This is where we can have general discussions, questions answered, etc.
After reading the PDF (linked from the Gameplay Thread), let's discuss how you want to approach your character here.
I was able to read through the PDF that you linked. I think I'll take on building a Rogue from scratch so I can get a feel for things. I am at work until 4 today so I'll have plenty of time this evening to get a Rogue Alias built. Let me know if there is anything specific I should know before doing so. Obviously I'll build it close to the pre-generated one as suggested in the dropbox file.
Have a look at our discussion about the character build from "Game #2". We had a bit of back and forth; some learning on my part, etc. Should be helpful as you build.
Link Here for the discussion
Rolling for hit points. Just to be sure, level 1 I start with the amount of the rogue's hit die correct? So since its d8, I start with 8?:
Correct and wow - nice rolling! I have found that this board's dice rolling feature hates me. I would have rolled 1,1. Let's test the theory (I hope I don't waste a good one!)
Well, this board is most definitely a dual personality! :)
I present to you, Thorak Skulk the Half-Orc Rogue. Forgive my terrible formatting for his character sheet. I will clean it up, I just wanted to get something up so you can at least look over it and maybe we can even get started. I will also be creating a background and such for Thorak, I'm just taking a break for now as I have been working on this for an easy 3 hours. -.-
Am I missing something or did you only use 17 of the 20 points allowed in your Ability Point Buy?
I will wait to review the rest based on your reply here, since the result will pervade the remainder of the sheet.
Alright correct me if I am wrong here.
16 is 10 points, 14 is 5, 12 is 2, another 12 is 2, 11 would be the last 1 and of course 10 is 0.
Pretty sure that's right unless I'm going crazy. xD
Yeah I was pretty surprised with those two 8s. Luck is on my side! Just in time for some gambling.
You are, of course, correct. I was using "PC-GEN" to help me and it had an odd point buy system loaded which was giving me the strange result. I really should have checked the Core Book for myself. My apologies.
I'm really busy at work this morning (I am EST by the way), but hopefully will get a few minutes this afternoon to review your guy put up the first post of the adventure.
Thanks!
You are, of course, correct. I was using "PC-GEN" to help me and it had an odd point buy system loaded which was giving me the strange result. I really should have checked the Core Book for myself. My apologies.
Oh ok that makes sense. No problem at all. :D
I'm really busy at work this morning (I am EST by the way), but hopefully will get a few minutes this afternoon to review your guy put up the first post of the adventure.
Thanks!
Oh so only a 2 hr difference (I am MST) , thats not too bad. I definitely understand, work comes first. If I have some spare minutes at work I'll work towards cleaning up my alias and making it easier to read etc.
Hey - I found a few minutes. I am not finished yet, but I think you are missing some things.
- I think you forgot to increase your skill ranks for level 2 and level 3
- I think you get an extra Feat at level 3 - you only have 1
- You are missing your Level 2 Rogue Talent
- Assuming your Favored Class is Rogue, you need to take your favored class bonuses for each of level 1,2,3
Or am I doing something wrong -- again! :)
Alright made some adjustments, sorry about that.
I missed the skill ranks for level 2 and 3 so I added those and then used the favored class bonuses for an extra 2 ranks (pretty sure I dont get one for level 1?). Looks like I confused my extra feat and talent. Since I took Finesse Rogue for my talent, I accidentally missed grabbing the level 3 feat thinking I already had it. Derp!
I think it should be good to now. Thanks for looking it over. :)
By the way, Spot = Perception, yes. Unfortunately, the adventure module I am using seems to have a bunch of D&D 3.5e remnants scattered throughout. I am trying to catch them as I go along, but feel free to point them out for me if you see them.
Alright made some adjustments, sorry about that.
I missed the skill ranks for level 2 and 3 so I added those and then used the favored class bonuses for an extra 2 ranks (pretty sure I don't get one for level 1?). Looks like I confused my extra feat and talent. Since I took Finesse Rogue for my talent, I accidentally missed grabbing the level 3 feat thinking I already had it. Derp!
I think it should be good to now. Thanks for looking it over. :)
You do get favored class bonus for level 1, yes.
