RPG Superstar 2010 Top 32
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They're under Parrot Island at the minute but so far it's easy going. Seems almost ... too easy. Although only second level, a combination of sneaky, clever players and Action Points meant that it wasn't until seven zombies and the huecuva entered the equation that one of them was even injured - for the first time in the AP!
Should I let them enjoy it for now or turn the screws slightly?
There are 5 players and I added a few zombies to each encounter and gave the huecuva an extra level. An action point to replicate "Sudden maximise" and he got hammered with a maximised Silent Sound spell. With 24 points of sonic damage - who cares about needing a silver weapon? Yes it's a one-off but it's also a taste of things to come. Will it sort itself out as the levels begin to get longer after third and so on, or should I worry a little?
Sounds like you're using the action points from UA. Those are too powerful, IMHO, and I'd limit them.
In fact, I do.
We play in Greyhawk, with Eberron style action points. Even those take a lot of the sting out of a bad dice roll, and as DM I do everything in my power to make my players waste their points. Once they are down to one or two action points left, they get a lot more tense, and play much more conservatively.
Creative Director
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We built Savage Tide (and the adventure paths before it) to assume a party of four players using mostly just material from the core books, but we built the adventures to be HARD for that group. The hope was that while it would still work for a core party of four, the adventure would still work for larger parties and for parties that use non-core materials, like Action Points.
If you (as most DMs) allow non-core options and have a party of more than four, you'll find that parts of the adventure are indeed too easy. Since you're just starting the campaign, I recomend that you let things go for now; 1st level PCs need all the help they can get. If you find that the advenutres are constantly too easy, though, you should certainly start adjusting things as appropriate in your adventure. A good general rule is to let the monsters use any of the non-core mechanics the PCs use.
Of course, monsters can get really rough once they have action points, since they can effectively blow all of their action points in a few rounds of combat and don't have to worry about conserving them over the course of a much longer span of time...
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Creative Director
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There are 5 players and I added a few zombies to each encounter and gave the huecuva an extra level. An action point to replicate "Sudden maximise" and he got hammered with a maximised Silent Sound spell. With 24 points of sonic damage - who cares about needing a silver weapon? Yes it's a one-off but it's also a taste of things to come. Will it sort itself out as the levels begin to get longer after third and so on, or should I worry a little?
As for this version of Action Points... yeah, I think that's a bit too much. Adventures are built with certain expectations in mind, and since a maximized spell is 3 levels higher than its normal level, most adventures aren't ready to handle a maximized spell until they're for 7th level PCs or so. Similarly, allowing flight or resurrection or teleporation effects earlier than their classic "level breaks" can make an adventure too easy.
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RPG Superstar 2010 Top 32
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I know it's a tough AP and they spent so much time on backstories, I thought I'd try action points for the first time. I've told them I'll review the whole thing around third level when they have to make the points stretch for a more reasonable length of time.
In the meantime, I'll upp the odds slightly but not too much, let them get settled in.
I know it's a tough AP and they spent so much time on backstories, I thought I'd try action points for the first time. I've told them I'll review the whole thing around third level when they have to make the points stretch for a more reasonable length of time.
In the meantime, I'll upp the odds slightly but not too much, let them get settled in.
While not playing this AP yet, I am working on SCAP. My players use the UA version of action points, but I do limit it to 5 per level period, not an increasing number as the level increases. In the few months I have played with them, this seems to mean that their effect is decreased somewhat as the levels increase and they need them less. This lets me worry less about silly deaths at lower levels and adds a 'cool factor' at mid to higher levels as they can pull something out of there butts if necessary to save them.
Honestly, while they can be used to emulate a feat, since it has to be one the players already meet the prereqs for, the point is more often used to add to a die roll on a save or attack or used to stabilize. At 5 period per level I have not found them to be broken, though I do tend ot adjust difficulty up a tiny bit in some cases.
I've used Action Points from the start on this AP and my group just finished ToD. First off you can't replicate a metamagic feat with an AP. If you have a metamagic feat you can apply it on the spot for an AP, but you can't replicate one you do not have. At least if I remember correctly. I have also house ruled that you can't use an AP to apply a metamagic feat if that would put the spell at a higher level than you can cast normally (e.i apply maximize to fireball if you can only cast 3rd level spells). Secondly I have found the mileage varies depending on characters so I have some characters that have over 20 APs saved up (something I plan to remedy) and some that are at almost zero. I think as written APs are a bit too powerful. I like the flavor of them and plan to modify them for my new game. My new plan to to give out a flat 5 AP points per level. The max you can have at any point in time is 5 + 1/2 your level. If gaining a level would put you over your max then you only acrew enough to put you at your max. I don't know if this will work since I'm just starting to try it, but it should be better than as written.
Oh bugger!
I’m a little worried about our campaign now as I’ve got six players, 32 point buy, action points (the Eberron version) and allowed them to take the district feat as a freebie!
Whoopsy! And half the group are +1 LA (goliath, and two genasi)
:O
After the battering the group took in AoW's (a record amount of PC deaths which almost made two players give up on the campaign completely) -I decided to be a bit nicer to them. Hope I haven't been too nice!
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RPG Superstar 2010 Top 32
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Thanks for the insights and advice!
Yeah, I think I'll have to limit the old APs.
The 'Emulate Feat' ability just says you have to meet the prerequisites of the feat you choose. There's no explicit exception made for metamagic feats. Sudden maximise is a once-a-day feat from Complete Arcane that has no prerequisites and doesn't change the level of the spell either. To be fair, the player had kept back his best spell for a special moment and the apearance of Veldimar Krund and his Death Touch was certainly such a moment!
The players did say it was a good fight, I just thought they didn't seem to 'suffer' enough considering the victory they won. Still, when they discover that Vanthus has locked them in (they made sure he couldn't do it when they first went in - they're good like that) I may find a few more zombies to worry at their heels.
I'll change the croc to a carrion crawler in the Lotus hideout and give a few rogues a sorcerer level too (that will keep the spellthief happy). After the Lotus Den we'll have a serious chat.
I'll change the croc to a carrion crawler in the Lotus hideout and give a few rogues a sorcerer level too (that will keep the spellthief happy). After the Lotus Den we'll have a serious chat.
As a slight thread jack. I have a spelltheif in my group as well. It's the first time we have used the class so we are all getting used to it. What it seems though is that there is not a lot to "steal" in the first few adventures.
Oh and I swear I read somewhere that it didn't work on metamagic feats, but maybe I just assumed that because of it's description of use under the metamagic feat section.
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RPG Superstar 2010 Top 32
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He was going to get the Shield of Faith off the huecuva (I described it as a sort of oil slick all over him - he immediately wanted one) but before he could try it, the ultrasonic blast did its work!
It seems like a cool class - at least with the Action points she should be around long enough to try out all the abilities.
I just had something you might want to consider. Are you giving action points to important baddies? (Like a Hecueva with Cleric levels?) It has been said by other DMs on this board that whatever you give the players, you should at least give to significant NPC villains.
I don't know if it would have made a difference in this encounter, but you might consider giving some of the NPCs action points to use against the players. It will keep them on their toes and help to balance things a bit.
I don't use action points, but the d20 SRD put the standard at 1/2 the NPC level.
Just something to think about.