less_than_vince's page

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My players are currently playing Sword of valor. I have a barbarian guardian, a aasimar paladin marshal, a two swords fighter champion, a wizard archmage and a druid hierophant.

Just needed to share.

My player will undertake the Vescamor swarm next game. Last game, they were trying to find the traitor who were supplying Aaron with the shadowblood. They were suspecting Arles, the ex-paladin. They turn to Hurah for extra help (!) not suspecting her.

What they didnt tell her was that the druid was going to shapeshift as a horse to spy Arles all day.

Man, that was funny as hell. The stealth check to infiltrate the horses of Arles group, the waiting. Then, Hurah, to put the blame on arles, tried to put some vial of shadowblood in his bag while invisible. The druid catch her on the spot and with the scent ability, he recognise Hurah, even if she was invisible.

Because he wanted to be subtle and wanted to interrogate her before accusing her, he ask a paladin in the army (while in horse) to arrest her. The paladin was receiveig order from a talking horse! Man, that was hilarious. He was so sure too be under a mental spell that he asked a fellow paladin to catch Hurah with him.
Naturally, Hurah succed in facsinating the paladin, she «suggest» to the horse to get out of here and she was trying to get away. Shooting, entangle, invisibility, intimidation; finaly, the group catches the halfling. Arles sees hope again. And the horse saves the day

Not realy mythic, but it was fun.

My player will arrive in Drezen in my next game. Tks a lot for your work.

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My bard use comedy. She insult her ennemies and use sarcasm to bolster her friends.

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Eberron. Starting a new game in a month in Breland. I have rune a two year long game centered on th Emerald Claw. Was fantastic with Pathfinder.

In a eberron game, one of the Royal eyes spy was a bard. Diplomat, he was friend with everybody, know many thing and was a great deceiver. He was really friendly with the PCs.

James Bond turn bad. Or Tyrion, in game of throne. Use oratory and comedy for your perfom skill. Or dance, for formal event.

Dont fight the PCs in a dungeon, but in city, ballroom, etc. Dont fight directly, use minion.

Use his diplomacy to destroy the PCs reputation.

A vilain bard can be a great vilain, if you give him a great personality.

Great idea, tks.

I steal some of your Psion. But I dont want to go the critical line feat. I'll stick with step up and lung, trading damage for control. I will probably invest some feat for my AC, too play more the tank role than the DPR one. The other player already fill this niche.

Sorry for english

For a Kingmaker game. Currently level 3, but I can make change to my character.

I'm the fighter. I want to play the shield and sword fight.

I've choose longsword and light shield. feat: 2 weapon fight, shield bash, power attk, weapon focus sword and step up.

With shield bash and shield mastery coming up, i'm thinking swithching to the large shield, with the short sword. Make the shield the primary weapon, invest money for a good shield with the bashing ability, and with shield mastery feat, use the bonus to ac for attk and damage.
Maybe add a defense short sword.

I realy want to use the shield each round for bashing and bull rushing with shield bash at level 6.

Is it viable?? Can I combine this with the archetype for 2 weapon fighter?

I want to go the step up and lung feat too realy control de battle field. The other player (sorcerer, druid and inquisitor) are built for damage.

Should I rethink my build?

My team was realy happy with my trapfinder specialist rogue in the Shackled city campaign. It was a lot of fun to be a rogue with so many doors, so many dungeon.

And yeah, I was electrocuted, mutilated, burned, and nearly killed a few thousand times. I been shot with lazer!!!! It was a running gag. But it let us have so many hidden treasures with max perception and skill focus disable device.

Trapfinding is fun and part of the game in many self made campaign of the guys I play with (no so much experience with adventures path so far)

oh, thanks. But wouldnt it be more fun to let the two feat stack?

Wow, great Idea gang. Tks a lot.

Just receive my brand new copie off NPC codex. Great book, great art. love it.

On the tactic section of each character, many of the more mobile fighter or rogue on the book rely on the vital strike feat with the spring attack feat. Wich is not feasible, by raw (spring attk = full action, vital strike = attk action). Some poster note it up.

But, I want to know if some of you let player use the combination in the game. Is it too powerfull. Should it be permitted.

