a standard action if you are limited to a standard action. Most likely at least 2d6 extra damage per hit, and on most targets +5d6 per hit. You are now a melee machine. This is wonderful for druids because they can charge in a lot of terrains where other characters couldn't. Extra move speed also helps jump checks to bypass some things that would block charge lines.
Did the rules change? I didnt think you could upgrade specific weapons/armors...
Did the rules change? I didnt think you could upgrade specific weapons/armors...
I've never seen anything that has specifically stated you can't upgrade specific weapons/armors, and I have seen things from WotC that pointed out how to go about doing so.
I've argued against allowing someone to make "mithral" celestial armor, on the grounds that it is already made out of a specific material but that was a specific instance case (in my opinion it would be like allowing someone to make "dwarven plate" out of mithral and still get the 3/- damage reduction since it's "still dwarven plate").
Did the rules change? I didnt think you could upgrade specific weapons/armors...It works if you make it wild later on :)What is even better is throwing Rhino armor on top of this...the armor does not work but you still get the benefit of +2d6 on a charge/pounceWhat sort of animal / type are you using to be a melee druid? My druid says in earth elemetnal form all the time, so I just use magic fang which at 12th level gives me +3 for 12 hours, and keeps me up with the magic weapons in the party. So unless you want to get something like flaming etc, then why bother?flaming, freezing, shocking, (assuming fighting evils)holy amulet of mighty fists. You'll probably want to craft your own as that is expensive. Greater magic fang yourself when you get up in the morning.
Add multi-attack and a pounce form and you're doing 5 attacks at +1/magic each doing normal damage +1d6 fire, +1d6 cold, +1d6 electric, +2d6 holy on standard attacks i.e. the surprise round. Pounce lets you full attack when you charge, you can charge as a standard action if you are limited to a standard action. Most likely at least 2d6 extra damage per hit, and on most targets +5d6 per hit. You are now a melee machine. This is wonderful for druids because they can charge in a lot of terrains where other characters couldn't. Extra move speed also helps jump checks to bypass some things that would block charge lines.
Why wouldn't you be able to? The usefulness of specific items would cap out pretty quick if they couldn't be improved like a standard magic item.
Why wouldn't you be able to? The usefulness of specific items would cap out pretty quick if they couldn't be improved like a standard magic item.
The problem is that it's not transparent how the pricing works. Take Celestial Armor as an example -- it could be regular +3 chainmail (9,000 gp) with +13,400 gp worth of extra goodies attached, or it could be +3 chainmail with a +1 special ability (16,000 gp) with +6,400 gp worth of extra goodies attached, or it could be +3 chainmail made out of some exotic substance (like mithral, but different) with an unknown amount in extra goodies attached.
The problem is that it's not transparent how the pricing works. Take Celestial Armor as an example -- it could be regular +3 chainmail (9,000 gp) with +13,400 gp worth of extra goodies attached, or it could be +3 chainmail with a +1 special ability (16,000 gp) with +6,400 gp worth of extra goodies attached, or it could be +3 chainmail made out of some exotic substance (like mithral, but different) with an unknown amount in extra goodies attached.
Why wouldn't you be able to? The usefulness of specific items would cap out pretty quick if they couldn't be improved like a standard magic item.
That's no different than the core abilities you can add to a standard armor that don't have a +1-+5 equivalent like energy resistance, etherealness, etc.
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Take Celestial Armor as an example -- it could be regular +3 chainmail (9,000 gp) with +13,400 gp worth of extra goodies attached, or it could be +3 chainmail with a +1 special ability (16,000 gp) with +6,400 gp worth of extra goodies attached, or it could be +3 chainmail made out of some exotic substance (like mithral, but different) with an unknown amount in extra goodies attached.
Best way (for balance) is to calculate the highest +X it could be and add the remaining GP in +GP goodies, then add to the +X.
So for Celestial, make it +3 with +1 ability and 6400 gp more. Then to make it a +4 chainmail, price as +5 item + 6400.
While it would be nice if there were an official stance, this is pretty easy to roll with as a GM. Just take your choice of the following as a standard operating procedure and let the dice fall.
1: Listed enhancement bonus + hard cash. In this choice, any plusses or established abilities the item have contribute to it's enhancement bonus, anything else is raw cash. In the case of the Celestial Armor, this would mean +3 + 13,400 gp
2: Price = maximum enhancement bonus price + extra. In this choice, you find the biggest enhancement bonus price the item meets (+4 in the case of Celestial Chain), and whatever is left is hard cash.
