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Anticipation is high for the Pathfinder RPG release. Just read Jason's interview (found here) with some spoilers about changes in the Paladin's abilities. Looking forward to the new duration for Smite and showing "Mercy" to my companions. Hot damn, I may just try playing a Paladin for the first time since 1st Edition.
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I am really hoping that this whole backward compatibility crap doesn't ruin the game. I really liked the classes as presented in Beta. There is nothing in the Beta classes that are not already backwards compatible. A sorcerer in an old 3.x adventure is still a sorcerer in Pathfinder.
I am afraid that if they make as many changes backwards and not forward, then Beta will be the game of choice for those who have it.
Please, please, don't let them screw it all up and go back to crap when they had some good stuff. Please oh please!
I am really hoping that this whole backward compatibility crap doesn't ruin the game. I really liked the classes as presented in Beta. There is nothing in the Beta classes that are not already backwards compatible. A sorcerer in an old 3.x adventure is still a sorcerer in Pathfinder.
I am afraid that if they make as many changes backwards and not forward, then Beta will be the game of choice for those who have it.
Please, please, don't let them screw it all up and go back to crap when they had some good stuff. Please oh please!
So say we all
well most of us anyhow
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See, I am not so worried about backward compatibility. I think to the future! Go forwards, not backwards. In a few years the 3.x stuff will be a nightmare to find anyway.
I mean really, how often do you find new stuff made for 1E or 2E (yeah I know- no OGL but still)? How often do you even FIND stuff for 1E or 2E? Same thing here. Why cripple your rules by planning to make it support materials that very soon will be hard to find and obsolete anyway?
And changing class options and spells and such certainly do not affect compatibility at all. If I can take a Shadowrun adventure and run it in D&D then anyone who is DMing can make the changes from 3.x to Pathfinder. If not, really, they shouldn't be DMing as they obviously do not understand what they are doing- it isn't hard at all.
The biggest lead weight Pathfinder shouldered itself with was backwards compatibility. If the game sinks, this will be the reason.
The biggest lead weight Pathfinder shouldered itself with was backwards compatibility. If the game sinks, this will be the reason.
Let's say from the beginning they were not going to have "backwards compatibility" as one of goals of the system. I would imagine that the Pathfinder AP line and even the Modules would see a drastic drop in purchases as people don't want to get something that they can't use out of the box with Pathfinder RPG.
Then due to the small issues such as not being able to support all their employees they become drastically smaller and things become generally worse for them.
So it is my thought that if there wasn't backwards compatibility, then the game would have already sunk.
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But the thing is that even Beta IS backwards compatible. The same basic ruleset is used. To go backwards to support statblocks that will soon be obsolete is a bad idea I think.
And I have no doubt that Pathfinder would have been fine without that backwards stumble. People have been using Beta with 3.x and older adventures with no problems.
And I have no doubt that Pathfinder would have been fine without that backwards stumble. People have been using Beta with 3.x and older adventures with no problems.
But the Beta was still designed with the goal of backwards compatibility in mind. They tried some more extreme things, but nothing like they could have done if they were designing a new edition rather than a revision.
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I've noticed a fair amount of "Oh My God they're pulling all the cool stuff from the beta version in the final print" You don't suppose this is a few highly excitable people getting other highly excitable people, highly excited over speculation? Do you really think that Paizo is gonna take a knife and cut the sorcerer bloodlines out of the game because sorcerer PRC's listed in non core rulebooks from the 3.5 edition become obsolete? Do you really think they're gonna take away rage powers just because they are doing away with rage points? Actually I was surprised to see so many people cry out about this one seeing as Jason pretty much laid out what the final rage system will be a couple months ago. Do you really think they would put a new cover on the 3.5 SRD and charge $50 for it? Are things going to be changed and adjusted slightly. You bet. Will the final version of the PFRPG look and feel very close to the Beta. Well I could use a voice from on high, but even if the rule set slides a little back towards the traditional 3.5 concepts, it is still very likely the book will be more like the beta and less like the 3.5 SRD.
Now instead of running around proclaiming how much this is all gonna suck while gnashing your teeth and tearing your clothes, why don't you pop open the beta, order a pizza, invite your friends over and have FUN while waiting for August.
I have read two official interviews that Paizo has given and nothing I've read indicates the drastic changes people are decrying. If I have missed something vital please post a link. If not, move along, these aren't the droids you're looking for...
Some things never change.
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They call the period of time spent awaiting a highly anticipated product "The Silly Season" for a reason. Until we have all the final specifications, people will be people. And people speculate.
I must say, I'm enjoying this silly season much more than the one prior to the release of 4e. Actually probably haven't had this much fun since the Treo 700p silly season. Ahh, good times.
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I've noticed a fair amount of "Oh My God they're pulling all the cool stuff from the beta version in the final print" You don't suppose this is a few highly excitable people getting other highly excitable people, highly excited over speculation? Do you really think that Paizo is gonna take a knife and cut the sorcerer bloodlines out of the game because sorcerer PRC's listed in non core rulebooks from the 3.5 edition become obsolete? Do you really think they're gonna take away rage powers just because they are doing away with rage points? Actually I was surprised to see so many people cry out about this one seeing as Jason pretty much laid out what the final rage system will be a couple months ago. Do you really think they would put a new cover on the 3.5 SRD and charge $50 for it? Are things going to be changed and adjusted slightly. You bet. Will the final version of the PFRPG look and feel very close to the Beta. Well I could use a voice from on high, but even if the rule set slides a little back towards the traditional 3.5 concepts, it is still very likely the book will be more like the beta and less like the 3.5 SRD.