It's against the rule. But now that I have the NPC codex, it seems that it respect the «spirit» of the rule!!! I belive that some conceptor wanted to pump the damage of mobile character.

I know that there are many thread on the vital strike question. I dont want a better understanding of the rule, but actual gameplay experience. Or proof that it's too strong to let the two feat work togheter.

Youre thougths?? (sorry for english)

GM Elton wrote:

How many of you like your Arcane casting characters? How many of you regularly play them? What is your favorite variant magic system, archetype, and/or academy (referring to Magic of the Inner Sea here)? :)

I just want to see something.

I'm playing a gnome summuner, level 4. I found it to be more «martial» than «arcane». I summun my eidolon, and I buff him with the same 3 spell. So, i dont feel like a «true» caster. Most of the time, my summuner run out of spell, so he shoot with the crossbow, and the eidolon smash anything he can.

Maybe that will change with mor level, but that' s the lasst time that I will take this class. Should have done a wizard summuner. More fun for my taste.

joeyfixit wrote:

This may seem like a weird one, but is it feasible to roleplay flashbacks? Or flash forwards?

I'm wondering if the kind of non-linear storytelling we see on tv so much in the 21st Century (Lost, for example) can be applied to roleplaying in any workable way.

I do it all the time. There's only one secret; havind the complicity of the player. When they know that they are in a flashback or a «cutscene», they act in consequence.

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No, hate those rules. Losing a turn because you role a 1 is boring. Also, the more you level, the more it affects you. So not for me.

We will start the kingmaker path.We dont know yet what class we will choose, but I think that I want to play a support type of character.

I dont need an overmaximize charater, because that's not the kind of group i'm in. So flavor can beat power.

I leaning toward a Calistra cleric. Human, elf, half-elf or tierfling, havent decided. Evangelist archetype seem good for the style i want (kind of melisandre in Game of throne, but a little more subtle in her or his preaching).

So, I'll want some charisma, wis (more buff than attack, so spell dc not a priority). Maybe some dex (dont have acces to medium armor without a feat).
I think i'll go with trickster domain, for the spell and the class skill it open (bluff, for the flavor of the class. evangelist have only one domain.

Calistra's favored weapon is the whip. Should I take this road. Normal whip, or the scorpion one. Whip mastery?. As I will support my team with the perform skill and my spell, should I use the whip for disarm or trip? Or just dump the whip.

Like I said, dont need to be overpowerful. But is it viable? I want a good charisma, but the evangelist'channel power is reduce. Should I go with lower charisma, but prepare the spell eagle splendor for social interaction?

I think it will be a 20 build game, with access to core book, apg, and ultimate. Inner guide and the kingmaker player guide too

Any advice (sorry for poor english by the way)

(sorry for poor english)

I like your build, for sure. But I find it a little overpowerful IMHO.
Gandalf is charismatic, in a way, but I woulnd put it at 25. He is no Aragorn. People listen to him for his advice. Many men don't like him at all. Many hobbit despise him and call him a troublemaker. A 12 or 14 seem more appropriate. If you put him at 25 charisma, what score will you give to Aragor, who lead men into desperate battles and convince an undead army to join him.

Same for the wisdom. He dosent decifer the moon gate on the Moria. Dosent see trought the trahison of saruman, he lost his way in the Moria. His bright, but more of a 21 intel, maybe 14 or 16 wis, maybe 18.
I think he can hit 16 str with magic like bull strenght, in battle, but not all the time.

Weapon specialisation his a feat made for fighter. Gandalf know how to fight, but he is not Aragorn, Legolas Gimli or Boromir. Take the fight with the troll in the fellowship (movie). He's useful, but Legolas, Aragorn and, in some way, Merry and Pippin, are the one that win the fight. For me, his stand at Minas tirith or in other battle can be handled with bull strength, haste or tenser transformation. IN the battle against Saruman, in the fellowship, Gandal dosent seem to have uncanny dodge either. He is surprised by Saruman's attack. I'ld stick with the wizard base attack, maybe with a level or two of figther or ranger (he is a great traveler).

Bardic performance his a powerfull ability that can boost the morale of the troops and clearly pushes the limit of a group. Gandalf can be reassuring, confident, but there is nothing magic in his way.

