Melanodaemon Consumptive Aura Fatigue and Exhaustion

[John John]

Here is this friendly Jackal
https://www.aonprd.com/MonsterDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Meladaemon
I haven't found in the net a clear answer for this so here it goes:

"Every round a creature begins its turn within this aura, it must succeed at a DC 22 Fortitude save or take 1d6 nonlethal damage and become fatigued from extreme hunger."

The effect doesn't say you become immune to it after saving successfully for 24 hours. So lets say you fail 3 times.
1st time you become fatigued, 2nd time you become exhausted and 3rd time you become unconscious?

[Toshy]

Not quiet if you take a look at the conditions:

1st failed save
=> Fatigued
A fatigued character can neither run nor charge and takes a –2 penalty to Strength and Dexterity. Doing anything that would normally cause fatigue causes the fatigued character to become exhausted. After 8 hours of complete rest, fatigued characters are no longer fatigued.

2nd failed save
=> Exhausted
An exhausted character moves at half speed, cannot run or charge, and takes a –6 penalty to Strength and Dexterity. After 1 hour of complete rest, an exhausted character becomes fatigued. A fatigued character becomes exhausted by doing something else that would normally cause fatigue.

3rd failed save
=> still exhausted, as nothing in the exhausted conditions says it prigresses to unconscious if you get more fatigued.

[John John]

Toshy wrote:

Not quiet if you take a look at the conditions:

1st failed save
=> Fatigued
A fatigued character can neither run nor charge and takes a –2 penalty to Strength and Dexterity. Doing anything that would normally cause fatigue causes the fatigued character to become exhausted. After 8 hours of complete rest, fatigued characters are no longer fatigued.

2nd failed save
=> Exhausted
An exhausted character moves at half speed, cannot run or charge, and takes a –6 penalty to Strength and Dexterity. After 1 hour of complete rest, an exhausted character becomes fatigued. A fatigued character becomes exhausted by doing something else that would normally cause fatigue.

3rd failed save
=> still exhausted, as nothing in the exhausted conditions says it prigresses to unconscious if you get more fatigued.

Perfect, thanks for answering.

[Mysterious Stranger]

Consumptive Aura does not say anything about what happens if you fail the save for the second time. Usually if an ability causes progression of some sort, it is specifically stated in the ability. The fatigued condition also states that the fatigued character has to do something that would normally cause fatigue. The question is does being in the aura count as doing something?

[I grok do u]

One option to interpret this is that the reference to the damage and fatigue as from extreme starvation means we can look at the starvation rules which state that creatures just continue to take nonlethal damage until it equals HP, then lethal damage. So, 2nd fail would be exhausted, assuming they didn't remove the fatigued condition before failing again.

Exhausted character just takes the penalties and 1d6 nonlethal, as if another day of starvation occurred (without the time to rest and remove any conditions).

Mysterious Stranger wrote:

Consumptive Aura does not say anything about what happens if you fail the save for the second time. Usually if an ability causes progression of some sort, it is specifically stated in the ability. The fatigued condition also states that the fatigued character has to do something that would normally cause fatigue. The question is does being in the aura count as doing something?

Since the aura affects as "extreme starvation," I would say it does advance. Usually, starvation leaves creatures fatigued and doesn't automatically cause exhaustion because of the assumption creatures are resting between days. If they are fatigued and take the nonlethal damage (fail the save), then they progress to exhausted.

The most common progression I see in spells is with fear effects, which usually specify when progression does not advance to next level rather than when it does. So, lack of specification here does not necessarily imply it doesn't advance - rather it is likely that standard progression rules do apply.

The question I then see raised by the ability is whether the clause in starvation applies: that this nonlethal damage can NOT be healed by any means but by eating food.

Of course, we can of course take the extreme hunger phrase as just flavor fluff.

[Azothath]

the RAW answer is "No" because it does not say that it does.
Consumptive Aura (Su) A meladaemon radiates an aura of hunger to a radius of 20 feet. Every round a creature begins its turn within this aura, it must succeed at a DC 22 Fortitude save or take 1d6 nonlethal damage and become fatigued from extreme hunger. Creatures that do not need to eat are immune to this effect. The save DC is Constitution-based.
Hunger (Su) A meladaemon’s claw attack deals an additional 1d6 points of nonlethal damage as it causes sudden pangs of horrific hunger in its foe. Creatures that do not need to eat are immune to this effect.
A Ring of Sustenance [ring] $2500, Ioun Stone Clear Flawed Spindle $2000, or Clear Spindle $4000 provides effective immunity.

For those seeking thematic reasons, in the Description Meladaemons delight in the slow death of starvation, going so far as to experiment with various bodily deficiencies and mortal weaknesses. so they wait for the starvation rules(see above) to kick in...

= = =
ADVICE
IF you want to create a bigger threat and heighten drama then sure, round by round let it progress with each failed save but then it should lessen with a success. You should also let the condition fade 1d4+HD rounds after leaving the aura or after consuming a meal.
Know-Planes info: It should be vulnerable to spells like Heroes Feast:C6 which would lower its DR for 6 rounds and have an aversion to butter...