Alright, ive seen how 4th ed handles skills, ive seen 3.0, ive seen 3.5, and ive seen Pathfinder. Ive seen and heard to arguments for and against skill condensation, and i believe i have an argument and a solution, i will detail below what i think.
First, skill condensation is BAD. The more i see it the more the skill list begins to look like this to me:
Strength Skill: 4 ranks
Intelligence Skill: 7 ranks
Wisdom Skill: 4 ranks
Etc...
and Why not go further?
Social Skill:
Physical Skill:
Mental Skill:
This is absolutly abhorent to me, to condense skills too much. Now, there are a few areas i think that actually to need to be condense, but not many, below i will show and explain how i think each skill should be handled, as well as how many skill points each class should get:
(All of these would receive (Int + x)x4 a first level, im bucking the system pathfinder deceided to go with, it is an arbitrary change)
Barbarian: 6 + int
Bard: 8 + int
Cleric: 4 + int
Druid: 6 + int
Fighter: 4 + int
Monk: 6 + int
Paladin: 4 + int
Ranger: 8 + int
Rogue: 10 + int
Sorcerer: 4 + int
Wizard: 4 + int
(See the pattern?)
Also, i think it would be cool to allow each PC/class to flattly pick 2-3 skills that become class skills for them.
Appraise (int): unchanged
Balance (dex): Balance and tumble are rolled into one skill, Acrobatics, considering suggesting that jump be added to this, but i LOATHE the idea of so many different things being rolled into one
Consentration (wis): Consentration becomes a wisdom skill, and ALL classes have it as a class skill.
Climb: unchanged
Craft (int): unchanged
Decipher Script (int): unchanged
Diplomacy (cha): Unchanged. Diplomacy, Intimidate, and Bluff can all produce similar outcomes, but they a.) all do it in different ways and b.) all have their own seperate and dependant mechanics, i.e.: feint
Disable Device: Disable Device now includes open lock
Disguise (cha): Unchanged, sorry. Disguise, forgery, move silently, and hide ALL being put into one skill is insane.
Escape Artist (dex): unchanged.
Gather Info (cha): Consider putting this into bluff, intimidate, and diplomacy; each of those skills has the capacity to gather information in their own unique style.
Handle Animal (cha): Put this into knowledge nature. If you know about nature you probably know how to handle animals. OR, put "ride" into handle animal. The latter is probably the better call.
Heal (wis)/(int): Unchanged except for maybe it being either wis or int.
Hide (dex): Hide and movesilently are combined into stealth. Almost never does some one just need to hide, or move silently. Usually people who take these skills want to "sneak" and sneaking require you be hidden and move silently.
Intimidate (Cha/str): Unchanged except that gather information is also within it, and str can be substituted for charisma.
Jump (str/dex): Unchanged, except that dex can replace its core attribute.
Knowledge (int): Unchanged, except that of the aforementioned change to handle animal. Also think about putting spell craft inside knowledge arcana.
Listen (wis): Unchanged, "perception" is convoluted, unpopular, and messier than just having spot listen and search. (they all remain unchanged)
Move silently (dex): Combined into hide, to form stealth
Open Lock (dex): put into disable device.
Ride (dex): Already discussed
Search (int)/(wis): remain unchanged, but give it the option of being a wisdom skill.
Sense Motive (wis): unchanged
Sleight of Hand (dex): put "use rope" into this.
Spell Craft (int) already discussed.
Spot (wis): Already discussed, remains unchanged.
Survival (wis): Make this applicable to a specific knowledge, (planes, nature, dungeoneering), or keep it as is.
Swim (str)/(dex): Unchanged, sorry. Im good at swimming, im horrible at climbing; its not the same skill.
Tumble (dex): Remains unchanged, but also includes balance within itself.
Use magic device (cha?): Dunno what to do with this one
Use rope: nixed off, see sleight of hand.
What do people think of this break down? Please give REASONS for why you do and do not like or agree with something ive postulated.
Perception is convoluted and messy?
Asking my PCs for a spot or listen check prompts a certain amount of unconcious metagaming, unless I remember to occasionally do it when nothing is there so as to make them not assume the check means something actually is there. Perception has such specific modifiers that I actually feed the PCs more info by asking for their check, because I have to ask for the specific "type" of sense they are using.
Granted, I can record the PCs spot/listen modifiers and make the checks for them. I need a tiny post it note. But again, Perception has so many conditional modifiers based on what your perceiving, that I would need a larger post it note for the average party. And even then, I run a greater risk of missing one here or there, and creating strife in the party when they realize had I remembered it they would have noticed the thing that prompted the check.
Summary: I find that Perception, while solving some corner case situational problems, actually exacerbates some of the more common problems that already exist
Perception is convoluted and messy?
Well lets see, there are bonuses to perception specificly for... listening, hearing, tasting, and smelling. So ya. It actually leads to more pencil work than just keeping spot and listen and search their own skills.
I just dont get why so many people think Perception is a clunky skill. It is pretty straightforward and keeping track of a minor racial ability such as +2 to hearing and touch is easy. Been keeping track of such things in many other systems where you have Perception/Alertness skill and often advantages or disadvanatages covering each individual sense.
Lacking a solid system of advantages and disadvantages, Perception as a skill makes sense. Actual average range of senses is fairly narrow for humans (the base of the game), meaning that Perception is more accurately Alertness (how much attention the character pays to their surroundings) with a bonus for sharper than average sense via feats or race.
-Weylin Stormcrowe
I vote completely and wholeheartedly for this solution!