I can see the aura of courage in Aragorn, not in Gandalf.

When he confront the witch king, he is clearly afraid, maybe even shaken. So, no immune to fear.

To portray Gandal with pathfinder rules, you need to make compromise. Your summun eagle spell his perfect. His skill, the same. I think that shadowfax can be a simple mount spell. Never forget that wizard are rare in Middle earth, so even a simple mount or knock spell his powerfull. A simple Protection against evil spell can explain why the «summuned» balrog was'nt able to touch him in the Moria.

My two cent. Good work.

Courrain wrote:
The Advanced Race Guide says that a half-construct race is a group of creatures that are artifically enhanced or have parts replaced by constructed mechanisms, be they magical or mechanical. So could a race such as WoTC's Warforged be considered a Half-Construct?

We use the half construct for our Eberron Game and it work like a charm.

Drejk wrote:
I belong to the crowd of GMs that don't track experience for d20 games. I just tell the players when their character gain level every few sessions.

Same here. Been doing it for years.

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oups. I wanted to say : It's seems that i'am an experience gamer, the same cannot be said for MY USE OF the forum. my bad.

Like I said, I did'nt wanted too start a war, only to explain my view. Let's not make it personnal.

It's seems that i'am an experience gamer, the same cannot be said for the forum use. my bad.

Rynjin wrote:
less_than_vince wrote:
depend on the player. if you put an 8 to your intel to make a fun character, i have no problem. if you put an 8 to your intel with no roleeplay intention and only want to do max damage, yeah, i'll be proud to dominate you.

You sound like one of those obnoxious little 12 year old CoD kiddies who's just got their hands on a new game. "Oh man I dominated you so hard XD get gud skrub".

Get over yourself.

my god, that escalated quickly.

Ok, like I said, english's not my first language.

I rered my first post, and I think I was a little over my head. Not wanting to start a war.(and i havent realized that the thread was on advice forum)

I'm not against dump stats or maximizing. Dump stats can be a lot of fun.

it's just that, in more than 15 years of gaming, i'have seen many types of players and gaming style. But when I come to the optimisation forum, I dont ALWAYS like what I see. thing like, if you want to make a good paladin, you have to put 7 in your wis and your intel to put your strengh and charisma off the chart. and you have to take tw fighting to deal your smite more often.

Yeah, on paper, that seem optimized. but on the table, it will not work as planned. Monster moves, monster win ini, monster attack from distances, uses trap, can fly. Add difficult terrain, obstacle, spell effects. etc. On my table, as a gm or player, we dont often see full attack, except from ranged archer, for exemple. so, that leave the mobile paladin with the sword and shield a very viable option.

I have seen gamers use the character on the optimized board to make a paladin with 7 intel and wis. And when the principal action wasnt combat, they were bored to death.

like i said, i'm not against optimizing. i like to play powerful charater myself. but i think that most of the time, the character or option proposed on the borad are viable for a party that face an unmoving solo monster on a 3x3 room wiht no obstacles. and outside combat, they are green plant that wait on the corner.

I wasn't searching for a fight. It's just that, sometimes, I feel there is more rules lawyer thant roleplayer on the board. Maybe i'm wrong.


ps: work for the wizard too. you dump your str to 8. Fine. i'm gonna enforce the emcumbrance rules.

firefly the great wrote:
less_than_vince wrote:

sorry for bad english

In my table, if you put a 7 in one of your mental stat, it will backfire all the time. try to buy a magic item at the listed price with 7 charisma. I double dare you.

Oh yeah, put your 7 in wisdom. No wonder you'r dominated each fight smartass.

So, what you're saying is, instead of just using any number of valid rules for character stat generation, you metagame incessantly to passive-aggressively attack the weakness of characters whose builds you don't approve of? And you're proud of this?

depend on the player. if you put an 8 to your intel to make a fun character, i have no problem. if you put an 8 to your intel with no roleeplay intention and only want to do max damage, yeah, i'll be proud to dominate you.

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sorry for bad english

I'm a long time d&d player (ad&d, 3rd, 3.5, 4) and recently pathfinder. Love it.

fan of the forum, i spend many hour by month on it.

