I've seen some similar pleas out there before, but nevertheless I wanted to ask one more time.
Based on some holiday gift cards etc., I am in a position to purchase a new D&D book or three. Currently I own the core rulebooks and DMG II. There are so many supplements out there, it's hard to wade through sometimes. So I'm looking for suggestions.
If you had to buy just one (or two) books, which would they be? I play as both DM and PC. Would you recommend different books for each facet? Are there books that you consider a must-have regardless of use by DM or player? Are supplement books a waste of money and I should buy something for my wife instead? Thanks for the thoughts. Happy 2007!
1) Subscriptions to Dungeon (first) and Dragon (second) if you don't already have them.
2) Players Handbook 2 is particularly good.
3) Spell Compendium is an extremely useful book if you have lots of casters, but your game won't suffer too much for lack of it.
4) Shackled City Adventure Path - a full year's gameplay in one easy package.
5) Lords of Madness, Fiendish Codex I, Fiendish Codex II, Draconomicon, Libris Mortis*. All very useful for DMs. (My order of recommendation is as-given.)
6) Frostburn, Sandstorm, Stormwrack (can't speak for Cityscape). All also very useful for DMs. (My order of recommendation is as-given.)
There are many many more good books. But those would be my top recommendations, without knowing anything more about what sort of games you like. (In particular, I would recommend staying away from "Complete X" unless you can afford a full set of Warrior/Arcane/Divine/Adventurer. Even then, I would argue that the money could be better spent elsewhere.)
* Libris Mortis is probably the weakest of the 'Monster' books. However, it works particularly well with "Heroes of Horror" and "Book of Vile Darkness" to create a very dark Ravenloft/horror campaign.
What I would buy (If it were me) was as a DM I would get anoter monster manual. You can never have too many monsters to throw at your party. As a player it would have to be a toss up between any one of the race series or complete series.
Just my 2 cents.
Have fun with whatever you get.
Later
1) Subscriptions to Dungeon (first) and Dragon (second) if you don't already have them.
2) Players Handbook 2 is particularly good.
Thanks Delericho. Good thoughts. I've been considering a subscription to Dragon for sure, but I haven't decided on that one.
Interesting to hear that PHB II is good in your opinion. DMG II has some good bits (like mob rules) but overall I wasn't that impressed (sorry James). How does PHB II compare? Is it mostly solid or does it just have a few tidbits in it that make it worth it to you?
I'm also interested in your opinion about the Complete series. They look like they're full of interesting stuff, but since I'm really the only one of our group interested in buying all this kind of stuff I wasn't sure that they're worth it. I mean it might help my game as a player, but probably wouldn't really enrich my DMing would it?
Anyway, thanks for the suggestions.
As a DM:
1.) Monster Manual III. Lots of fun goodies in this one, plus the helpful sidebars of "In Eberron" and "In Faerun", if that's your thing.
2.) Lords of Madness. So much tasty tidbits in here for villains and bad guys of the aberration bent.
3.) Subs to Dungeon and Dragon mags. :)
As a Player:
1.) Spell Compendium. Awfully useful, not to mention a good way to switch up from the standard-issue spell lists.
2.) Player's Handbook II. The rebuild quest ideas are in here, which is quite useful. There is a lot of stuff that helps out with character concepts and team-related skills and feats.
As a DM or Player:
New Dice. You can never have too many dice. :)
As far as the "Complete" books are concerned...I like them, but I don't feel they necessarily enhance the game from a DM standpoint. They feel very player-focused to me. I would recommend the Fiendish Codices over the Complete books, if it came to that.
It seems as if everyone has different opinions.
I consider the first four of the complete books to be extremly good. Thats where I would start. after that Players Handbook II was pretty sweet as well. I think that the feats in Players Handbook II did Three things that I liked.
One they added a bunch of good basic options that allowed one to fine tune characters in a number of ways.
Two they added a slew of feats for really powerful characters - for example there are some phenominally powerful feats in there with prerequisites of +15 or +18 BAB. In other words if your an 18th level fighter you can pick up this uber killer feat. I feel this really helps out with fighters particualrly where one might start to feel a little limited in feat choices when your trying to pick out your 15th feat at high level.