Pick one to make official in your game and your done.
Sure. But note that the original poster is talking about a Pathfinder Society organized play character, so he doesn't really have that option.
Sure. But note that the original poster is talking about a Pathfinder Society organized play character, so he doesn't really have that option.While it would be nice if there were an official stance, this is pretty easy to roll with as a GM. Just take your choice of the following as a standard operating procedure and let the dice fall.
1: Listed enhancement bonus + hard cash. In this choice, any plusses or established abilities the item have contribute to it's enhancement bonus, anything else is raw cash. In the case of the Celestial Armor, this would mean +3 + 13,400 gp
2: Price = maximum enhancement bonus price + extra. In this choice, you find the biggest enhancement bonus price the item meets (+4 in the case of Celestial Chain), and whatever is left is hard cash.
Pick one to make official in your game and your done.
Correct! I have to use RAW.
Correct! I have to use RAW.Sure. But note that the original poster is talking about a Pathfinder Society organized play character, so he doesn't really have that option.While it would be nice if there were an official stance, this is pretty easy to roll with as a GM. Just take your choice of the following as a standard operating procedure and let the dice fall.
1: Listed enhancement bonus + hard cash. In this choice, any plusses or established abilities the item have contribute to it's enhancement bonus, anything else is raw cash. In the case of the Celestial Armor, this would mean +3 + 13,400 gp
2: Price = maximum enhancement bonus price + extra. In this choice, you find the biggest enhancement bonus price the item meets (+4 in the case of Celestial Chain), and whatever is left is hard cash.
Pick one to make official in your game and your done.
Is there a suggestion anywhere in the core rulebook that states you can't upgrade specific armor?
Is there a suggestion anywhere in the core rulebook that states you can't upgrade specific armor?
There's no specific prices listed so the DM has to make a judgment call. But you can't guarantee that Pathfinder Society DM A will make the same judgment call as Pathfinder Society DM B.
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Is there a suggestion anywhere in the core rulebook that states you can't upgrade specific armor?
There might be, but specifically custom items are NOT considered RAW. They are entirely in the hands of the DM. So the rules essentially say "Ask your DM" for these type of items. For a PFS game that pretty much means one of these two options:
a) You shouldn't do custom items because DM's might reject them.
b) You should accept the possibility that a percentage of your DM's will say "You don't have that item in this module."
Is there a suggestion anywhere in the core rulebook that states you can't upgrade specific armor?There might be, but specifically custom items are NOT considered RAW. They are entirely in the hands of the DM. So the rules essentially say "Ask your DM" for these type of items. For a PFS game that pretty much means one of these two options:
a) You shouldn't do custom items because DM's might reject them.
b) You should accept the possibility that a percentage of your DM's will say "You don't have that item in this module."
I personally would be one of the DMs that would say you do not have that item.
On another note, just read the bestiary. Giant Octopus is sick though Giant Squid got nerfed.
Octupus still has all its attacks plus poison (bite) and Jet. Squid only has 5 attacks now.
The cool thing about the octupus is that it has a land speed and jet. And the wording of jet does not say it doesnt work on land!!! Can you see a octupus just getting across the ground 200ft each turn. LOL.
Is there a suggestion anywhere in the core rulebook that states you can't upgrade specific armor?There might be, but specifically custom items are NOT considered RAW. They are entirely in the hands of the DM. So the rules essentially say "Ask your DM" for these type of items. For a PFS game that pretty much means one of these two options:
a) You shouldn't do custom items because DM's might reject them.
b) You should accept the possibility that a percentage of your DM's will say "You don't have that item in this module."
I personally would be one of the DMs that would say you do not have that item.
On another note, just read the bestiary. Giant Octopus is sick though Giant Squid got nerfed.
Octupus still has all its attacks plus poison (bite) and Jet. Squid only has 5 attacks now.
The cool thing about the octupus is that it has a land speed and jet. And the wording of jet does not say it doesnt work on land!!! Can you see a octupus just getting across the ground 200ft each turn. LOL.
You would not let someone upgrade their rhino hide because it's not in the rules specifically that you can, when all the rules are present on how it could be done without any conversion, but you would let an octopus use jet on dry land to move twice the speed of an air elemental in flight?