But when i read the optimization forum, it_s like I dont play the same game as the rest of many player.
maybe it's because my player are all near their 30, or because we are also world of darkness player, but I have never seen one of my fellow player put three dumpstat on their fighter to be all powerfull.
Who wants to play a dumb jackass for 20 level just because he can do 100 damage per round. What a boring character.

In my table, if you put a 7 in one of your mental stat, it will backfire all the time. try to buy a magic item at the listed price with 7 charisma. I double dare you.

Oh yeah, put your 7 in wisdom. No wonder you'r dominated each fight smartass.

In my experience, most of the optimized characters found on the advice forum would not be viable at our table. For example, nobody seem to find viable a shield and sword character without the twf feat tree. But in my expérience, full attack action is a rare occurence in battle. most of the time, monster moves, character too. I,have played a rogue for 16 level in schakled city. I have had the opportunity to use twf only a bunch of time in two years play.

In many build, attack of opportunity is a must. But it's a rule that praticly never happened in our game.

I understand that some player want to optimized their characther for combat. Tht's fine. But what I see on the optimization forum are one trick pony good for a nova round in the right circunstances.
I'm tired of reading that if you want to play a good rogue, you have to be an half orc with a falchion.

On some table, it's seem the r from rpg was taken out. when all the thing i want is killing and looting, I play a video game.

Just my two cent. have fun.

brent norton wrote:
I have always pictured LG and Superman as one and the same. Can LG be played dark and brooding? What fictional characters can I look at?

Superman and lg are not the same, but superman is probably lg. Dont forget, alignement are guide, not absolute. A guy like Vincent, from Final fantasy, can be lg, but he his dark and tormented. But he his a soldier, loyal to his friend, can follow order and he his benevolent and kind. Lg

But also dark and brooding.

Batman can be lg. Dont kill beacause of his code of conduit, get out of the law, but because he believe in order, not because he refuse order. And he his good, even if he use tactic like mild torture and intimidation.

(you could argue that the bat is neutral good or chaotic good, but I prefer to stick with lg)


Davor wrote:

Stick to buffing and support spells. You can use Bardic Music while singing with a weapon and shield in hand, so that'll probably be your way to go.

Consider taking a peek at a few of the Bard Archetypes, specifically Arcane Duelist and Sound Striker, which offer the most variety/benefits for a melee bard who still wishes to buff others, with the Sound Striker archetype, you get a decent ranged option that doesn't require you to take lots of feats to be effective.

If you specialize in Illusions and Enchantment, you have quite a few useful spells at your disposal. See if your GM will let you play a Samsaran too. The stats aren't ideal, but they have an alternate racial feature that will let you add spells from other arcane classes to your spell list, which could be REALLY nice (you could get Haste as a 2nd level spell, for example).

You might want to consider the Bodyguard feat and Combat Reflexes if you plan on using a shield. This combination allows you to improve the defenses of your allies while using offensively oriented buffs & songs. Alternatively, consider Dodge/Mobility, which will allow you to move into flanking positions to grant allies extra bonuses to attack.

If you REALLY wanted to go the Debuffer route as opposed to buffing, the Court Bard and Street Performer archetypes both have really good debuffing options, with Court Bard in particular being quite nasty (lowers enemy attack and damage rolls). The Prankster archetype, while being limited to gnomes, is another excellent choice for crowd control and debuffing, and you may be able to ask your DM if you can use this archetype, should you consider it.

And of course, as a reminder, all of the above options and archetypes can be found on the Pathfinder Source Reference Document.

tanks, great advice. I'll probably go buffing instead of debuffing. I'll stay half-elf and probably go dodge moblity.

My master isn't the dungeon type, so not many trap (the cleric and the wizard will be enough I think)

(sorry for the english and long post)