I am not mistaken, you have Weapon Finesse from your Feat Choice (along with Deceitful), and you have Weapon Training as your bonus Rogue Talent. Weapon Training, in turn, gives you Weapon Focus (Short Sword).
Typo on your "Will Save" -- Will Save: 1 (rogue) + 2 = 2 - should be 3
Back to your skills, even with the favored class "skill rank", I don't think you are allowed to have a base rank above your level #, so where you have 4, you can only have 3. I think it just means you need to put the extra point into different skills.
I am still a bit mystified, though; you may be right, but PC-GEN disagrees :)
Updated favored class bonus for level 1 as well then.
Just gonna go over the details here. So for feats I chose Deceitful and Weapon focus. I get Weapon Finesse from the Finesse Rogue talent. Maybe the way I put them in the char sheet is confusing, I'll update it. Basically with the finesse rogue talent I have 3 feats. That sound right?
Yes - we are aligned on that front now.
Just three more topics.
First, your Bluff and Gambler skills have Rank 4 as a starting point. This is, I believe, from your Favored Class Bonus - Bonus Skill Ranks. At level 3, however, you can't have more than a Rank 3, so you will need to take the 4's down to a 3 on those 2 Skills. That will leave you two points. In addition, you do get the Bonus Skill Rank at level 1, so that means you have 3 extra points to put into anything that is not already a Rank 3.
Second, your Will Save should be a total of 3, not 2
Lastly, the Advanced Players Guide, Pg 326, describes Traits. You need to pick 2 of those still and then we are done :)
Thanks for bearing through this process. More than anything, it is part of my learning curve, not something you are doing incorrectly.
Ah crap totally forgot about that, so many things to remember. I actually did put the level 1 bonus skill rank into stealth making it a 4 so I'll have to drop that one too. So I will drop bluff, gambler and stealth leaving me with 3 skill ranks. I'll put those into acrobatics, escape artist and intimidate.
As for traits I'll take Brute and Child of the Streets.
Hopefully everything looks ok now. Thanks for the patience! We are in this learning curve together.
I think that's got it. Thanks for sticking with me through my learning curve as well.
This is what PC-GEN is saying about your skills. I was getting a 7 for Acrobatics, where you had an 8. I think you forgot the -1 from your Armor. I figured I would drop this here and you could review the others. Sorry for being a pain. From the game perspective, I am not sweating it much, but because I am learning (and I am an accountant), I notice differences in numbers and can't help but to try and figure out why :) Hope this helps.
Acrobatics +7 = +1[RANK] +3[cskill ACROBATICS GTEQ 1,skill ACROBATICS GTEQ 1|TYPE=CLASSSKILL|Acrobatics] +4[STAT] -1[ARMOR]
Bluff +9 = +3[RANK] +2[Deceitful] +3[cskill BLUFF GTEQ 1,skill BLUFF GTEQ 1|TYPE=CLASSSKILL|Bluff] +1[STAT]
Diplomacy +1 = +1[STAT]
Disable Device +10 = +3[RANK] +1[Trapfinding] +3[cskill DISABLE DEVICE GTEQ 1,skill DISABLE DEVICE GTEQ 1|TYPE=CLASSSKILL|Disable Device] +4[STAT] -1[ARMOR]
Disguise +9 = +3[RANK] +3[cskill DISGUISE GTEQ 1,skill DISGUISE GTEQ 1|TYPE=CLASSSKILL|Disguise] +2[Deceitful] +1[STAT]
Escape Artist +7 = +1[RANK] +3[cskill ESCAPE ARTIST GTEQ 1,skill ESCAPE ARTIST GTEQ 1|TYPE=CLASSSKILL|Escape Artist] +4[STAT] -1[ARMOR]
Fly +3 = +4[STAT] -1[ARMOR]
Heal +2 = +2[STAT]
Intimidate +8 = +1[RANK] +2[TYPE=RACIAL|Intimidating] +3[cskill INTIMIDATE GTEQ 1,skill INTIMIDATE GTEQ 1|TYPE=CLASSSKILL|Intimidate] +1[TYPE=TRAIT|Brute] +1[STAT]
Perception +8 = +3[RANK] +3[cskill PERCEPTION GTEQ 1,skill PERCEPTION GTEQ 1|TYPE=CLASSSKILL|Perception] +2[STAT]
Perform (Untrained) +1 = +1[STAT]
Profession (Gambler) +8 = +3[RANK] +3[cskill PROFESSION (GAMBLER) GTEQ 1,skill PROFESSION (GAMBLER) GTEQ 1|TYPE=CLASSSKILL|Profession (Gambler)] +2[STAT]
Ride +3 = +4[STAT] -1[ARMOR]
Sense Motive +2 = +2[STAT]