Three, they put in some feats that would help to balance some of the more unbalancing effects in the game. So if your players are always disarming yoru bad guys there is likely a feat in there that will help your bad guy keep his weapon.
Certianly if you combine Players Handbook II with the Complete Books your going to have a lot of choice. My only concern with the Players Handbook II is that it did come out after the Complete Books and it did stuff that they didn't do. In other words I think Players Handbook II somewhat built upon the Complete Series even if, in theory, the Complete Books are not required to use Players Handbook II.
Otherwise I liked the Monster Manual III and Fiendish Codex I a lot.
Maybe you should be asking which books people did not like? Possibly you would get more consensus.
Interesting to hear that PHB II is good in your opinion. DMG II has some good bits (like mob rules) but overall I wasn't that impressed (sorry James). How does PHB II compare? Is it mostly solid or does it just have a few tidbits in it that make it worth it to you?
My impression of DMG2 was about the same as yours. Although it would have been of a lot more use to a newer DM, IMO.
PHB2 is completely different. It contains a huge amount of stuff I immediately added to my game - new classes, variant class features (trade your Wizard's Familar for a different ability called Immediate Magic, for example), and lots of new feats (especially high-level Fighter feats, something lacking from the game to date). There are also chapters on building backgrounds, using affiliations, and rebuilding your character, but I found these less useful. Basically, just over 50% of the book was immediately slated for addition to my game, which is a very very high percentage.
I'm also interested in your opinion about the Complete series. They look like they're full of interesting stuff, but since I'm really the only one of our group interested in buying all this kind of stuff I wasn't sure that they're worth it. I mean it might help my game as a player, but probably wouldn't really enrich my DMing would it?
Exactly my opinion. The major utility seen by the Complete series in my games is in the prestige classes my players use. However, since each character only ever has one or two PrCs, and since campaigns last a year or so on average, these books don't really see enough use for their price tag, IMO.
And there is virtually nothing in them for DMs.
(The reason I said to only get them if you get the full set is so that all classes are represented equally. These books up the power level in the game a bit, and it's best to up it for all characters together. This is why I haven't bought Complete Mage - I'll probably get it, but not until all four books in the series are out.)
If you want a good choice that supports both DM and player roles, I actually prefer the Races series over the Complete series. I also really like the various environmental books (Frostburn, Sandstorm, and Stormwrack) for this same reason and have high hopes for Cityscape.
On the "Don't Like" list, Libris Mortis is, unfortunately, at the top of my pile. I was really hoping it would be a great book after what we got with Draconomicon but overall the material was just "meh" and the book is riddled with errors.
Maybe you should be asking which books people did not like? Possibly you would get more consensus.
I generally try not to remember the books I really disliked. Plus, Wizards have had a really good year - the only book I actively disliked (that I bought) was "Scourge of the Howling Horde" for various reasons.
Going back a bit, I really dislike "Book of Exalted Deeds", "Deities and Demigods" and the "Epic Level Handbook". "Heroes of Battle" also got a very poor initial reaction from me, but I think I perhaps misjudged it as it was released just as the Dungeon adventure "Foundations of Flame" did the same thing better IMO.
I generally try not to remember the books I really disliked. Plus, Wizards have had a really good year - the only book I actively disliked (that I bought) was "Scourge of the Howling Horde" for various reasons.Going back a bit, I really dislike "Book of Exalted Deeds", "Deities and Demigods" and the "Epic Level Handbook". "Heroes of Battle" also got a very poor initial reaction from me, but I think I perhaps misjudged it as it was released just as the Dungeon adventure "Foundations of Flame" did the same thing better IMO.
OK this might not work either. I loved Book of Exalted Deeds while readily admitting that it has major play balance issues. If used with care I felt it adds a lot to good characters and I like having nice stuff for good characters. Makes playing Chaotic Neutral less appealing. But stuff like Touch of Golden Ice and Vow of Poverty simply do not belong in the game IMO any more then the Frenzied Berserker should be allowed to players (DMs should be allowed to use Frenzied Berserkers to their hearts content however).
Otherwise I don't have any of the others you disliked. I'll say I was underwhelmed by Monster Manual II. I was not that impressed with the Book of Vile Darkness. Mainly I just found all the options in that book to be, well weak. I don't want my Villains to pansy around with my players - I want them to earn me a TPK and the stuff in Book of Vile Darkness just does not cut the mustard.
