My players will be starting this module next session. I have to say that this is my favourite chapter out of the whole adventure path and I am looking forward to it. Just curious if anyone had any issues with the adventure or anything they did to improve it?
The only thing I am concerned with is how to handle the random encounters. Was considering just pre-rolling but I was also going to get the players to role as well so that way they are involved. Going to throw in a corpse collector and a corpse crab on the table and since I have the mini of the former I will definitely be getting “rolled”!
Thanks in advance.
I like some things about that chapter. Kaourophon makes a great villian (expecially if he survives), the party learns much about the ultimate antagonist, and adventures on other planes are pretty cool. I think the wandering monsters and the vast amount of time spent getting everywhere are a major flaw. I was reminded of Lord of the Rings where the fellowship walked, and walked, and walked. My group would often play two or three sessions in a row just fighting wandering monsters. Nice for a break, but not fun over a dozen or so gaming sessions.
I would eliminate "wandering" monsters all together and just create a encounter, maybe two, per day of travel. It allows you to get creative and keep a handle on party XP and treasure. Set encounters will not get your party to 12th level or give them the recomended treasure per level (DMG Table 5-1; pg. 135). So use your "wandering" monsters to get your players to their goal. Have fun and good luck.
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I agree that the wandering monsters component of the module is a flaw - if you follow the 8% chance of encounters over a 3 to 5 day journey, you're going to have entire sessions that are nothing but wandering monsters (and not only do they get repetivive, but they don't advance the storyline).
What I did instead - I pre-rolled the encounters and used them as the inspiration to build meaty encounters (making each leg of the journey into a mini module). Each leg of the journey exposed the characters to something about Occipitus, its denizens and ecology - so it built some story telling into the journey parts of the module.
There's another thread here where someone has also created more robust and diverse randome encounter tables.
I created the my 'mini modules' long hand, but if there's interest I could type 'em up and post 'em.
My players will be starting this module next session. I have to say that this is my favourite chapter out of the whole adventure path and I am looking forward to it. Just curious if anyone had any issues with the adventure or anything they did to improve it?
The only thing I am concerned with is how to handle the random encounters. Was considering just pre-rolling but I was also going to get the players to role as well so that way they are involved. Going to throw in a corpse collector and a corpse crab on the table and since I have the mini of the former I will definitely be getting “rolled”!
Thanks in advance.
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I created the my 'mini modules' long hand, but if there's interest I could type 'em up and post 'em.
I would be very interested in your mini-modules as my players are going to enter Occipitus very soon. I had forecast to skip the wandering monsters altogether because my PCs are already one level above, but if you have a nice alternative and a way to make the trek memorable I'd like to see your work.
Many thanks in advance.
Bran.
I created the my 'mini modules' long hand, but if there's interest I could type 'em up and post 'em.
I'd be interested in seeing this, too, if it's not too much trouble.
--Fang
I agree that the wandering monsters component of the module is a flaw - if you follow the 8% chance of encounters over a 3 to 5 day journey, you're going to have entire sessions that are nothing but wandering monsters (and not only do they get repetivive, but they don't advance the storyline).
What I did instead - I pre-rolled the encounters and used them as the inspiration to build meaty encounters (making each leg of the journey into a mini module). Each leg of the journey exposed the characters to something about Occipitus, its denizens and ecology - so it built some story telling into the journey parts of the module.
There's another thread here where someone has also created more robust and diverse randome encounter tables.
I created the my 'mini modules' long hand, but if there's interest I could type 'em up and post 'em.
That's an excellent idea that has worked well for me in the past. In a previous campaign, my group had to travel across roughly 1000 miles of wasteland. Instead of just rolling random encounters each session, I used pre-rolled encounters as inspiration and created a small, self-contained "plot" for each session. It kept things interesting and exciting for the players and at the same time reinforced the length of the journey, as I didn't just say "after 10 day's travel you reach your destination." It was a little more effort on my part, but well worth it, IMHO.
Love to see the “mini module” and the thread mentioned. I will be creating another thread specifically for Kaurophon as well on tactics and anything interesting that happened with this character.
In my 1e days I use to do the same (pre-generate random encounters and try and use them inventively without bogging the game down). In 3e I have not used any random encounters except when I felt the characters were taking too long or doing something silly and I would pick something from the list and spring it on them.
However this module is a little different since it has at least two long overland treks that need something to happen on them. I don’t however want to have every encounter a combat one. The module has enough of that already.
Just a follow on from my original post. Since the party has already fought a fire giant and a black dragon in Demonskar and Zenith respectively, was going to change Volkair to a blue and the fire giant (Morat?) to a Frost Giant. I don’t think this would affect the adventure much and would spice up the battles (and I also have a very cool blue dragon model I want to use  )
Can anyone see a problem with doing this?
