This idea sprang to mind, and I admit I hadn't thought of it while perusing the Alphas, so it may be already covered and I missed it unintentionally. But here we go.
Counterspell has, in the heavy majority of my 3.0/3.5 experience, been a nearly useless ability. Few spellcasters see the utility in sacrificing their own ability to control the battlefield or damage enemies in order to prevent the enemy from doing just that. There seems to be some sort of passive/agressive break point, and counterspell is often it. Until the Spell Compendium and a spell within it that enabled counterspelling as an immediate action, it was limited to casters who already happened to have a dispel magic prepared and were both not expecting to need it for something "more important", and just plain bored with blasting enemies.
Here are some ideas I figured I'd throw out to the Paizo Masses.
1. Counterspell becomes an actual spell, 1 level lower than Dispel Magic and Greater Dispel Magic, but functioning exactly like the counterspell option of Dispel Magic.
1a. Counterspell, as a spell, has a casting time of immediate? Too powerful, or just right? Return it to same level as dispel magic with this option?
2. Sorcerors gain a "spontaneous counterspell" class feature, similar to option 1, but in that they spontaneously convert a spell slot into a rampant snarl of magical energy to "bugger up" an enemy spell (using the Dispel Magic rules for counterspelling). Again, determining if this is a immediate action or not might still be the deal breaker, but it certainly gives Sorcerors an interesting tactical option, and makes them extremely attractive, at least in my eyes, relative to wizards. Of course, if any level of spell could be sacrificed, the maximum caster level bonus on the counterspell roll would have to be appropriately adjusted for the level of spell. Perhaps they could get a maximum bonus equal to the spell level x2+1? That means the bonus caps right before getting the next level of spells.
So, does this have any merit? Or am I just passing mental gas again?
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I had plenty of counterspelling fun. Improved Counterspell, Battlemagic Perception, and Mastery of Counterspelling for the win. :)
I wish I was still playing that character when Distracting Ray and Duelward came out in Spell Compendium. Though Battlemagic Perception and Duelward aren't that much different.
Anyway, I don't think we need new spells, I think Dispel Magic just needs to be improved for counterspelling. I'm against a counterspell being an immediate action without a spell or a feat, and if it's a feat then Improved Counterspell should be a prereq for it.
It's way too powerful an ability IMHO.
we always used any spell of the same school or equal level or higher could be used.
Hmm, while Improved Counterspell is now an SRD feat (which I apparently missed at some point) I think my origional sentiment is still valid. Trip, grapple, and disarm are all valid tactical options, even without the feats that make you really good at them. The fact that counterspell seems to require a feat to be even valid, much less reliable, strikes me as a weakness of design.
Everything else you mentioned is splatbook, and again I find it poor design if a core rules mechanic requires splatbook help to shine.
Moar comments! Add your 2 cents to the change jar!
I don't know, while I'd like to see some improvement on counter spells. I've always found readying an attack spell worked just as well.
Stone Rain FTW!
The problem is that counterspelling is rarely as useful as casting a Readied magic missile considering that few characters can pass the concentration check.
The only time anyone in my gaming experience has ever counterspelled was when we tried out Monte Cook's "Brandish Magical Might" feat (which is like Spell Penetration, Greater Spell Penetration, Super-Awesome Spell Penetration, and Improved Counterspell without needing to use a spell at all, all rolled into one -- it's the most broken feat ever devised). So, Monte's feat was disallowed into perpetuity, but that left counterspelling in the dust heap again.
I'd like to see sorcerers be able to spontaneously counterspell using any spell slot of the same or higher level. That would go a long way towards preserving the viablility of the tactic, and of pleasing the many "why isn't the new sorcerer super uber enough" people.
I'd make a counterspell an immediate action instead of having to sit there with an action readied, but with a chance of wasting your spell if you fail your Spellcraft check. Specifically:
Counterspells
It is possible to cast any spell as a counterspell. By doing so, you are using the spell’s energy to disrupt the casting of the same spell by another character. Counterspelling works even if one spell is divine and the other arcane.