I was less then impressed with Heros of Horror. Most of the book relied on an introduced taint system. If you did not want to use taint then more then half the book was right out at that moment. There was some interesting ideas regarding running horror campaigns but I felt that it was presented badly. It was done in an everything but the kitchen sink approach. I feel a DM that simply went cherry picking through the ideas as they where presented would wind up with a horror campaign that felt disjointed and inauthentic. Sort of like tacking Friday the 13th onto Psycho and using the ending for Rosemary's Baby. There are different types of horror game and they don't usually mix very well.
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If you are the DM, than (I don't know if I am allowed to say that here - if not, feel free to delete this post) PTOLUS is the definite book to buy. You might have to spent all the money for one book, instead of buying three of them, but, man, this is the best buy I ever did!
If you are a player, than PH2 is a good buy, as there's a lot of stuff to use. As well as The COMPLETE ADVENTURER, where a lot of fresh ideas are to be found!!!
I personally can't wait to get my hands on COMPLETE SCOUNDREL as I hope there's a lot of usefull stuff in it to get more fun out of my games!
Jeremy, I don't mind differing opinions. I prefer them! I'm nothing if not opinionated myself, so I appreciate a variety of viewpoints and having them backed up with vigor. I'm going to make up my own mind anyway, so having the opinions of the supporters and detractors helps me out.
Lilith, I just bought a new set of dice, so I've covered that base for the moment. In a fit of madness I purchased a set of stainless steel dice. They have a very reassuring heft to them, though I haven't tried them out in game just yet. I'm a little worried that I may leave dents in my friend's coffee table. :)
So, most everyone seems to agree that PHB II is pretty worth it. Despite my appreciation for a difference of opinion stated above, I can recognize a strong recommendation when I read one. Duly noted, thanks!
Lilith, I just bought a new set of dice, so I've covered that base for the moment. In a fit of madness I purchased a set of stainless steel dice. They have a very reassuring heft to them, though I haven't tried them out in game just yet. I'm a little worried that I may leave dents in my friend's coffee table. :)
Ohh, neat! You may want to take a piece of felt with you - leaving dents in your host's table may not be cool!
As a DM:
Lords of Madness. So much tasty tidbits in here for villains and bad guys of the aberration bent.As a Player:
1.) Spell Compendium. Awfully useful, not to mention a good way to switch up from the standard-issue spell lists.
The lady fair of the message boards makes a winning suggestion once again.
Lords of Madness is an outstanding book. As a DM, I have rarely had a book so full of possibilities, and so well written. Each race could spawn a campaign, and the background is awesome. As it stands, this is still one of the best DM supplements ever done.
The Spell Compendium is a great resource. My finger waggling PCs have used it to great effect, and it is very well put together. The book is a great supplement to the core books for players.
I would add to the mix: The Eberron core book, as it is a great book with good seeds for a campaign. Or, if you are in the mood for something different, get the OA core setting Rokugan by AEG.
I dropped $120 on Ptolus because I adore all of Monte Cook's stuff. And while Ptolus was not all I had hoped it would be, it's an interesting campaign setting with an immense amount of depth and possibility. If you play in an urban setting, this book will be a huge inspiration. However, I think the most important thing for every DM to own are lots and lots of adventures. DMs don't need more rules (we've already got too many), we need more plots, locations, and villains. The favorite adventures in my collection are the Shackled City hardcover and Monte Cook's Banewarrens. So go buy some adventures! And definitely get another Monster Manual or three.
PS: DMG II is everything the first one should have been. I love it. Also, I recently bought Lords of Madness and, yeah, it's pretty good.
I've seen some similar pleas out there before, but nevertheless I wanted to ask one more time.
Based on some holiday gift cards etc., I am in a position to purchase a new D&D book or three. Currently I own the core rulebooks and DMG II. There are so many supplements out there, it's hard to wade through sometimes. So I'm looking for suggestions.
If you had to buy just one (or two) books, which would they be? I play as both DM and PC. Would you recommend different books for each facet? Are there books that you consider a must-have regardless of use by DM or player? Are supplement books a waste of money and I should buy something for my wife instead? Thanks for the thoughts. Happy 2007!