And just for flavour will be changing the lich to a steam-lich inspired by the Dragonmech game. Again just for spice and since my homebrew campaign has a nation which abhors magic and uses “techne” it will fit in nicely.
You have got to use the thunderbeast. I had some of the fiendish centarus stampede them toward the party it turned into a real wild west event and my players had a lot of fun. In retrospect I should have kept the wild west theme, and kept the centaurs as the "indians" using them to shadow the party on there journy with occassinal attacks would have been a great way to keep the journey suspenseful.
In the end I developed a couple of the mini mods, I never use random encounters with this group, we only meet 1/week for 4 - 5 hours so I try to keep the meat of the story going. We have been playing SCAP for 25 months and hopefully will finish FoF tonight.
You have got to use the thunderbeast. I had some of the fiendish centarus stampede them toward the party it turned into a real wild west event and my players had a lot of fun. In retrospect I should have kept the wild west theme, and kept the centaurs as the "indians" using them to shadow the party on there journy with occassinal attacks would have been a great way to keep the journey suspenseful.
Exactly what I am doing :) First game this Saturday. See how we go.
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Thanks for the interest in the mini modules. I am putting them together, but it’s taking some time to input.
In the meantime, here are some things I learned about Occipitus while creating my mini modules, and some assumptions I made to fill in the blanks. I’m sure I have made some errors in judgment or through incomplete research – but it is a starting point.
Inhabitants of Occipitus
In reading the module, I wanted to know more about Occipitus. To me, the module provided an outline of what Occipitus was, but I wanted it fleshed out. I wanted to know what Occipitus was all about when my players entered it so I could answer questions they had with some authority.
Aside from the descriptions in the actual adventure, the information in the front end of the SC Hardcover about Adimarchus’ history and the encounter tables in the module are the key sources of insight about Occipitus, both in terms of its population and its denizens.
Population
While Occipitus is described as somewhat barren and desolate, that’s somewhat in conflict with the encounter tables – at 8% per hour, 24/7 (or what passes for 24/7 on Occipitus), that’s 2 encounters on average per day, and more than the party will typically face in the environs around Cauldron! However, where the jungles and hills about Cauldron are teeming with life, probably the only life the party experiences on Occipitus will be the encounters with its deadly inhabitants.
Denizens
Here the encounter tables open up some interesting questions, like why so many slaad? Or (from the actual adventure) what is a dragon doing here?
These questions led me to think that there are six key categories of Occipitus inhabitants…
• The Natives
• The Abandoned
• The Livestock
• The Contenders
• The Lost Celestials
• The Visitors
The Natives
This category includes some demons (the few that still survive from the period before part of Celestia was cast down into this 507th layer of the Abyss), chaos beasts, and the abyssal greater basilisks.
The undead (shadows, spectres, ghosts) could also be considered within this category, even if they most likely arrived after the celestial collision as a result of Orcus’ brief dalliance with Occipitus, or as spirits of fallen mortals – minions and visitors to the plane who met a savage and brutal end.
The Abandoned
These are the followers of Adimarchus who were left behind after his disappearance and survived the onslaught of Graz’zt’s horde. This group includes demons brought to Occipitus by Adimarchus and then had no means to leave the plane after his departure, as well as the various other minions and creatures drawn by Adimarchus to serve under his banner. This group includes a large number of green slaad (some of which are now grey slaad), the various fiendish creatures Adimarchus used as shock troops, as well as elite allies such as Vorkaire, the black dragon.
Over the years, factions and infighting has reduced the ranks of The Abandoned, but those who remain are either powerful, wily, or both.
The Livestock
An army needs food. To quench this need, Adimarchus stocked Occipitus with fiendish cattle and other beasts forming the low rung of the Occipitus food chain. This includes the Fiendish Bison (I’ve brought these back from the encounter tables in the magazine – they were replaced with thunder beasts in the hard cover – because they fill what I felt was an essential niche in the Occipitus food chain), and for the hearty, the thunder beasts.
These creatures now roam the flats, and are preyed upon primarily by other, more powerful fiendish creatures, and the slaadi. While demons have no need for food, it doesn’t stop them from wading into the flats to let the blood flow when the mood strikes.
The Contenders
This is the small but important group who wish to claim Adimarchus’ throne. Some might include demons mad enough to want to rule Occipitus, or demons that have come to believe that their only escape is to pass the Test of the Smoking Eye. It also includes non-demons from other planes that have come to know of the Test and hunger for the power it could provide.
Most of the contenders have followers, vassals or cohorts with them – for example, Liuvash the Succubus has used her powers of persuasion to persuade Arrokh (the Noble Salamander and former minion of Adimarchus) and the Driders to assist her; Zaur Sza (the Rakshasa), Motruk (the Fire Giant) and Kaurophon also all fit into this category. The Succubus/Half-Fiend cleric from the wandering monster tables might also play the role of Contenders.