Sleight of Hand +10 = +3[RANK] +3[cskill SLEIGHT OF HAND GTEQ 1,skill SLEIGHT OF HAND GTEQ 1|TYPE=CLASSSKILL|Sleight of Hand] +1[TYPE=TRAIT|Child of the Streets] +4[STAT] -1[ARMOR]
Stealth +9 = +3[RANK] +3[cskill STEALTH GTEQ 1,skill STEALTH GTEQ 1|TYPE=CLASSSKILL|Stealth] +4[STAT] -1[ARMOR]
Survival +2 = +2[STAT]
Use Magic Device +7 = +3[RANK] +3[cskill USE MAGIC DEVICE GTEQ 1,skill USE MAGIC DEVICE GTEQ 1|TYPE=CLASSSKILL|Use Magic Device] +1[STAT]
I wanted to have a quick chat about "Check" rolls. I have been reading up a bit, and I guess there are two schools of thought. Some think that the players should always roll them, others think the GM.
Given this is a "rogue focused" game, checking for secrets, traps, etc. is something that is core to your class, so I don't want to do the rolling for you, but I also don't want you to miss potential secrets because you forget.
Do you have a preference?
Ah I see, yep definitely did not factor in -1 for armor. No probs, I will adjust. Dont worry, its not a pain at all, I have never played pathfinder before so I am sure I missing a ton of minor details. This is all good learning, so thanks.
As for check rolls, I am open to what you think will work best for our game. I think in some cases it has been helpful when you ask me to roll for perception because I'm not sure I would have even thought to. Is the general idea that I should just be rolling for secrets and traps in every location you describe? If thats the case, I am fine with rolling for myself. Thanks for bringing this up.
I would advise that we start by reminding each other to roll for checks. I would suggest that almost every place you go has something of interest that can be found with the correct roll. The good news is that Perception seems to cover so many different things with one check! (listen, Search, Spot). There's actually a good guide on the Paizo site that does conversion from 3.5 to Pathfinder. That helped me a lot, and then I found the actual Pathfinder version of the adventure - which helped even more (I somehow ended up with the 3.5e version). Let me know if you want to see the PF version of the default character, by the way - things make so much more sense with that one.
I would advise that we start by reminding each other to roll for checks. I would suggest that almost every place you go has something of interest that can be found with the correct roll. The good news is that Perception seems to cover so many different things with one check! (listen, Search, Spot). There's actually a good guide on the Paizo site that does conversion from 3.5 to Pathfinder. That helped me a lot, and then I found the actual Pathfinder version of the adventure - which helped even more (I somehow ended up with the 3.5e version). Let me know if you want to see the PF version of the default character, by the way - things make so much more sense with that one.
Ok cool, thanks. Yeah I think it would be useful to see the PF pregen, I'll take a look at it.
Also, please dont hesitate to inform me of other areas you think I should be rolling or even ways I should be pbp'ing differently. I just realized that for talking to the guards I prob should have rolled for like intimidation or bluffed as an orc etc. I have only been rp'ing off and on for the past few years so I have a ton to learn.
I would advise that we start by reminding each other to roll for checks. I would suggest that almost every place you go has something of interest that can be found with the correct roll. The good news is that Perception seems to cover so many different things with one check! (listen, Search, Spot). There's actually a good guide on the Paizo site that does conversion from 3.5 to Pathfinder. That helped me a lot, and then I found the actual Pathfinder version of the adventure - which helped even more (I somehow ended up with the 3.5e version). Let me know if you want to see the PF version of the default character, by the way - things make so much more sense with that one.Ok cool, thanks. Yeah I think it would be useful to see the PF pregen, I'll take a look at it.