Dwarfloard
well, i just have to add to this one.there are lots of good books out buy wizards and others so look around and ask about a specifically book if you can.
by the way, a very good book is the seafarers handbook from mongoose publishing. all there books look good but i only have one. there new rules are not flawless but a very good bass for naval combat in D&D. you can build ships from scratch piece buy piece like in the Meach Warrior RPG and it has good feats like parry. its also cheap as D&D stuff goes.
this probably isn't to helpful as I'm like the twentieth reply but to make it shorter and more helpful this is my final advice. to play you don't need books if you have enough options rite now but if you need more go with complete warrior. to DM go with unearthed arcana, seafarers hand book, and a campaign setting if you want. i don't like the monster books to much but that's me.
I'd recommend the Eberron campaign setting book. Apart from being a beautiful piece of graphic design, it has a lot of flavour that can be used in other settings, new magic, new races and prestige classes which are very interesting, and a completely re-imagined D&D game style.
That and a subscription to Dungeon, of course.
I'll put the paired subscriptions to Dungeon and Dragon at the top of my recommendations. And this leads well into a point touched on but not addressed above, "What interaction does the DM have with the Players?" For me, I like stuff I can share as a DM with my players. Getting multiple uses from the same item seems like better value. Of course, there's stuff I won't share, too, but it doesn't need to be a huge portion of my budget.
So, Dungeon is wonderful for me, but I won't share it. Instead I encourage my players to pass my Dragon issues around.
For this same reason, I find PH2 one of the better values. I has good stuff I can use plus keep my players happy. I can't share DMG2 or the MM sequels as easily, so I put those at a slightly lower priority. That's a very personal issue and YMMV.
I bought Stormwrack and was very pleased. It got my players excited about a campaign using it in ways I never got them excited about using prior themes.
Since I had no interest in allowing Warlocks in my campaign, dismissed Complete Mage. Unfortunately that makes a big portion of Complete Arcane irrelevant, too. Since I had already invested in Sword/Fist, Songs/Silence, etc, I've been slow on adding the Complete series. Stormwrack was an easier, happier decision.
So I found the Complete series didn't generate the same interest in a campaign that the environment books did. But if you have no plans on including a desert in your campaign, the players might get frustrated over unrealised interests.
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If I had to buy just one book outside of the core 3, the first one I would buy would be Spell Compendium. It has immense utility for both players and DM's. After that I would look hard at monster books if you are a DM and probably the PHB II for either DM or player utility. After that is just depends on your tastes. Personally I would purchase FCI and FCII before anything else besides Spell Compendium after the core 3 books. But I love those two resources. Your mileage may vary.
I personaly would recommend these three choices as a player
1}PHB 2
2}Spell compendium
3)Complete warrior
As a DM I would recommend
1}Monster Manual 3
2}Fiend Folio
3}DMG 2
These are the books I find to be the most useful in our ongoing campaigns.
I'd like to recommend "red hand of doom", which is such a great adventure!
I think I speak for everyone when I suggest to you the 'book of erotic fantasy'.
Thanks for your thoughts everyone. It helped a lot. In the end (not that you were waiting to hear) I got:
PHB II
Spell Compendium
Stormwrack
Now I have to wait for them to arrrive. -Groans- Where's my instant gratification?
I've seen some similar pleas out there before, but nevertheless I wanted to ask one more time.
Based on some holiday gift cards etc., I am in a position to purchase a new D&D book or three. Currently I own the core rulebooks and DMG II. There are so many supplements out there, it's hard to wade through sometimes. So I'm looking for suggestions.
If you had to buy just one (or two) books, which would they be? I play as both DM and PC. Would you recommend different books for each facet? Are there books that you consider a must-have regardless of use by DM or player? Are supplement books a waste of money and I should buy something for my wife instead? Thanks for the thoughts. Happy 2007!
Hi Eltanin -
You've gotten great suggestions but I'd like to throw my few cents into the fray. What would I suggest???
For the DM:
#1 - EBERRON CAMPAIGN MANUAL.
