Half-Dragons- the Dragonblood subtype or the Dragon Type. What's better for them?

[Courrain]

Ever since the Dragonblood subtype debuted in the Races of the Dragon book, I have been wondering if Half-Dragons should really be considered as the base creature with the Dragonblood subtype instead of creatures having the Dragon type. Reason being that Half-Dragons are neither Dragons nor members of their original type, but both.

Now having the Dragonblood subtype means that they are still treated as Dragons with regards to being able to enter Dragon PrCs and using magic items meant specifically for Dragons. But at the same time, you are treated as a member of your original type. So not only can you be affected by spells and items that effect dragons, you are also affected by spells and items that can effect your original type as well. The biggest drawback to this subtype, however, is that you don't possess any of the Dragon type traits such as natural armor, natural weapons and some pretty decent immunities. You would have to expend feat slots to get back some of those traits. Personally I think should the subtype should be altered a bit to accomondate some of those traits. Ex. A saving bonus in place of the immunities.

On the Other Hand, having the Dragon type instead of the Dragonblood subtype is really appealing because it offers you a lot of advantages. But having this type for Half-Dragons would be more appropriate if you wanted them to resemble anthropomorphic dragons than a scaly version of the base creature.

Thoughts?

[DM_Blake]

Good point.

Even before Races of the Dragon, I already ruled that they didn't lose the type of their non-dragon race.

So a half-dragon elf was both an elf and a dragon, by my ruling.

The Subtype approach seems to solve this quite nicely.

[Turin the Mad]

Word it like it is for half-anything else - they share both type and subtypes as necessary to reflect their parentage.

Half-dragon would be (size) dragon (augmented humanoid [humanoid type]) as I understand the creature typing rules, for example.

[Courrain]

Turin the Mad wrote:

Word it like it is for half-anything else - they share both type and subtypes as necessary to reflect their parentage.

Half-dragon would be (size) dragon (augmented humanoid [humanoid type]) as I understand the creature typing rules, for example.

Actually a Half-Dragon Human, for instance, would be a Medium Dragon (augmented humanoid). They would lose the Human subtype. And by losing the Human subtype, the character in question gains an immunity to any spell that specifically targets humanoid such as Charm Person and Hold Person. This one of the things that makes Half-Dragons rather appealing as potential PCs. But IMO, I don't think this approach really reflects a Half-Dragon's hybrid nature though.

And btw, there are other subtypes that can be used to better reflect the hybrid natures of Half-giants and Half-fey. The Giantkin and Feyblood subtypes in Green Ronin's Advanced Bestiary.

[The Black Bard]

Ah, types and subtypes. Many a PC who plays a level adjusted character often asks me, "Why is this guy dishing out so much damage to me, and not to the rest of the party?"

I reply, "You're half-dragon. He's a ranger, with a favored enemy, and bane arrows....and a brain connected to his eyes."

The pendulum swings both ways. Consider that a half-elf, half-dragon, by virtue of their racial abilities, is technically vunerable to both Dragon bane and Humanoid (Elf) bane weapons. So imagine his terror (and motivation) when he finds out that his most dangerous rival has been asking around about the whereabouts of Razorleaf, an elven weapon created to oppose an incursion of deep dragons and drow. A +1 keen elfbane dragonbane longsword doesn't look like much pf a threat GP value-wise, until you start seeing +5 to hit, 17-20 threat range, and 1d8+5+4d6 base damage coming at you each swing.

[Turin the Mad]

Which is pretty much why I believe the PF Beta made pain to note that half-elf/orc/whatever was considered to be of both parents' races for purposes of all effects relating to them.

Far as I'm concerned, a half-dragon/half-humanoid should be vulnerable to a ranger with appropriate favored enemy types and bane weaponry as well as retaining their humanoid subtypes.

[Turin the Mad]

And of course I went and misread the OP. I had a stellar day yesterday lemme tell ya.

Yes, I concur - original creature type, dragonblood subtype. Or whatever equivalent has to be done for PFPRG.