We started a D&D 4 edition Ravenloft game. We were 6 players, and everybody wanted to play a specific class. I wanted to try all of the 4th class one day or an other, so I choos to play a bard, so I could be a second healer after the cleric and the second tank with the paladin (we arlready had two striker and one mage)
I made a half elf bard, build for melee and debuffing.
Then, we stop the game for some reason. The master started a game of ravenlof set many year after this one with other players, and ask me to join. He suggest I'd take the same charater (cool background and roleplay option).
But in the new party, there was already two tank and one dedicated healing cleric. So, the master let me rework the character to an hybrid bard/sorcerer, so I can benefit the rest of the group.
But, the player and the master started to grow tired of the spirit of the 4th edition. So we switch to pathfinder, of course.
I want to remake the character. We have a battle cleric, a mage, a paladin (buffer build, holy archetype) and a fighter/barbarian.
I want to keep the essence of the character, so I’m sticking with half-elf bard, sword in hand and song in her heart (so, no archer build or whip disarm type). We clearly dont need another melee class, we have a good healer and the mage will be…well..the mage. So, that leave me with……well, I don’t know.
Debuffer? A third melee (I was thinking expeditious retreat with spring attack to be a skirmisher type), or support, standing near the mage and buffing the cleric, the paladin and the fighter.
We are level 7, 25 point buy and the master choose the magic item. We play in Ravenloft, so not too much divination, necromancy, summun or conjuration magic. So, I’ll go illusion and enchantement.
Any advice!!! (I d'ont mind multiclass, but not sure if multiclass bard is a good idea)

Humm, unexpected...interesting...I,ll be a little piss off....but you seem to have a fun DM.

ub3r_n3rd wrote:

I'd try to convert if I liked the characters and we had a great campaign going. There have been many people who have successfully converted through the years as the editions evolved. The main thing here is to have fun running the game and playing the game.

The conversion doesn't have to be perfect, just try to get the flavor to coincide with what you and your players are used to.

Exactly my thougth. Tks for the idea.

But if he choose to play more the martial side of the warlord and switch to figther, I'm stuck with a party of melee figther and rogue, one wizard, one sorcerer, but no healer .

Suggestion for a party lacking a healing member(I can always throw a bunch of wand of cure moderate wound to the paladin!!)

Belle Mythix wrote:

And translated stuff tend to cost a lot more.

So true!!! And D&D and video games taught me english!!

I've read some french rpg magazine, and Ive found the adventure lest....cinematic, I suppose, more intrigue, less action. And the acion is sometime more gritty, lesh flashy.
As a north american, Im more influenced by comics books and hollywood movie in my game than, say, french manga or their movie.
But hey, nothing scientific here, just some impression. I may be wrong.

The only thing I share in common with the french is, well, the french language...

(Are you coming from Pathfinder-FR or Aidedd ?)


The french version? No. Im french canadian, but i prefer english site, there is more people. Also, our style of play is more north american than french, if I may said.

Will look at the samurai and dragon order.


take a look at the Pathfinder Reference Document and http://www.d20pfsrd.com/ (easier to navigate between stuff)
seen it, but I'm looking for suggestion.

The warlord seem fine, but He dont need the mount abilities, and all of the build have a mount.

Tanks for advice Nicos, but i would like to stick with core books, ultimate and advance guides (player and race. Maybe gray guard from 3.5. will look upon.

Sorry for bad english (yeah, I speak french!!)

My group grow tired of 4th edition d&D and we want to switch to pathfinder.

We play Eberron

My group consist of 6 level 16 charaters.

- a tacticien warlord of karrnath, human, the leader of the group
- a fighter warforged
- a silver flamme paladin, human
- a human ranger, deneth dragon mark, with beast companion
- a human wizard, cannith dragonmarked (more like a artificier)
- a changeling rogue, daggermaster.
(-) a half-elf fiendish warlord (in and out, when he can play)

First of all, should I downgrade the level of the player. Last game, they beat a adult blue dragon (in 4th edition). But in pathfinder, the same dragon is CR 13. Eberron 3 edition tend to favor low or middle level charater.

Second, we can easily convert all of the character, except the warlord and the paladin. The warlord is the moral compass of the group, also a great warrior, a diplomat, a tacticien and a leader. Fighter seem a little weird (so many skill point for diplomacy!!!!!), but he dosent use a mount, so cavalier is ut of the equation. He is not lawful good (he has a trouble past), so no paladin. And he is not a caster, so no multiclass bard or else.

The paladin has taken the gray guard paragon class (divine power book). He is lawful good, but don't mind using intimidation or fear tactics to scare ennemy (maybe oath of vengeance). He is constently on the edge of falling, but he stay on the right path. How can we capture this feeling in pathfinder.