Hi everyone,
I'm unsure about this rule point: Reloading a bow is part of the attack action. But reloading is supposed to be an Interact action. So, do reloading and firing a bow have the Interact trait? It's important if you are Grappled while shooting.
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What is the background question you really want to know?
Do you have to do a flat check?
Other problems resulting from interact?
That knowledge might help to get you the answer you truly want. I assume it is the flat check - but could be very wrong.
My guess is flat check or you lose the action, which here is the Strike.
I wonder if you still get MAP after losing a Strike.
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What is the background question you really want to know?
Do you have to do a flat check?
Other problems resulting from interact?
That knowledge might help to get you the answer you truly want. I assume it is the flat check - but could be very wrong.
My guess is flat check or you lose the action, which here is the Strike.
I wonder if you still get MAP after losing a Strike.
Agree with the flat check or lose action.
I would apply map. You are using the strike action, that has the Attack Trait, which in most cases, whether you use succeed or not.
And grabbed states that you spend the action prior to making the flat check.
You're held in place by another creature, giving you the flat-footed and immobilized conditions. If you attempt a manipulate action while grabbed, you must succeed at a DC 5 flat check or it is lost; roll the check after spending the action, but before any effects are applied.
The Reload 0 would say No. But the description of 1+ Hands sounds like Yes, even though it does not explicitly mention Interact actions.
I would say RAW No, but expect table variation.
In the end, apply the Too good/bad to be true rule.
I ended up at the same place: Per strict RAW, it looks like no, but it doesn't look like RAI.
Also, I strongly want a Grappled archer to take a penalty as I fail to see how you can use a bow while Grappled. So, the penalty is not big, but a 20% miss chance is the minimum you should have.
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@SuperBidi
Here you go:
Source Core Rulebook pg. 279 2.0
While all weapons need some amount of time to get into position, many ranged weapons also need to be loaded and reloaded. This entry indicates how many Interact actions it takes to reload such weapons. This can be 0 if drawing ammunition and firing the weapon are part of the same action. If an item takes 2 or more actions to reload, the GM determines whether they must be performed together as an activity, or you can spend some of those actions during one turn and the rest during your next turn.An item with an entry of “—” must be drawn to be thrown, which usually takes an Interact action just like drawing any other weapon. Reloading a ranged weapon and drawing a thrown weapon both require a free hand. Switching your grip to free a hand and then to place your hands in the grip necessary to wield the weapon are both included in the actions you spend to reload a weapon.
An action might allow you to use a simpler action—usually one of the Basic Actions on page 469—in a different circumstance or with different effects. This subordinate action still has its normal traits and effects, but is modified in any ways listed in the larger action. For example, an activity that tells you to Stride up to half your Speed alters the normal distance you can move in a Stride. The Stride would still have the move trait, would still trigger reactions that occur based on movement, and so on. The subordinate action doesn’t gain any of the traits of the larger action unless specified. The action that allows you to use a subordinate action doesn’t require you to spend more actions or reactions to do so; that cost is already factored in.
Using an activity is not the same as using any of its subordinate actions. For example, the quickened condition you get from the haste spell lets you spend an extra action each turn to Stride or Strike, but you couldn’t use the extra action for an activity that includes a Stride or Strike. As another example, if you used an action that specified, “If the next action you use is a Strike,” an activity that includes a Strike wouldn’t count, because the next thing you are doing is starting an activity, not using the Strike basic action.
So reload 0 means you do 2 actions in one (draw arrow and shoot). This doesn't add to the action count - just a single action - but you still would have the manipulate trait as part of drawing.
And grappled means you still need a flat check if you have manipulate as a trait at some stage during your action.
It is a bit ambiguous since making 0 interact actions to reload could be seen as not making any interact actions and therefore it isn't a subordinate action of the Strike.
But that seems too good to be true. You still have to reload the bow. It just costs 0 actions to do it. But it does still become a subordinate action of the Strike with a bow.
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It is a bit ambiguous since making 0 interact actions to reload could be seen as not making any interact actions and therefore it isn't a subordinate action of the Strike.
But that seems too good to be true. You still have to reload the bow. It just costs 0 actions to do it. But it does still become a subordinate action of the Strike with a bow.
See my quote of the CRB - 0 means it is ‚part of the same action‘ not that it is zero actions. It spells it out as part of the overall action.
But it's still zero interact actions.
The problem is that "drawing ammunition" is not a defined action. As such, it doesn't carry any traits to firing.
It is implied that drawing ammunition is an Interact action, but not stated.
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I think it's the point of having ammunitions under the "weapon" table.
Ammunitions are considered weapons under the ammunition category, so if drawing a weapon under the "simple weapon" category requires an interact action, so would do drawing a "weapon" part of the ammunition category.
Ammunitions are not considered weapon. They have been put in this table for ease of use.
But you're right that "drawing an item", whatever the item, is an Interact action. So it solves the issue: Drawing an ammunition is an Interact action!|
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I think it's the point of having ammunitions under the "weapon" table.
Ammunitions are considered weapons under the ammunition category, so if drawing a weapon under the "simple weapon" category requires an interact action, so would do drawing a "weapon" part of the ammunition category.
Ammunitions are not considered weapon. They have been put in this table for ease of use.
But you're right that "drawing an item", whatever the item, is an Interact action. So it solves the issue: Drawing an ammunition is an Interact action!
There is also:
Manipulate
Source Core Rulebook pg. 633 2.0
You must physically manipulate an item or make gestures to use an action with this trait. Creatures without a suitable appendage can’t perform actions with this trait. Manipulate actions often trigger reactions.
This is reinforced by the notion of 1+ - the + being the free hand you use to draw the arrow.