Now instead of running around proclaiming how much this is all gonna suck while gnashing your teeth and tearing your clothes, why don't you pop open the beta, order a pizza, invite your friends over and have FUN while waiting for August.
I have read two official interviews that Paizo has given and nothing I've read indicates the drastic changes people are decrying. If I have missed something vital please post a link. If not, move along, these aren't the droids you're looking for...
Actually, yes I do expect (hope) them to kill Bloodline powers. They have repeatedly said (one was an interview with Jason, another was from JJ on here) that the final version is closer to 3.5 and they are making the most changes to classes, skills and feats (and domains). So, if they are changing classes to be more like 3.5 classes then I do expect they will change sorcerer and barbarian powers.
I do NOT expect there to be huge changes, but still I liked them the way they were. Regardless I can live with whatever they choose. I can EASILY live with the sorcerer bloodlines gone though, and barbarian is not a favorite class for me, so whatever lol :) As long as the Cleric Rogue and Fighter are pretty close to Beta I will be happy. The other classes are fluff anyway! :)
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Actually, yes I do expect (hope) them to kill Bloodline powers. They have repeatedly said (one was an interview with Jason, another was from JJ on here) that the final version is closer to 3.5
Actually this is why I see them keeping bloodlines they are actually one of the more easy to revert back things (Remove bloodlines and you have a 3.5 sorcerer since Bloodlines were just added on) whereas domains and schools were modified from old systems and need to be revised to change them back.
Also just to add going by the first preview bloodlines are indeed still there.
Small Analysis: (page counts rough approximations)
Barbarian : 3 pagesBard : 4 pages
Cleric : 10 pages (!)
Druid : 7 pages
Fighter : 2 pages
Monk : 4 pages
Paladin : 4 pages
Ranger : 3 pages
Rogue : 3 pages
Sorcerer : 7 pages
Wizard : 9 pages (!)
Ok, so what does that tell us? Fighters are simple and straightforward, nothing new there.
They moved Domains to the classes chapter, which makes some sense, so that explains the 10 pages for clerics. Schools as well, which explains the 9 pages for wizards.
Druid's get 7 pages? They got 4 in Beta. That points to some serious changes, or else a lot of pictures. :)
And Sorcerer's get 7 as well. That argues strongly for the bloodlines being tweaked at most. Beta took about 7 pages as well, so doesn't look like they cut much out (unless, again, they added a bunch of pretty pictures, and as pretty as the Iconic Sorceress is, that might not be a bad thing either). :)
Well the nature based domains could be in the druid chapter, as well as the animal domain. as in the beats they could take one in place of the animal
I just looked there is 11 pages of domains, so taking that 3.5 ones may be longer or the same, I think they would have to split them to fit in the page count from above
Chief Creative Officer, Publisher
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But the thing is that even Beta IS backwards compatible. The same basic ruleset is used. To go backwards to support statblocks that will soon be obsolete is a bad idea I think.
And I have no doubt that Pathfinder would have been fine without that backwards stumble. People have been using Beta with 3.x and older adventures with no problems.
I honestly do not think you have much to worry about.
Also just to add going by the first preview bloodlines are indeed still there.
Woohoohooo!
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I believe that domain/school powers got rolled into the Classes chapter, hence the long entries for Wizard and Cleric.
But Druid... Now that's a good question. I vote for "element" powers replacing animal companion and/or wildshape. Speculate away !
Well if they use the new druid animal companion rules they previewed on the forums I could see that taking up the extra pages.
Ahh! Cool new stuff for Druids!
Druids were my favorite class in 3.x and I've kind of ignored them so far in Pathfinder because they didn't really get anything new. But now....
The Suspense is Killing Me!!!
I so want to hold one of these books in my arms and drool and salivate over every page.
Not sure that would work out for reusability :) Soggy pages don't last long
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Not sure that would work out for reusability :) Soggy pages don't last longAhh! Cool new stuff for Druids!
Druids were my favorite class in 3.x and I've kind of ignored them so far in Pathfinder because they didn't really get anything new. But now....
The Suspense is Killing Me!!!
I so want to hold one of these books in my arms and drool and salivate over every page.
Making a mental note to borrow Gamer Girrl's book and definitely not Count Buggula's...
:)
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But the thing is that even Beta IS backwards compatible. The same basic ruleset is used. To go backwards to support statblocks that will soon be obsolete is a bad idea I think.
And I have no doubt that Pathfinder would have been fine without that backwards stumble. People have been using Beta with 3.x and older adventures with no problems.
I honestly do not think you have much to worry about.
hehehe cool thanks! I liked the sneak peak today, that seemed to clarify a lot right there... so much can be learned from so little! lol
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Ahh! Cool new stuff for Druids!
Druids were my favorite class in 3.x and I've kind of ignored them so far in Pathfinder because they didn't really get anything new. But now....
The Suspense is Killing Me!!!
I so want to hold one of these books in my arms and drool and salivate over every page.
I loved the concept of the Druid, but it just lacked execution in 3.x I think Pathfinder will be better! Might finally pull be out of Fighter, Cleric, Rogue only classes.
And as much as I HATED bloodlines at first, they MIGHT get me to play a Sorcerer... maybe... as long as I can be a dwarf...