The Lost Celestials
These are the poor souls (and their progeny) without the means of planar travel that were fighting on the portion of Celestia which was cast down by the angels. Guardinals, and Golems created by the celestials fall into this category.
Visitors
Some are abyssal tourists. Some are celestial creatures who seek to help the Lost brethren of their kind or discover their fate. Others visit with an agenda other than passing the Test of the Smoking Eye – such as treasure hunters seeking legendary artifacts lost when the part of Celestia that is Occipitus was cast down into the Abyss (i.e. the priests of Wee Jas).
Saureya the Fallen Astral Deva may also fit this category – although his has been an extended visit. Saureya may have the means to now escape Occipitus, and if that’s the case then he stays in Occipitus by choice, seeking to achieve his own agenda.
(NOTE – I place the Couatl in the Plane of Cysts in the Visitors category. I find it more credible the Couatl arrived more recently in the plane and fell in a fight against fiendish creatures rather than being at 0 hit points for several hundred years while being slightly exposed in a cyst).
Distribution
Here are some assumptions I have made, and some ‘discoveries’ about how Occipitus is populated based on how I rolled on the random encounter tables…
Cattle and fiendish creatures form the centre of the Occipitus ecosystem. The cattle roam in greatest numbers at the centre of large areas of flats, wandering in herds. Preying on the herds, in a kind of concentric circle is where most of the fiendish creatures live (including the edges of ossaic forests, and fibrous forests.
The slaad have learned it is best to stay close together, and live in caves and warrens created in the mountainous rim that defines the edge of Occipitus (NOTE – while the boxed text states that the mountains are far away when the PCs arrive on Occipitus, the map shows that they are extremely close – I altered the boxed text to reflect the fact that they started right next to the mountains, and as a result their first several encounters were with Slaad – some protecting their territory, and others hunters returning from the flats with food).
Demons live everywhere – some have taken on the role of overlords, setting up lairs in the mountains or ossaic forest. The most bold and mighty of overlords set up their territories near the skull, seeing it as the true symbol of status in Occipitus. All send their minions about Occipitus, vying with other overlords, and spreading chaos and destruction amongst the flats.
Those demons who seek to pass the Test of the Smoking Eye tend to hang out where the action is – near the various test sites, or sending their minions into areas of celestial rubble to seek for clues.
I will start posting the mini module once I get segments of it complete.
Thanks mate! Keep it coming. I have spent the last 2 weeks doing exactly the same thing. I pre-rolled 26 encounters so I have spent the time creating custom encounters for each. Some are simple like seeing an abadoned axiomatic bulett attacking and killing a fiendish-buffallo. Then down the track in another random encounter the party can fight it.
I also try and attach some kind of story and reason for everything. More for myself and so it makes sense and just in case the characters go beyond the basic surface conversation. My game is tomorrow so hopefully all goes well.
Once I am done I am happy to post my ones as well.
Played out the first week of travel in Occipitus on Saturday. My players didn’t trust Kaurophon off the bat (and still don’t) but they are happy for an “alliance of convenience” for now. And since he actually is being helpful they seem to not monitor him too closely. One of my players is French and he told us that Kaurophon means “water jug” in French.
The custom random encounters I generated went well overall. It took them 6 days to get to the cathedral and I rolled up about 10 encounters. Though only 1 one was a combat encounter and the others could have been but didn’t turn out that way due to player actions. I used the following so far and had Kaurohpon as a sort of tour guide. One of the players said they loved that touch as the NPC is not only helpful in combat but is explaining stuff they may not pickup or know:
• Centaurs trailing them. They loved this and are really paranoid about them. They are being very careful with their spell usage and general resource usage as well as camp sites as they have it in the back of their minds that after each encounter they may need to deal with the centaurs. They are itching to kill them but they know they can’t catch them if they don’t want to fight. So far they are just keeping a watchful eye on them.
• Fiendish buffalo herds x2. One being picked off by a fiendish wyvern (avoided the encounter due to the centaurs). Foreshadow for a future battle.
• Thunderbeast herd which they had a good laugh at. Using it as foreshadow and setup for a future encounter.
• A blue slaadi who shared the campfire with the group and provided them with some general information as well as an adventure hook about the “grey prince of frogs who lives in the mountains” which the players didn’t follow up. Got to use my xaostiect speech as well. I used rokeca’s idea of the slaadi all being mercenaries left over after Adimarchus vanished. He also told this info because one of the characters is CN so he took a like him to him.
• A molydeus (CR 19 fiend) who gave them three options: 1) death, 2) bribe to leave them alone or 3) “recruited” into the Blood War. This was a great encounter as my players like to solve issues with the sword and are usually the most powerful characters on any adventure. So the molydeus was a humbling experience (they coughed up the money). Now they have a burning desire to kill the thing one day. So a random encounter has become part of the story.
