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Ok so uh....i'm not gonna dive too deep into this concept or why im doing this. You all know arshea, what their followers are like, what this would imply and why you will likely never see this character in an actual game.
That said, I was kind of thinking of a character that is something of a "Temple Guardian" or Bouncer of the various places of worship that arshean's would reside keeping things orderly while their fellow worshipers did their thing and would be there just in case outsiders got a bit too..."Rowdy" if you catch my drift.
So. Which one of these would be better suited for this?
I've been playing around with the dandy ranger for a while, but the more I thought about it the more I realized the paladin might actually work. It would kind of be like playing as a paladin of shelyn but on crack.
Arshea is neutral good so can have regular paladins. I’d be tempted to consider a virtuous bravo paladin. A chosen one paladin could be hilarious if you wanted to go that way. “Your familiar told you to do what?”
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Arshea is neutral good so can have regular paladins. I’d be tempted to consider a virtuous bravo paladin. A chosen one paladin could be hilarious if you wanted to go that way. “Your familiar told you to do what?”
Yeah i could, but a lawful good follower of a god like arshea you would think a lawful person would be a touch more prudish...but then again Lymnieris exist and he's lawful good so what do i know?
Good characters and creatures protect innocent life.
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Good implies altruism, respect for life, and a concern for the dignity of sentient beings. Good characters make personal sacrifices to help others.
Lawful characters tell the truth, keep their word, respect authority, honor tradition, and judge those who fall short of their duties.
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Law implies honor, trustworthiness, obedience to authority, and reliability. On the downside, lawfulness can include closed-mindedness, reactionary adherence to tradition, self-righteousness, and a lack of adaptability.
A lawful good character acts as a good person is expected or required to act. She combines a commitment to oppose evil with the discipline to fight relentlessly. She tells the truth, keeps her word, helps those in need, and speaks out against injustice. A lawful good character hates to see the guilty go unpunished.
Lawful good combines honor with compassion.
Now, looking at the Church of Arshea section:
Arshea is worshipped by artisans, courtesans, some fey, and those seeking to escape repression.
I imagine Paladins of Arshea would focus on protecting such people, and in combatting those who would hurt and oppress them, first and foremost.
They eschew gender roles and often dress and behave as members of the opposite sex (or another gender role in societies with multiple gender roles) for a period of time ranging from months to decades, which they consider the best way to overcome repression and understand freedom, choosing the most fitting gender after this period of pilgrimage.
I imagine Paladins of Arshea do not do the above on a "does it feel right" basis, but--and this might seem counter-intuitive--as part of a structured journey of empathy, enlightenment, and understanding.
Arshea teaches them to abandon constraining beliefs and practice free love and sexuality.
A Paladin of Arshea might not indulge in the freedom many worshippers of that empyreal lord cherish. They may very well be present merely to ensure the revels of the faithful are safe from outsiders. Worshippers of Arshea might pity their champions for not being able to join them, but at the same time they would be grateful for their discipline and sacrifice.
The Spirit of Abandon's temples are most likely found in artist's studios, burlesque parlors, and dance halls.
Paladins may very well prioritize protecting places that are temples first and foremost, rather than places that may serve as temples, but serve as places of business, etc.
Arshea's most devout followers endeavor to achieve sexual release daily (either solo or with partners), praise the beauty of the partners and self, and pray to Arshea while naked.
Paladins might do the same, but following a structured, ritual approach--maybe like tantric yogi.
So, “lawful” and “chaotic” are surprisingly vague in most cases. I wouldn’t call lawful good prudish by default, especially in Golarion, but you might want to check with the paladin code to see if any of that bothers.
To throw another option on the fire, why not inquisitor. It’s basically a mix of the paladin and ranger.
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Good characters and creatures protect innocent life.
...
Good implies altruism, respect for life, and a concern for the dignity of sentient beings. Good characters make personal sacrifices to help others.Lawful characters tell the truth, keep their word, respect authority, honor tradition, and judge those who fall short of their duties.
...
Law implies honor, trustworthiness, obedience to authority, and reliability. On the downside, lawfulness can include closed-mindedness, reactionary adherence to tradition, self-righteousness, and a lack of adaptability.A lawful good character acts as a good person is expected or required to act. She combines a commitment to oppose evil with the discipline to fight relentlessly. She tells the truth, keeps her word, helps those in need, and speaks out against injustice. A lawful good character hates to see the guilty go unpunished.
Lawful good combines honor with compassion.
Now, looking at the Church of Arshea section:
Arshea is worshipped by artisans, courtesans, some fey, and those seeking to escape repression.I imagine Paladins of Arshea would focus on protecting such people, and in combatting those who would hurt and oppress them, first and foremost.
