Does Vasodilation skill feat remove the need for a free hand when using Battle Medicin?


Rules Discussion

Grand Lodge

Vasodilation
Skill Feat level 2
This Feat may contain spoilers from the Shades of Blood Adventure Path
Uncommon General Skill
Source Pathfinder #213: Thirst for Blood pg. 84

Prerequisites trained in Medicine
Using the power of your own blood, you encourage increased blood flow to nourish damaged tissue or stifle the flow to clot wounds or prevent the spread of poison and disease. You no longer require a healer’s toolkit to Administer First Aid, Treat Disease, Treat Poison, or Treat Wounds, though you take 1 damage each time you take one of these actions without the proper tools from the expenditure of your blood. You can’t reduce or prevent this damage.

You gain a +1 item bonus when performing these actions using your blood, which increases to +2 if you’re a master in Medicine and +3 if you’re legendary.

So vasodilation removes the need for a healer's toolkit by using the power of your own blood. It does not state that you need to put your blood on the recipient or that you need to bleed, only that you take 1 damage when not using the proper tools (a healers toolkit?) "from the expenditure of your blood".
Vasodilation does not remove the manipulate trait from Battle Medicin, but if you don't need to use any items, it could just be covered with gestures?
Like somatic components in spells?

And I'm not completely sure that Vasodilation works with Battle Medicin.

Are there any official rulings?
What are your thoughts?

Liberty's Edge

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Since Battle Medicine is not mentioned, the feat does not apply to it.


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Yep, it's not compatible with Battle Medicine.
Otherwise, I don't see anything about Manipulate actions, so it shouldn't remove the need for a free hand.

Overall, it's rather bad for a feat...

Grand Lodge

Thanks for the replies.
I agree the feat doesn’t seem worth much then.
It would have been cool and thematic on my Sekmet Champion.

SuperBidi: The manipulate action does not require a free hand unless you need to manipulate fx the tool kit.
Like the example with somatic trait in spells.
But without any official ruling on this, it will be a GM call.


*Khan* wrote:

SuperBidi: The manipulate action does not require a free hand unless you need to manipulate fx the tool kit.

Like the example with somatic trait in spells.
But without any official ruling on this, it will be a GM call.

True. The issue of Manipulate actions is how you visualise the action. If the GM considers that you need your hand to "touch" the wound or something like that then it keeps a need for a free hand, otherwise it loses it as you no more need the tools. You should check with your GM.


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SuperBidi wrote:
True. The issue of Manipulate actions is how you visualise the action. If the GM considers that you need your hand to "touch" the wound or something like that then it keeps a need for a free hand, otherwise it loses it as you no more need the tools. You should check with your GM.

This isn't correct RAW; the manipulate trait and the need for a free hand are two entirely separate stipulations that are explicitly stated when they apply. Even in the case where touch is involved, as with touch spells, you do not explicitly need a free hand, and the assumption is that you can do whatever you need to do using a hand that could be holding something else. There are certainly many ways to visualize this, including briefly letting go of an object and catching it as you complete the manipulate action, but unless a free hand is specified, you do not require it even when performing a manipulate action.

As for the feat itself, I definitely agree that removing the need for tools isn't terribly exciting. More interesting, however, is the scaling item bonus it provides: although you can obtain marvelous medicines to get that bonus without the need to Invest, the items that provide a +2 bonus are 10th-level at the lowest, and at minimum 17th-level for a +3 bonus. Because the above lets you gain a +2 item bonus at level 7 and a +3 bonus at level 15, you can get that bonus a fair bit earlier if you're committing your skill increases to Medicine sooner. Past a certain point, though, you would still likely want to train out of that feat.


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Teridax wrote:
This isn't correct RAW; the manipulate trait and the need for a free hand are two entirely separate stipulations that are explicitly stated when they apply.

You're right, I've mixed up Interact and Manipulate. Then, yes, I agree that it removes the need of a free hand.

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