• 3x flashbacks of the battle that created the layer. Using these to tell the story of Adimarchus invasion as each flashback is different.
• A combat with 2x greathorn minotaur head-hunters who escaped Baphomet’s maze and made a home here.
• Infernal meteors x3 that caused tremors in the after shock. The players never investigated them but each as an Infernal (from Warcraft – a fiery stone golem essentially) at the impact crater.
• An exiled baatuzi (devil) tricked by Adimarchus into doing charityable works for eternity (or until he died). He lived in the collosal skeleton of a dead balor. The players totally bypassed it which was a shame as it was a safe place for them to stay and the baatuzi would of given them (if asked of course) all his magic items and spells for free (the contract you see!).
Will update as we go along. Out of interest how does the RSS stuff work? Seems likes I need a separate program to monitor the thread. Thought you could use your browser for that or do I need to use my outlook?
Thanks.
Wow ! Thank you very much Rokeca and Solomani. This is indeed very helpful. I will certainly use this background to explain things to my players if they succeed (as usual) one of their monstruous Knowledge (Planes) check. I also like the idea of non-combat encounters with the denizens of Occipitus like being watched by fiendish centaurs or -like Solomani did- an encounter with some green or blue slaadi.
Keep it coming please !!!
Bran.
Solomani, could you please tell me in which sourcebook you found the molydeus stats ?
Many thanks in advance !
Bran
They are in Fiendish Codex I. An awesome read.
~Qualidar~
They are in Fiendish Codex I. An awesome read.
~Qualidar~
Actually I got it from 2e Planescape sourcebook. Don't have the codex.
Out of interest how did people run the test of resolve? I drew the map on the battlemat I ran the whole thing round by round popping distractions in as the characters went. I couldnt think of another way that let me track the lantern bearers progress without giving away the secret of the test.
Also any other ideas for distractions for the test of resolve? The characters have already bypassed the treasure, killed the abyssal basilisk and ignored my cadaver collector (which I made non-aggressive).
Well finished test of the smoking eye on Saturday past. All went well. However Kaurophon died within 5 rounds and only cast 1 spell the entire time. I was hoping for a bit more actually. My party is very melee heavy but range weak. So I had Kaurophon flying since the person who could almost kill him outright – the 24 str orc fighter/barbarian was neutralised. I had his evil monologue going. He failed to throw the sorcerer (Claudia) into the plasm first round to pass the test. He figured that she was the only ranged attacker the party had and with her gone and the test passed he could easily mop up the rest. Claudia past the 22 (or so) will save for telekineses by 1 point and then it was game over for Kaurophon.
Claudia’s familiar, a fairy dragon named Amberblue, used his DC 15 daze breath weapon. A DC 15 at this level is laughable – but of course Kaurophon fails it – he gets a modified 14. So he is dazed for 5 rounds. At this point the orc decides to throw himself into the plasm. Not thinking he would become lord of Occipitus but he was doing it out of spite. He hated Kaurophon so much he just wanted to ruin his plan – even if that meant the end of his life. His back-story was that he was also saved and mentored by Tercivel (renamed to Tsain in my game) so he was trying to emulate his mentor who had essentially died trying to protect Cauldron.
He was surprised he became the lord. Anyway a few hits later Kaurophon is still floating up there dazed. Claudia scores a critical hit with her crossbow. Instead of taking the damage (which may not have killed him due to DR) she decides to roll on the critical hit table (the one from the Dragon Compendium – been using this one and the original one in all my campaigns). She scores a “head shot” deafens him and then stuns him for 3 rounds. But the stun knocked him out of the sky (he was using his wings not the spell). The fall killed him.
So Kaurophon was right – Claudia WAS the most dangerous person for him but for the wrong reasons. His defeat was so ignoble that I intend on bringing him back as a ghost.
I will organise my random encounter notes and upload it to the rpg-genius Cauldron site. I also have enough ideas that I could actually run an entire mini-campaign for Occipitus. However that isn’t appropriate for the other players (unless they want to but I feel it would be too focused on one character as the hero).
I will organise my random encounter notes and upload it to the rpg-genius Cauldron site. I also have enough ideas that I could actually run an entire mini-campaign for Occipitus. However that isn’t appropriate for the other players (unless they want to but I feel it would be too focused on one character as the hero).
Let us know when you've uploaded your notes Solomani. This post has been a big help in preparing for the journey through Occipitus. I printed the whole post and have used it for reference. My players just arrived there in the last session.
They are only 9th so I’m looking for some encounters to level them up before they get to the first part of the Test. In my game they plane shifted and unfortunately landed in a valley that belongs to a very jealous and greedy Hex dragon named Vaash. They tried to hide, but it wasn’t really much use against her. She has her eye on Alakast, but they will never beat her out in the open. So if they want to live they will have to turn over Alakast... for now.