Without a doubt I have thoroughly enjoyed reading everything I can get about Eberron. I started playing back in 1979 when I was 8 y/o so I've been around quite a while (my increasing waistline and the white hair my kids point out can attest to that) so I'm surprised by some of the answers you received from other people. I gauge the quality of books by how often I thumb through them. When I hit the sack, ~80% of the time I grab a D&D book off of my big bookcase to read next to the kids. Now granted nothing will compare to the insatiable reading I did when I first found the game. I can't say how many times I've read the 1e MM, DMG, MotP, etc. I loved 1e because it was new and exciting...the books on the whole were much better than they are now. 2e was terrible, absolutely terrible, so no comment. 3e/3.5e is new and exciting and Keith Baker's Eberron has raised the bar. The integration of magic into the campaign world, lightning rails, Xen'drik, warforged, the Houses, etc....it's awesome. HIGHLY RECOMMENDED.
(Note: The rest of the Eberron books I would rank as: Secrets of Xen'drik > Explorer's Handbook > Sharn: City of Towers > The Five Nations > Magic of Eberron > Faiths of Eberron > Races of Eberron).
(Note 2: I don't have Dragonmarked).
#2 - FIENDISH CODEX I: HORDES OF THE ABYSS
An excellent book covering all the nasty demons (I refust to use the idiotic terms of baatezu and tan'nari) in the Infinite Layers of the Abyss. There's enough material in there to keep your wheels spinning for a long time - I've been through it at least twice now. I'm hoping to pick up the FIENDISH CODEX II sometime in the future. Reminscent of the 1e MotP and significantly better than the Book of Vile Darkness which was a bit over the top IMHO.
#3 - EXPEDITION TO CASTLE RAVENLOFT
Wow, what a nice job! I can't wait to run this in my Savage Tide campaign...now I've just got to find a way to integrate it. The maps are gorgeous and the work put into it was top notch. Unfortunately, I never played the original I6 - Ravenloft by Hickman et al., but from what I hear it's lived up to expectations.
For the Player:
#1 - EBERRON CAMPAIGN MANUAL
Same reasons as those for the DM. A high-quality, top notch campaign setting that both players and DMs will thoroughly enjoy.
#2 - DRAGON MAGAZINE
Now, I put Dragon here instead of in the DM section for the simple reason of keeping players excited about the game. A DM probably doesn't need much encouragement to drop a few bucks on new books every now and then. I think Dragon would help players (and all D&D fans) passionate about the game and hopefully bring more to the gaming table than dice, chips, pencils, and a character sheet. I am not a big fan of the Class Acts section but I know a lot of readers write in on how much they do, so I respect that. The Demonicon of Iggwilv is so good, I wish there were installments in every issue.
#3 - SPELL COMPENDIUM
Magic is what makes D&D so fun and it's also what makes it so complicated. This book centralizes enough spells in one place to keep everyone happy for a long time. I like seminal references and this is certainly one of them.
(Note: I'm not a big fan of the Complete Series...too many books, too much money $30/book, and from what I've seen, not enough quality material to warrant such a purchase).
For your WIFE:
#1 - PERFUME / JEWELRY / PAJAMAS
Usually a safe bet is somewhere in that list, I tried all three this past Christmas and it works!
#2 - KILLER BUNNIES
A great game! My wife and kids LOVE playing it and knowing that it's hard (nay impossible) for her to play D&D with my regular group because of the small ones, it's a great way to spend quality time playing a game. To heck with Playstations, X-Boxes, and WIIs...face to face gaming is where it's at.
#3 - JAMES BOND 007
The 007 game put out by Victory games in the 80s is still one of THE BEST gaming systems ever designed. Hopefully, with the tremendous success of Casino Royale (the best Bond movie ever!!!) somehow, somewhere, someone will pick up the game and re-introduce it. It's a great game that allows players to...well....be a secret agent! Who hasn't seen a James Bond movie? A female James Bond (Jacqueline Bond?) campaign would be a lot of fun to do with your wife. If we can find the time, I know my wife would love it.
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Happy New Year!
A second monster manual is a godsend. I have three and the fiend folio. MMIII is widely viewed as the best suppliement, althought fiend folio is quite useful, so long as you're willing to take the CRs with a grain of salt.
One of the monster series books are great for setting a theme for a campaign. Fiendish codex I is my favorite, and libris mortis my least, but they all have been quite good.
Also, don't rule out heroes of battle or heroes of horror. they introduce elements that add strongly to gameplay.