We had this come up at the table after our tonight, as everyone was leveling up their characters.
The basic question is, can feats such as Point Blank Shot be used with spells? In particular, ray weapons?
This question has probably arisen since our group made the switch from D&D 3.5 to Pathfinder a couple months ago, and in D&D there was a statement made (somewhere) that these feats could, in fact, be used with "weapon-like spells". I am unable to find such a statement (either for or against) in the Pathfinder books, leading me to believe that they cannot be used in this way.
However, I've seen several places where the rules state certain spells (rays in particular) are treated "like a weapon" (for instance, the ability to crit).
Unable to find a definitive answer in the books, I turn to you. Any official word on this? A book and page reference would be most helpful!
Thanks,
Taffer
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Absolutely it can be used. Point Blank gives you +1 on attack and damage rolls within 30ft. It's a ranged attack, so you get the bonus. Makes sense to me.
you can, but you must also remember that shooting into melee without precise shot is a -4, so if they get point blank, theyll need precise shot as well.
also keep in mind that if something/someone (allies included) are in the way of their shot which can be considered cover, and your caster doesnt have improved precise shot, thats another -4. combined with shooting into melee thats a -8.
Also, bard's Inspire Courage affects rays too.
in D&D there was a statement made (somewhere) that these feats could, in fact, be used with "weapon-like spells". I am unable to find such a statement (either for or against) in the Pathfinder books, leading me to believe that they cannot be used in this way.
The quote you're looking for isn't there because it isn't necessary. That's just one instance of 3.5 players confusing the rules between editions. If you approached the game without ever having played 3.x, it would probably be a lot easier to accept something without a particular caveat that you remembered from before.
OK so Inspire Courage, Prayer and Point Blank Shot can give you a bonus on attack rolls with rays and bombs, I think we all agree with that. What I'm wondering is if rays and bombs can also benefit from the bonus on damage rolls.
You take all the good with the bad mind you. Point blank shot applies, but you also need Precise Shot to fire into melee without penalty.
The difference between a ranged weapon that fires ammo and a weapon like spell such as a ray is: an arrow is subject to wind, air pockets, flaws in their creation (bent shafts, nocked arrowheads, etc) that can cause a missle to act differently than intended when released. A ray is not subject to any of this. You point, it fires, completely true and directly to the object pointed. As such, the only factor is WHERE your finger is pointed, hence the attack roll. A feat like point blank shot COULD apply, saying that you know how to point your finger better, but I would hesitate to add a damage, since, unlike an arrow, it doesn't slow down with range, but the +1 to hit would still be viable. Precise shot... this is a toss up to discuss with the DM, since making every single spellcaster in the game require this feat to shoot into melee and taking up one of the precious few feats spellcasters get seems unbalanced in favor for the DM. A -4 to rays would make spellcasters never take ray spells, since lines, cones and bursts would be better with the shape spell feat.
tl;dr - +1 to hit with rays with Point Blank is a go, +1 damage not so much, and precise shot shouldn't be necessary.
From Point Blank Shot:
Benefit: You get a +1 bonus on attack and damage rolls with ranged weapons at ranges of up to 30 feet.A spell is not a weapon. If the feat said "...with ranged attacks", then you could apply this feat to spells. It doesn't, so you can't, neither for hit nor damage.
Except rays are specifically called out as being weapons and there's the FAQ here.
Also this topic is two and a half years old. Why resurrect it for something that's been FAQ'd?
You take all the good with the bad mind you. Point blank shot applies, but you also need Precise Shot to fire into melee without penalty.
Not only that. Don't use rays while levitating. They ARE weapon attacks after all.
A levitating creature that attacks with a melee or ranged weapon finds itself increasingly unstable; the first attack has a –1 penalty on attack rolls, the second –2, and so on, to a maximum penalty of –5. A full round spent stabilizing allows the creature to begin again at –1.
Thanks for the clarification. Everyone else just seemed to be saying "yes" without any justification.
I didn't see that it was old. It showed up on the front page. I blame Kyaaadaa. :)
Go ahead, I'm necrotrolling hardcore :3