You would not let someone upgrade their rhino hide because it's not in the rules specifically that you can, when all the rules are present on how it could be done without any conversion, but you would let an octopus use jet on dry land to move twice the speed of an air elemental in flight?Is there a suggestion anywhere in the core rulebook that states you can't upgrade specific armor?There might be, but specifically custom items are NOT considered RAW. They are entirely in the hands of the DM. So the rules essentially say "Ask your DM" for these type of items. For a PFS game that pretty much means one of these two options:
a) You shouldn't do custom items because DM's might reject them.
b) You should accept the possibility that a percentage of your DM's will say "You don't have that item in this module."
I personally would be one of the DMs that would say you do not have that item.
On another note, just read the bestiary. Giant Octopus is sick though Giant Squid got nerfed.
Octupus still has all its attacks plus poison (bite) and Jet. Squid only has 5 attacks now.
The cool thing about the octupus is that it has a land speed and jet. And the wording of jet does not say it doesnt work on land!!! Can you see a octupus just getting across the ground 200ft each turn. LOL.
I am sorry. I missed where in the rules it said I could upgrade and how of specific magical items. I know this could not be done in 3.5 and did not see any changes in Pathfinder towards this.
I am sorry. I missed where in the rules it said I could upgrade and how of specific magical items. I know this could not be done in 3.5 and did not see any changes in Pathfinder towards this.You would not let someone upgrade their rhino hide because it's not in the rules specifically that you can, when all the rules are present on how it could be done without any conversion, but you would let an octopus use jet on dry land to move twice the speed of an air elemental in flight?Is there a suggestion anywhere in the core rulebook that states you can't upgrade specific armor?There might be, but specifically custom items are NOT considered RAW. They are entirely in the hands of the DM. So the rules essentially say "Ask your DM" for these type of items. For a PFS game that pretty much means one of these two options:
a) You shouldn't do custom items because DM's might reject them.
b) You should accept the possibility that a percentage of your DM's will say "You don't have that item in this module."
I personally would be one of the DMs that would say you do not have that item.
On another note, just read the bestiary. Giant Octopus is sick though Giant Squid got nerfed.
Octupus still has all its attacks plus poison (bite) and Jet. Squid only has 5 attacks now.
The cool thing about the octupus is that it has a land speed and jet. And the wording of jet does not say it doesnt work on land!!! Can you see a octupus just getting across the ground 200ft each turn. LOL.
I think you might have missed the point.
I think you might have missed the point.I am sorry. I missed where in the rules it said I could upgrade and how of specific magical items. I know this could not be done in 3.5 and did not see any changes in Pathfinder towards this.You would not let someone upgrade their rhino hide because it's not in the rules specifically that you can, when all the rules are present on how it could be done without any conversion, but you would let an octopus use jet on dry land to move twice the speed of an air elemental in flight?Is there a suggestion anywhere in the core rulebook that states you can't upgrade specific armor?There might be, but specifically custom items are NOT considered RAW. They are entirely in the hands of the DM. So the rules essentially say "Ask your DM" for these type of items. For a PFS game that pretty much means one of these two options:
a) You shouldn't do custom items because DM's might reject them.
b) You should accept the possibility that a percentage of your DM's will say "You don't have that item in this module."
I personally would be one of the DMs that would say you do not have that item.
On another note, just read the bestiary. Giant Octopus is sick though Giant Squid got nerfed.
Octupus still has all its attacks plus poison (bite) and Jet. Squid only has 5 attacks now.
The cool thing about the octupus is that it has a land speed and jet. And the wording of jet does not say it doesnt work on land!!! Can you see a octupus just getting across the ground 200ft each turn. LOL.
Oh I see the point. You say that this does not make sense looking at it from a realistic point of view and as a GM you can rule however you want. But jet per raw works. Making Rhino hide armor Wild or anything else doesnt work mathamatically without adding special house rules.
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I realize that per raw jet works. It's even funny and the idea entertains me. If I were an evil wizard I would combine it with a tiger and make an octigger(or another name which is not child friendly so will stay unnamed) and give it pounce with 200 ft of movement if it uses jet.
Rhino hide is +2 armor with a special ability. To make it wild you have to increase it to +5 (wild is +3) so it's going to cost you 21K more but you can have wild +2 rhino armor if you wanted it.
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You are correct.. that is the cheesiest :)
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The sad and cheesy thing though, is you can wear Rhino Leather armor under Wild Hide armor, and you get the leather's properties and the Hide's AC, for significantly cheaper.