How Counterspells Work
To use a counterspell, announce your intent to do so when an opponent starts to cast a spell. The Dungeon Master will make a Spellcraft check for you (DC 15 + the spell’s level). This check is a free action. If the check succeeds, the Dungeon Master will correctly identify the opponent’s spell. If the check fails by less than five, you do not identify the spell and cannot attempt a counterspell. If you fail by more than five, you misidentify the spell; the DM will tell you what spell you think the opponent is casting.
To then counterspell, you must then cast the correct spell as an immediate action. As a general rule, a spell can only counter itself. If you are able to cast the same spell and you have it prepared (if you prepare spells), you cast it, altering it slightly to create a counterspell effect. If the target is within range, both spells automatically negate each other with no other results.
If you misidentified the target spell on your Spellcraft check, your counterspell automatically fails, expending your spell to no effect. This occurs even if the spell you used as a counterspell would normally counter the target spell, such as with the Improved Counterspell feat.
Counterspelling Metamagic Spells
Metamagic feats are not taken into account when determining whether a spell can be countered
Specific Exceptions
Some spells specifically counter each other, especially when they have diametrically opposed effects.
Dispel Magic as a Counterspell
You can use dispel magic to counterspell another spellcaster, and you don’t need to identify the spell he or she is casting. However, dispel magic doesn’t always work as a counterspell.
Blocking someone else's spell should not be an immediate, swift, or free action - you're countering their standard action, and it should require something similar.
That said, perhaps there needs to be an immediate version of a standard action. An immediate action is a swift action you use up from your next round (as a reaction). An immed-standard action would be a standard action you use up from your next round - so counter, but you've only got a move action your next turn.
I could perhaps see counter-spelling as *this* sort of action, by default when you have the actual spell prepared/known, and make the spellcraft check. (i.e. Someone casts Hold Person, you know/have Hold Person, and can counter, but lose your standard action on your next turn.)
It adds a new type of action, but I think it's a useful one - the Unearthed Arcana suggestion of allowing Total Defense action to be used in this manner also fits with it.
As for improving counterspelling - it's tough. It's actually a fairly powerful thing to do (and - proudly - I just used it a few weeks ago - 3 times in a row!) - but works best when you have another spellcaster to blast while you counter. See nothing wrong with Sorcerers getting it cheaply - perhaps in particular as a bloodline option.
The big problem I see with counterspelling is not so much that it's weak as that it's passive. It's much more fun to cast spells than to ready-and-counter, whatever the tactical implications. Being able to "borrow" your next standard action (call it an interrupt action?) to counter goes partway to resolving this (at least you aren't standing around readied), but not all the way (it costs you your chance to do something, instead of just react). Thus my preference for an immediate action.
I agree that it looks unbalanced to counter a standard action with an immediate action. I think it works okay anyway – you spend an immediate action to counter, then when you cast your spell, the NPC spends an immediate to counter you, you both burn through spells at two a round bouncing magic back and forth like a tennis match — but I don't have extensive playtest experience to report on it.
2. Sorcerors gain a "spontaneous counterspell" class feature, similar to option 1, but in that they spontaneously convert a spell slot into a rampant snarl of magical energy to "bugger up" an enemy spell (using the Dispel Magic rules for counterspelling). Again, determining if this is a immediate action or not might still be the deal breaker, but it certainly gives Sorcerors an interesting tactical option, and makes them extremely attractive, at least in my eyes, relative to wizards. Of course, if any level of spell could be sacrificed, the maximum caster level bonus on the counterspell roll would have to be appropriately adjusted for the level of spell. Perhaps they could get a maximum bonus equal to the spell level x2+1? That means the bonus caps right before getting the next level of spells.
I had just posted in the other counterspell thread that I thought making counterspells into actual spells would give sorcerers too much of an advantage over wizards as far as counterspelling goes, but now that I think about it, your second idea (which I hadn't read when I posted my idea in that thread <grin>) would be a nice way to give sorcerer's a boost which, even with the bloodlines, they still need in comparison to wizards.
I think the immediate action may be a bit too good, and would also suggest that you require the sorcerer to give up a spell slot of equal or higher level than the spell being cast to even have a chance of countering. If he/she makes the free-action spellcraft check to identify a spell as it's being cast, great, he/she knows exactly what to burn. If not, they may have to spend their highest level slot and hope it's enough.