Also, please dont hesitate to inform me of other areas you think I should be rolling or even ways I should be pbp'ing differently. I just realized that for talking to the guards I prob should have rolled for like intimidation or bluffed as an orc etc. I have only been rp'ing off and on for the past few years so I have a ton to learn.
We shall learn together :)
I just read this from a Reddit post on the subject of perception checks.
The link to the entire post is here
I really think the poster above is on to a good idea. I know, in this adventure, there are a lot of things to find in most areas. I need to think about what we are doing in that context. Like you said in your OOC in the gameplay thread, terrible perception rolls suck(and by the way, the forum roller hates me too!).
I am gonna noodle a bit. I am thinking to use the "time constraints" in conjunction with the checking around for things, I think.
Have you had a particular past experience you like more than others?
Here is a link to the updated introduction along with the pathfinder version of the character sheet.
OK ... I know I am not giving you enough time to respond >:), but I am thinking that we could allow you to choose to search an area in detail, square by square. Instead of 2 minutes per square (which is 20x6s=120s), I could drop it to one minute per square. So, for example, your room would take 8 minutes to do a good search. Perception roll in that case is +5 extra bonus. If you take a full two minutes per square, you get +10 extra bonus to perception check, so most likely going to find everything that way.
The cost is time. For example, the Courtyard you are in right now would take 60 minutes at 1 minute per square, and 120 minutes at 2 minutes. Spending that much time anywhere also increases the chances of having a random encounter that could cost more time (especially if you are somewhere that you are not supposed to be!) Knowing you only have 4 days, and you need time to sleep as well, you will need to play off speed vs thoroughness.
Interesting ... what do you think?
The link to the entire post is here
I really think the poster above is on to a good idea. I know, in this adventure, there are a lot of things to find in most areas. I need to think about what we are doing in that context. Like you said in your OOC in the gameplay thread, terrible perception rolls suck(and by the way, the forum roller hates me too!).
I am gonna noodle a bit. I am thinking to use the "time constraints" in conjunction with the checking around for things, I think.
Have you had a particular past experience you like more than others?
Hmm, interesting concept for sure. I do agree that bad perception rolls can end up making the PC's miss things. I think for the most part my groups have always just rolled and if the roll was bad, we moved on never knowing if we missed a secret or not. Sometimes our GM would give us another shot at it or hint at something worth noting being in that area.
OK ... I know I am not giving you enough time to respond >:), but I am thinking that we could allow you to choose to search an area in detail, square by square. Instead of 2 minutes per square (which is 20x6s=120s), I could drop it to one minute per square. So, for example, your room would take 8 minutes to do a good search. Perception roll in that case is +5 extra bonus. If you take a full two minutes per square, you get +10 extra bonus to perception check, so most likely going to find everything that way.
The cost is time. For example, the Courtyard you are in right now would take 60 minutes at 1 minute per square, and 120 minutes at 2 minutes. Spending that much time anywhere also increases the chances of having a random encounter that could cost more time (especially if you are somewhere that you are not supposed to be!) Knowing you only have 4 days, and you need time to sleep as well, you will need to play off speed vs thoroughness.
Interesting ... what do you think?
I think since you are GM, I am totally fine with whatever you want to try. Trying out different methods is never a bad thing and at the end we will both have learned a little bit more on what works and does not work in PBP. So, lets roll with this. Seems to me this method will work best with you rolling for me? So I let you know that I want to actually spend some time searching an area and then since you know the size, time it will take and the bonus modifier, I'll just let you roll it to avoid back and forth. The other idea I guess would be like you could lay out the options when I come into a room in an DM note spoiler detailing the size of the room in squares and then I can take it from there based on the amount of time I have etc. I'll let you decide.
Also, as a side note, I totally do not mind pausing the game to work out kinks like this. I am enjoying this game and the process.
You have seen the maps I posted, right? Link is in the campaign header. We can both see the room sizes that way. I agree that it makes as much sense as anything for me to do the rolling once you indicate how you want to approach the room, hallway, etc. Let's give this a go for a bit, and if it doesn't work, then we can switch it up later. That's one of the nice things about having just two people.
