Would the ability 'Break Curse' fit 'Fortunate Relief' well enough that you would be able to roll twice?
I can see this going multiple ways.
Yes, 'Break Curse' is a healing effect with a counteract check. (RAI?)
Yes, 'Break Curse' is a spell like ability healing effect with a counteract check. (RAW? but i guess SLAs don't have a rules entry in 2e)
No, 'Break Curse' is not a spell. (RAW)
Break Curse
Fortunate Relief
I would be interested to see some more viewpoints on this matter.
Correct that 'spell-like' isn't really a thing in PF2. Innate spells are. Effects with the Magical trait are. Kineticist Impulses even borrow rules from spells but still aren't 'spell-like'.
So yes, from a RAW perspective, since Fortunate Relief triggers on casting a healing spell, it would only work with spells.
That said, I could definitely see allowing it by permissive GMs. It definitely feels on-theme.
jcheung wrote: No, 'Break Curse' is not a spell. (RAW) It's very clear.
Just cast spells. You are a 12th level cleric, at this point Cleanse Affliction has been removing curses for 5 levels.
Fortunate Relief helps prevent wasting a high-level slot in the event that it's relevant. Curse Breaker gives you a slow alternative to preparing a high-level spell. Them not stacking is probably also intentional, because they're both ways to address the same issue.
Errenor wrote: jcheung wrote: No, 'Break Curse' is not a spell. (RAW) It's very clear.
Just cast spells. You are a 12th level cleric, at this point Cleanse Affliction has been removing curses for 5 levels. right... you know, why didn't i think of that. just cast spells. there's no restriction to cleanse affliction counteract when it comes to stuff that's higher rank than cleanse affliction. i definately want to tie up one of my two highest rank spell slots each day to deal with curses when i'm legendary in religion. i certainly want to rely on critically succeeding on a single roll when i'm surrounded by enemies later on and dealing with effects from higher level enemies.
jcheung wrote: i certainly want to rely on critically succeeding on a single roll when i'm surrounded by enemies later on and dealing with effects from higher level enemies. Break Curse is an exploration activity which requires 8 hours. Even if you allow Fortunate Relief to affect it (and for the record, I agree with the other posters that RAW it doesn't), it's not going to be a viable alternative to a spell in a situation where you are surrounded with/dealing with enemies.
Also, it's counteract rank is 1/2 level round up. So if the issue is a higher ranked curse cast by a high level enemy, you're "relying on critically succeeding on a single roll" with Break Curse exactly the same way you are with a spell. Only it took the party 8 hours of in-game time to find out if you succeeded.
Easl wrote: Break Curse is an exploration activity which requires 8 hours. Even if you allow Fortunate Relief to affect it (and for the record, I agree with the other posters that RAW it doesn't), it's not going to be a viable alternative to a spell in a situation where you are surrounded with/dealing with enemies.
Also, it's counteract rank is 1/2 level round up. So if the issue is a higher ranked curse cast by a high level enemy, you're "relying on critically succeeding on a single roll" with Break Curse exactly the same way you are with a spell. Only it took the party 8 hours of in-game time to find out if you succeeded.
10 minutes. it's a 10 minute exploration activity when legendary, which you can do in hostile territory so long as you're not in active combat. the difference between relying on cleanse affliction is i have to had planned to cast it out of my highest level slot to have the same effect, and i get one, maybe two uses a day. admittedly, when i mentioned critical success i was talking about second highest rank slots but didn't say that specifically. apologies for that part.
your point about it taking so much time when not legendary only makes more sense for RAI to allow it to effect break curse, since you're praying for 8 hours.
that said, the point of this thread isn't to debate the merit of using break curse vs cleanse affliction, but rather interaction between break curse and fortunate relief.
jcheung wrote: that said, the point of this thread isn't to debate the merit of using break curse vs cleanse affliction, but rather interaction between break curse and fortunate relief. Well then, as you yourself and everyone else points out, the RAW answer is no. Fortunate relief says "When you cast a healing spell..." The Break Curse feat is not a healing spell.
So...
Is it RAW? No.
Is it RAI? Hard to say, but my answer would be no.
Is it TGTBT? Probably not. Seems like a reasonable homebrew change to implement. But homebrew it would be.
jcheung wrote: Errenor wrote: jcheung wrote: No, 'Break Curse' is not a spell. (RAW) It's very clear.
Just cast spells. You are a 12th level cleric, at this point Cleanse Affliction has been removing curses for 5 levels. right... you know, why didn't i think of that. just cast spells. there's no restriction to cleanse affliction counteract when it comes to stuff that's higher rank than cleanse affliction. i definately want to tie up one of my two highest rank spell slots each day to deal with curses when i'm legendary in religion. i certainly want to rely on critically succeeding on a single roll when i'm surrounded by enemies later on and dealing with effects from higher level enemies. Why are you so wound up about not getting a bonus to resource-free (apart from time) infinitely repeatable activity without even cooldown? It makes it absolutely clear that you just want to game the system.
I see these 10 minutes and... the feat is crazy (even if a bit niche): in the end it allows removing curses almost infinite times per day for free. With skill proficiency, so you can get master and legendary earlier than with spells (master at 7th level instead of 15th!!!). With item bonuses! No, there's no way in hell Fortunate Relief applies only to spells unintentionally. I would never allow it to apply to skill actions. That's RAW and absolutely justified.
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