They eschew gender roles and often dress and behave as members of the opposite sex (or another gender role in societies with multiple gender roles) for a period of time ranging from months to decades, which they consider the best way to overcome repression and understand freedom, choosing the most fitting gender after this period of pilgrimage.I imagine Paladins of Arshea do not do the above on a "does it feel right" basis, but--and this might seem counter-intuitive--as part of a structured journey of empathy, enlightenment, and understanding.
Arshea teaches them to abandon constraining beliefs and practice free love and sexuality.A Paladin of Arshea might not indulge in...
That's kinda why im considering grey paladin so they can have just that tiny bit of extra freedom to indulge in arshea's teachings.
So, “lawful” and “chaotic” are surprisingly vague in most cases. I wouldn’t call lawful good prudish by default, especially in Golarion, but you might want to check with the paladin code to see if any of that bothers.
Agreed! I originally included that "lawfulness can include" doesn't mean "will include," but I accidentally cut that out while editing. The absence of a Code of Conduct for Paladins of Arshea affords that much more room for creativity and interpretation.
That's kinda why im considering grey paladin so they can have just that tiny bit of extra freedom to indulge in arshea's teachings.
I, personally, tend to cleave closely to flavor text, and the Gray Knight's focuses on moral compromises in the name of necessity and a desire to keep a low profile, which "weakens her connection to the power that grants her paladin abilities." That makes me wonder whether being a Gray Knight of Arshea means having more freedom to be a worshipper of the Host of Delectation... or if it's more indicative of having to hide what she truly is from an oppressive, judgmental world.
At the end of the day, however, it's your character and your choice to shape the flavor of the Gray Knight as you see fit! :)
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So, “lawful” and “chaotic” are surprisingly vague in most cases. I wouldn’t call lawful good prudish by default, especially in Golarion, but you might want to check with the paladin code to see if any of that bothers.I originally included that "lawfulness can include" doesn't mean "will include," but I accidentally cut that out while editing.
That's kinda why im considering grey paladin so they can have just that tiny bit of extra freedom to indulge in arshea's teachings.I, personally, tend to cleave closely to flavor text, and the Gray Knight's focuses on moral compromises in the name of necessity and a desire to keep a low profile, which "weakens her connection to the power that grants her paladin abilities." That makes me wonder whether being a Gray Knight of Arshea means having more freedom to be a worshipper of the Host of Delectation... or if it's more indicative of having to hide what she truly is from an oppressive, judgmental world.
At the end of the day, however, it's your character and your choice to shape the flavor of the Gray Knight as you see fit! :)
Grey Paladin it is then.
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From what I can see most of Arshea’s focus is on artistic and sexual freedom. The fact that Arshea is neutral good and no chaotic good implies that Arshea is not advocating complete freedom and disregard of conventional behavior. There is no reason that a worshiper of Arshea could not be lawful. Such a follower would follow a code similar to Safe, Sane and Consensual. There is no reason at all they have to be the slightest bit prudish, and could even be a sadist. The sadist would only indulge with a willing partner preferably a masochist. Nothing in the Paladin’s code conflicts with the ideas of Arshea as long as the safe, sane, and consensual is followed.
I don’t see why the gray paladin archetype is needed.
I wouldn’t be surprised if Paladins were disproportionately prone to masochistic tendencies, given their outlook, the role they frequently take in combat, and their healing abilities. A sadistic Paladin, though, however well-intentioned, strikes me as a ticking time bomb—doubly so if the rank of Paladin confers rank, and thus involves a power dynamic.
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I wouldn’t be surprised if Paladins were disproportionately prone to masochistic tendencies, given their outlook, the role they frequently take in combat, and their healing abilities. A sadistic Paladin, though, however well-intentioned, strikes me as a ticking time bomb—doubly so if the rank of Paladin confers rank, and thus involves a power dynamic.
Yeah if anything that sounds closer to an antipaladin.
Why is it ok to be a masochist, but not a sadist? If there is nothing wrong with someone enjoying pain, then why would providing something that a person wants and in some cases needs be considered wrong? They are opposite sides of the same coin, one cannot be fulfilled without the other. That type of attitude seems to be exactly what Arshea is against.
All relationships involve a power dynamic, but not all of them are abusive. As long as all participants are truly willing there should not be a problem. A lawful good character is more likely to follow the rules in this respect than other alignments.
The idea that paladins probably tend towards masochistic tendencies is probably true, but that is not always going to be the case.
To be clear, I'm not trying to pass judgment on anyone. I'm offering an opinion on a general, hypothetical basis. I distinguish between masochism and sadism where Paladins are concerned because the former centers on being the recipient, whereas the latter is predicated on inflicting--and that will always strike me as more of a slippery slope.
More specifically, I imagine the former comes more naturally to a person that defines themselves on (among other things) sacrifice and enduring hardship and pain. Additionally, the former leaves the Paladin at someone else's mercy; in both cases the onus is on the Paladin to recognize when boundaries are being crossed, but only in one of those scenarios does their agency determine how much they themselves suffer.