How so? I certainly won't claim that I have the Pathfinder RPG rules memorized, but I can't find anything that allows you to wear multiple layers of armor, let alone let their special properties stack.
You can't wear two sets of boots, two cloaks, two belts, or two helms. Where do you find rules for wearing two sets of armor on the body slot?
...In my game, you'd have to track down a Rhinodragon for it's hide if you wanted to pull such a trick. That might take a while, given they to hide in far off hidden reaches where nobody can see how ugly they are. And know one's really sure if they actually exist, or are a ploy of the Druidic Elders to string along the more covetous up-and-coming Druids until they come to their senses. :-)
...In my game, you'd have to track down a Rhinodragon for it's hide if you wanted to pull such a trick. That might take a while, given they to hide in far off hidden reaches where nobody can see how ugly they are. And know one's really sure if they actually exist, or are a ploy of the Druidic Elders to string along the more covetous up-and-coming Druids until they come to their senses. :-)
I would soo make this my druid's endless quest! The hunt for the mystical RHINODRAGON...Feared to even have survived a fight with a Tarrasque becuase the Tarrasque could not stop laughing!
I would soo make this my druid's endless quest! The hunt for the mystical RHINODRAGON...Feared to even have survived a fight with a Tarrasque becuase the Tarrasque could not stop laughing!
And of course on said quest you would constantly be ending up bumping into other "Druids" like-wise interested in extracting useful bits from said creature. Perhaps there could be a story-line for a "Good" Druid to find this creature and convince it that ALL Druids are not out for it's hide. But it would be great fun to conjure up the ranks of "almost as ugly as a rhinodragon" creatures who you encounter in your quest for "thee most foul wyrm". :-)
"Hark peasant, you say you saw the most imaginably ugly beast pass THAT way?"
"Yup, and say hi to your mama for me!"
...In my game, you'd have to track down a Rhinodragon for it's hide if you wanted to pull such a trick. That might take a while, given they to hide in far off hidden reaches where nobody can see how ugly they are. And know one's really sure if they actually exist, or are a ploy of the Druidic Elders to string along the more covetous up-and-coming Druids until they come to their senses. :-)I would soo make this my druid's endless quest! The hunt for the mystical RHINODRAGON...Feared to even have survived a fight with a Tarrasque becuase the Tarrasque could not stop laughing!
+1 these boards are hilarious this morning
The sad and cheesy thing though, is you can wear Rhino Leather armor under Wild Hide armor, and you get the leather's properties and the Hide's AC, for significantly cheaper.How so? I certainly won't claim that I have the Pathfinder RPG rules memorized, but I can't find anything that allows you to wear multiple layers of armor, let alone let their special properties stack.
You can't wear two sets of boots, two cloaks, two belts, or two helms. Where do you find rules for wearing two sets of armor on the body slot?
What he's talking about here chris is that you can wear two sets of armor, but they don't stack, you use the higher value. You could wear a ring of protection +3 and ring of protection +1 if you wanted, you would only get 3 ac out of it though. He's saying you could wear the rhino armor and get charge ability out of it and wear the wild armor and get the armor out of it because the armors don't stack, you use the highest value. I would allow it but he would fight nothing but pugwampi's... ever and i would institute fumbles
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How so? I certainly won't claim that I have the Pathfinder RPG rules memorized, but I can't find anything that allows you to wear multiple layers of armor, let alone let their special properties stack.
You can't wear two sets of boots, two cloaks, two belts, or two helms. Where do you find rules for wearing two sets of armor on the body slot?
What he's talking about here chris is that you can wear two sets of armor, but they don't stack, you use the higher value. You could wear a ring of protection +3 and ring of protection +1 if you wanted, you would only get 3 ac out of it though. He's saying you could wear the rhino armor and get charge ability out of it and wear the wild armor and get the armor out of it because the armors don't stack, you use the highest value.
Thank you, grasshopper_ea; I appreciate your explanation.
I don't think it washes, though. Yes, you can wear two rings of protection, and take the better of the two deflection bonuses, because there are two slots on the humanoid body for rings. But you can't wear two pairs of boots and have both of them work. According to the Pathfinder rules: "Of course, a character may carry or possess as many items of the same type as he wishes. However, additional items beyond those in the slots listed above have no effect."
So, if I wear bracers of armor +2, any other bracers I try to wear over them have no effect, even if those new items would normally provide better armor. In the case of two items on one slot, it's not the better item that takes precedence , it's the first one on.
