The cleric gets 2 SLAs, one from each domain. This used to be one bonus spell per level.
The Wizard has roughly equivalent powers in Arcane Schools, which was also once a bonus spell per level, but he seems to acquire half the SLAs. Presuming the Cleric spells per day progression is on par with the Wizard's...
Isn't this imbalanced?
I think cleric's should loose 1 myself
I know everyone thinks wizards are too strong(?) but does anybody remember that they used to reach 9 castings per day? Maybe restoring 1 cast per level would do the trick.
The cleric gets 2 SLAs, one from each domain. This used to be one bonus spell per level.
The Wizard has roughly equivalent powers in Arcane Schools, which was also once a bonus spell per level, but he seems to acquire half the SLAs. Presuming the Cleric spells per day progression is on par with the Wizard's...
Isn't this imbalanced?
Wizards get 8 bonus spells of their choice and three or four special abilities. Clerics get 10 bonus spells not of their choice and four special abilities. Sounds about the same, IMO.
I have no wish to touch anyone core spellcasting ability's. And wish folks would get off the nerf the wizard kick. The cleric however gets solid casting and boatloads of other things. So bringing them in a small bit would be fine
Wizards get 8 bonus spells of their choice and three or four special abilities. Clerics get 10 bonus spells not of their choice and four special abilities. Sounds about the same, IMO.
Yes.
And half of those bonus spells they can't choose are Obscuring Mist ;-)
Contributor, RPG Superstar 2008 Top 4, Legendary Games
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Wizards get 8 bonus spells of their choice and three or four special abilities. Clerics get 10 bonus spells not of their choice and four special abilities. Sounds about the same, IMO.Yes.
And half of those bonus spells they can't choose are Obscuring Mist ;-)
Ba-dum-bum rim shot
PS - Smurf
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Wizards get 8 bonus spells of their choice and three or four special abilities. Clerics get 10 bonus spells not of their choice and four special abilities. Sounds about the same, IMO.The cleric gets 2 SLAs, one from each domain. This used to be one bonus spell per level.
The Wizard has roughly equivalent powers in Arcane Schools, which was also once a bonus spell per level, but he seems to acquire half the SLAs. Presuming the Cleric spells per day progression is on par with the Wizard's...
Isn't this imbalanced?
i agree
its quite equal
Wizards get 8 bonus spells of their choice and three or four special abilities. Clerics get 10 bonus spells not of their choice and four special abilities. Sounds about the same, IMO.
Except look at the relative trades. The wizard's specialist bonus spell is considerable LESS flexible than the previous spell/ level and gained a level later. This is mitigated by the special abilities. The cleric's previously had 9 domain spells and they could choose one of two spells to fill those 9 slots. The domain powers seem to me to be significantly better than the 1/level bonus slot.
So Wizard Specialization == push
Clerics Domains == net gain in power
Both wizards and clerics got other power ups too -- Channel improvements, arcane bond... It's hard to say.
*shrug*
In general, I'd say that an equally onerous problem is all of these new SLAs to keep track of. Managing a wizard or cleric came with enough paperwork— I feel like this adds to it by giving them a bunch of "non-spell" abilities...
I'm still waiting to hear a rationale for these changes. Otherwise I simply can't say whether they are working as intended. By all of my metrics, new Domains and School Powers are not worth the change— and I am wondering am I missing something? What was the catastrophe that made this rather hefty change necessary?
Except look at the relative trades. The wizard's specialist bonus spell is considerable LESS flexible than the previous spell/ level and gained a level later. This is mitigated by the special abilities. The cleric's previously had 9 domain spells and they could choose one of two spells to fill those 9 slots. The domain powers seem to me to be significantly better than the 1/level bonus slot.
Note also that the cleric's level 12, 16 and 20 bonus spells are not that great (a bonus level 5 spell at class level 12, a bonus level 7 spell at class level 16 and a bonus level 9 spell at class level 20); they're not the cleric's highest spell level and the wizard's spells are.
I don't think it's clear cut that clerics are better off.
Also the level and/or usefulness of the spells seems to vary with uses per day, original spell list and the quality of the supernatural powers.
You forgot "the phase of the moon". ;-)
Except look at the relative trades. The wizard's specialist bonus spell is considerable LESS flexible than the previous spell/ level and gained a level later. This is mitigated by the special abilities. The cleric's previously had 9 domain spells and they could choose one of two spells to fill those 9 slots. The domain powers seem to me to be significantly better than the 1/level bonus slot.Note also that the cleric's level 12, 16 and 20 bonus spells are not that great (a bonus level 5 spell at class level 12, a bonus level 7 spell at class level 16 and a bonus level 9 spell at class level 20); they're not the cleric's highest spell level and the wizard's spells are.
I don't think it's clear cut that clerics are better off.
No, it's definitely not as cut and dried as it appears at first (2 versus 1).
Some of the domains 12th level powers are quite decent. Travel domain gets DDoor 3 times per day. I suppose that's only a 4th level power but it's a very nice spell outside the clerics normal list. Overall though 3 4th level spells versus what was previously a 6th level spell... hard to say.
This is the kind of thing I might like to see mentioned in a Sidebar. Along with the reason for the rule.