(Re) Building the Untamed Form warrior

[The Raven Black]

Some time ago, I decided that my next PFS PC would be that high-powered Wild Shaped Fighter I read about on the boards.

But the errata to Martial Artist made that build moot.

So I plan to rebuild my level 7 Human Fighter MC Druid completely if need be to become the best Untamed Form warrior she can be.

I consider that only Status and Circumstance bonuses can add to the Battle Form's damage.

And I plan to use Form Control to avoid wasting 2 actions changing shape on my first turn.

Which would be the best way to build for this ?

[pauljathome]

Personally, I'd definitely go monk instead of fighter. Flurry of blows rocks. And they both have the same expert proficiency with their unarmed attacks.

Then discuss with your GM how many (if any) monk abilities like Gorilla Stance work while wild shaped

[John R.]

I just started a similar build (fighter with druid) using unlimited free archetype. I'm only level 6 and I've only played 2 or 3 sessions so a lot of this is still theory but....

My main takeaway is that you're suffering lowered AC for increased reach and improved movement and senses. I doubt the temp hp is going to make up for loss in AC.

Later you can get Rip and Tear or heightened untamed shift can help add some persistent damage, 2 types if you take Insect Shape while keeping a good AC.

Spell slots will probably be able to add more utility when needed, maybe ranged cantrips if you can't manage to fly. If you have adequate time before a fight, there's plenty of options to buff yourself beforehand. Enlarge lasts 5 minutes so that's fairly easy for a pre-buff. Resist energy and mountain resilience also have long enough durations so you can save them for a big fight for the day while ensuring they last throughout the fight but also not spend much if any actions during the fight on casting them.

Fighter is nice because you get to use most of your feats in untamed form still. I looked at monk as well and was really heavily considering it. If monk is quickened while not polymorphed, they can do something like Flurry of Blows, stride a long distance or just strike again or use a maneuever and then cast something like electric arc. It really came down to action economy and higher defenses (mountain stance) versus accuracy, MAP reduction and what I find to be more interesting feats, most of which only mattered while NOT polymorphed.

[The Raven Black]

I was thinking of using either a Champion or an Exemplar for the basis.

Champion's Strikes are Holy and the Smite feat gives a nice status bonus to damage, and of course there is the reaction.

Exemplar's abilities are not spells and can thus be used even in Battle Form.

[pauljathome]

Given that Exemplars abilities all come from items I’d expect considerable table variation on what is and is not allowed. Definitely in the “check with your GM” category

[The Raven Black]

pauljathome wrote:

Given that Exemplars abilities all come from items I’d expect considerable table variation on what is and is not allowed. Definitely in the “check with your GM” category

Abilities of Weapon Ikons would work when the Ikon mentions Unarmed Attacks, like Gleaming Blade or Hands of the Wilding do. Those that do not mention Unarmed Attacks but Weapon, like Barrow's Edge, would not.

Body Ikons are not items, so they should work.

Worn Ikons are indeed items but the Immanence fits the "constant abilities of your gear still function" rule and the Transcendence is not activating an item, so does not break the "you can't activate any items." rule.

[HammerJack]

Things like Hands of the Wildling are still applied to a specific unarmed attack not all unarmed attacks. And whether an unarmed attack that you don't permanently have (like one from a form) can be selected is a point of table variation. I've even seen variation on whether a stance-granted attack is legal.

I don't think it's ideal for a character that will need to deal with different GM's understandings of the rules. I would save that for a game where you always have the same GM and can confirm that they share your reading.

[The Raven Black]

HammerJack wrote:

Things like Hands of the Wildling are still applied to a specific unarmed attack not all unarmed attacks. And whether an unarmed attack that you don't permanently have (like one from a form) can be selected is a point of table variation. I've even seen variation on whether a stance-granted attack is legal.

I don't think it's ideal for a character that will need to deal with different GM's understandings of the rules. I would save that for a game where you always have the same GM and can confirm that they share your reading.

Thank you for the info. This is a great point.

[pauljathome]

The Raven Black wrote:

pauljathome wrote:

Given that Exemplars abilities all come from items I’d expect considerable table variation on what is and is not allowed. Definitely in the “check with your GM” category

Abilities of Weapon Ikons would work when the Ikon mentions Unarmed Attacks, like Gleaming Blade or Hands of the Wilding do. Those that do not mention Unarmed Attacks but Weapon, like Barrow's Edge, would not.

Body Ikons are not items, so they should work.

Worn Ikons are indeed items but the Immanence fits the "constant abilities of your gear still function" rule and the Transcendence is not activating an item, so does not break the "you can't activate any items." rule.

I wouldn't expect universal agreement on the above by all GMs. I'm not at all sure that I'd rule that way (haven't given it any thought but it is hitting my "That sounds dodgy" button).

Note that my responsse to "But the rules clearly say ...." would be to just cut and paste the above paragraph. Many GMs do not follow what YOU (or I, not trying to be personal) think are RAW.