Armor is a body slot. Characters can don any number of magical suits of armor, but only the first one conveys any powers at all.
At least, I can't read any other interpretation of the rules.
You can wear 10 rings.. you just only get the magical benefits of 2 of them. I could see someone wearing light leather armor or padded cloth armor under chainmail or something like that, I think that is actually historically acurate but I'm not certain on that. However it doesn't stack and if there's an ACP they would be cumulative. A lot of people don't enforce the whole sleeping in light armor thing, but my fighter types always have a light armor to sleep in if they don't have endurance.
I think you're right on the one body slot deal and only one would apply, but when you wildshape everything gets fuzzy since you're only getting the armor bonuses of one armor. I would call it like you have probably and say only one applies.
How so? I certainly won't claim that I have the Pathfinder RPG rules memorized, but I can't find anything that allows you to wear multiple layers of armor, let alone let their special properties stack.
You can't wear two sets of boots, two cloaks, two belts, or two helms. Where do you find rules for wearing two sets of armor on the body slot?
What he's talking about here chris is that you can wear two sets of armor, but they don't stack, you use the higher value. You could wear a ring of protection +3 and ring of protection +1 if you wanted, you would only get 3 ac out of it though. He's saying you could wear the rhino armor and get charge ability out of it and wear the wild armor and get the armor out of it because the armors don't stack, you use the highest value.Thank you, grasshopper_ea; I appreciate your explanation.
I don't think it washes, though. Yes, you can wear two rings of protection, and take the better of the two deflection bonuses, because there are two slots on the humanoid body for rings. But you can't wear two pairs of boots and have both of them work. According to the Pathfinder rules: "Of course, a character may carry or possess as many items of the same type as he wishes. However, additional items beyond those in the slots listed above have no effect."
So, if I wear bracers of armor +2, any other bracers I try to wear over them have no effect, even if those new items would normally provide better armor. In the case of two items on one slot, it's not the better item that takes precedence , it's the first one on.
Armor is a body slot. Characters can don any number of magical suits of armor, but only the first one conveys any powers at all.
At least, I can't read any other interpretation of the rules.
Wearing padded armor +1 would be historically accurate but if you wore plate over it you still would only gain +9 to AC as no bonuses other than Dodge stack. So bracers of armor +1 would not stack with chainshirt as this has a +4 armor bonus, etc.
Hence if you cast Mage Armor when wearing bracers +1 you get a +4 armor bonus from the spell only, your AC doesn't improve by +5.|
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Spacelard, right. Multiple instances of the same type of bonus don't stack; they overlap. Multiple layers of armor might have some physical benefit. Padding under mail is a classic example.
But I had understood that we were talking about the magical properties of armor. In that case, only the first armor worn has any magical properties, because once it's on, the armor body slot is filled.
(Similarly, if your character were already wearing two magical rings,and he came across a ring of poison with a metal needle, he could wear that ring, the needle would still be a needle, but its magical poisoning properties wouldn't function.)
If a character wears padded gambeson +1, and then wears chainmail +5 over it, she would get the physical protection of padding and mail, and a +1 armor enhancement. (Not +5, because the armor body slot was already filled when she donned the chainmail, so its magical enhancements don't protect her.)
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If you can get a +3 amulet, consider merciful and vicious. Once someone's on-lethal damage exceeds their current hit points, they fall unconscious. The down side is this also applies to you. On the plus side, and healing spell will remove all non-lethal damage you take while healing your lethal damage too. Again, the downside is that this also applies to your opponenet.
Spacelard, right. Multiple instances of the same type of bonus don't stack; they overlap. Multiple layers of armor might have some physical benefit. Padding under mail is a classic example.
But I had understood that we were talking about the magical properties of armor. In that case, only the first armor worn has any magical properties, because once it's on, the armor body slot is filled.
(Similarly, if your character were already wearing two magical rings,and he came across a ring of poison with a metal needle, he could wear that ring, the needle would still be a needle, but its magical poisoning properties wouldn't function.)
If a character wears padded gambeson +1, and then wears chainmail +5 over it, she would get the physical protection of padding and mail, and a +1 armor enhancement. (Not +5, because the armor body slot was already filled when she donned the chainmail, so its magical enhancements don't protect her.)
Personally as a DM I would rule it the other way with the highest bonus out of the two applying only. I do understand where you are comming from about body slots perhaps I'm a bit kinder :)
PS Chris Mortika of Castle Greyhawk fame?