Oh no, I had no clue that link was there.
Alright man, sounds good.
EDIT: As far as my last game post goes, should I just edit a new roll into it or wait for you to roll a timed search of the courtyard for me?
It's 11am. One hour before the gambling starts. Sixty minutes of searching gets you the +5 to your Perception roll. Just enough time before you have to gamble. Or you can do something else for the hour. I like tradeoffs :)
Let me know what you'd like to do in game play thread :)
Cool. I'll do the 60 min for +5 then.
Hey Adaram, I'm gonna do some reading through other pbp games and such on the forums but I was wondering if you have any useful tips or suggestions on how I can better flush out my posts? I'd like to start adding more detail, getting into more colorful depth and flushing out my character a bit better.
I am new as well, so definitely no expert! My goal is to try and have a lot of fun with the characters. Make them quirky and random. Rather than setting everything up in advance, let them grow and change. I think, from what I have seen thus far, your character is definitely on the right track and you're doing a good job!
How are you enjoying the adventure thus far? I am always willing to hear (and hopeful for) both positive and negative feedback.
Alright, thanks.
I am definitely enjoying it. Loving the one on one experience for sure. Its really nice not having to rely on other people posting and then waiting half a week or whatever for things to keep going. Seems like we are on a decent back and forth roll, thus keeping things fresh and interesting. I am learning lots and its a safe place to try things out or make mistakes etc so I really appreciate that. Though I do have a basic level of experience with such things, I would say you are doing a great job as GM thus far.
One thing in particular that stood out to me was the level of detail you actually went into for my char sheet. I know with a full group its prob really annoying to have to check everyones stats and make sure everything looks good so I can understand when other GM's dont. But yeah, the fact that you actually looked at my sheet and found mistakes I made shows me that you are invested into our game.
Anyhoo, keep the great work.
Perfect. I am enjoying the learning process as much as you. When this one is done, there are several more at higher Rogue levels that we can do as follow-on's, if you want. I agree whole heartedly that one on one is really nice from the perspective that we are not waiting for others; so things are moving along at a good pace.
They would actually be moving faster, except for the fact that I am having to prepare all the stuff to stay one step ahead of you (which I enjoy - it just takes time).
When this one is done, there are several more at higher Rogue levels that we can do as follow-on's, if you want.
Sweet! I'm down for that.
They would actually be moving faster, except for the fact that I am having to prepare all the stuff to stay one step ahead of you (which I enjoy - it just takes time).
Ah yes, I know exactly what you mean. Heh. No worries, I consider the amount that we have been posting an added bonus.
Just letting you know, I have had an unusually busy day at work (and then worked at home again tonight). I am also at a point where I have quite a chunk of prep work for your next step. I am slightly hopeful that I will get something done tonight, but not sure I will get there.
Alright no problem.
I really enjoyed your post. I have had another hellish day but am determined to get the next scene posted later tonight. Here's hoping and sorry for being unresponsive the last few days
Thanks!
No probs man, the clear communication is much appreciated. No pressure.
Found some spelling mistakes and grammatical errors with my last gameplay post but cannot edit after a certain amount of time I guess. So unfortunately our story will just have to live with them. Lesson learned. xD
Ha! It happens ... I just ca;; them typos :)
Oh almost forgot about the perception check you asked me to roll for just after Lord Kent was shooing the air above his head. I rolled a 22, does that reveal anything?
Oh sorry about that ... I missed that as well. You saw a small winged creature fly quickly into a dark corner of the rafters.
Oooh, interesting!
I am having so much fun! This latest set of circumstances has me modifying the pre-made adventure slightly - going off script. If it works out, it's actually going to be a hook into a follow on adventure based on this one!
Thanks for doing this with me!
Glad to hear it! I am having a ton of fun as well! Finally feels like I am getting some solid PBP experience in and getting some good practice with getting into character. I am finding I actually enjoy PBP quite a bit more than tabletop. Its nice to have the time to plan things out, flush out the interactions better and just in general not be put on the spot when it comes to roleplaying the character.
Oh nice, I love it when things go "off script".
Absolutely, and thanks for DM'ing!